Unilateral BA Flight Change

[smiliemonster]

We have been advised our BA flight from LHR to ATH has changed time and will now depart 1h 20min later. Unfortunately that means we will now arrive in the early hours of the morning. Of course we will get to our destination, so it's not the end of the world, but....

The problem I have is that BA are still running a flight at the exact time I originally booked. They've just given it another flight number. I called up and asked to be put back on the flight at the time I booked and was told it will cost an additional $800 . And since the change was considered minor to them (i.e. less than 2hrs), their system automatically accepts the variance on the traveller's behalf.

The flight's not until later next year so the chances are they'll change it several times between now and then. I've not encountered this kind of bait and switch before. In all other instances where airlines have change my flights over the decades (including BA), they reaccommodate you if the change is unacceptable. Apparently that's not the case any more, or perhaps they are just enforcing a long held policy? Any suggestions? It's a J flight booked directly with BA.

 

[SYD]

Yes, a PITA. I have a flight in a few weeks (BUD to LHR) that was rescheduled to leave much later than expected. A manual change online would be £££s and £££s!

However, if it’s any consolation, BA have a free “on the day / 24 hr” fee free change option for non-lite fares. Basically, go online at midnight UK time and try and change your flight (for free)….

If I have success, I’ll report back. If you don’t hear back from me by NYE, I’ve probably forgotten so ping me!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

We have been advised our BA flight from LHR to ATH has changed time and will now depart 1h 20min later. Unfortunately that means we will now arrive in the early hours of the morning. Of course we will get to our destination, so it's not the end of the world, but....

The problem I have is that BA are still running a flight at the exact time I originally booked. They've just given it another flight number. I called up and asked to be put back on the flight at the time I booked and was told it will cost an additional $800 . And since the change was considered minor to them (i.e. less than 2hrs), their system automatically accepts the variance on the traveller's behalf.

The flight's not until later next year so the chances are they'll change it several times between now and then. I've not encountered this kind of bait and switch before. In all other instances where airlines have change my flights over the decades (including BA), they reaccommodate you if the change is unacceptable. Apparently that's not the case any more, or perhaps they are just enforcing a long held policy? Any suggestions? It's a J flight booked directly with BA.

Hang up and call again? Or email/chat. Just ask to be reinstated on the flight leaving at ‘x’ time.

 

[SYD]

Hang up and call again? Or email/chat. Just ask to be reinstated on the flight leaving at ‘x’ time.

I tried that.

BA is 2+ hr delay before they’ll change for free …

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I tried that.

BA is 2+ hr delay before they’ll change for free …

Yeah, I get that, but I’d be arguing that you don’t want to change, you want to be reinstated. There’s a difference.

While everyone seems to acknowledge the ‘2 hours = significant’… it’s not actually defined in the conditions of carriage. I dont see how a policy, unknown to passengers, can override the COC.

 

[smiliemonster]

Yeah, I get that, but I’d be arguing that you don’t want to change, you want to be reinstated. There’s a difference.

While everyone seems to acknowledge the ‘2 hours = significant’… it’s not actually defined in the conditions of carriage. I dont see how a policy, unknown to passengers, can override the COC.

This is my view too, but they wouldn't entertain the idea of doing anything due to this unpublished 2 hour rule. I've reviewed the conditions of carriage and fare rules and couldn't find it referenced anywhere either. Perhaps it's there and I'm just looking in the wrong place?

I'm totally baffled how this is legal. I can understand if the original flight was cancelled, but it's not. It's still running at the same time, on the same day, on the same aircraft type, from the same city, to the same airport. They have simply changed the flight number. It's totally bizarre

Post automatically merged: Dec 4, 2024

I tried that.

BA is 2+ hr delay before they’ll change for free …

@SYD - did you email or just call like I did?

 

[p--and--t]

QR did similar to me a couple years back for my multi segment QF OW Classic award J ticket.

They shifted me to a different flight leaving half a day later KUL-DOH will no other option because “the flight was cancelled”, which meant I would miss the subsequent flight DOH-CMN

They then sent an update moving me to the DOH-CMN flight a day later.

I went online and found the original KUL-DOH had not been cancelled, they had merely bumped me for some unknown reason.

Incensed that I was going to be a day late for my booked tour I got a bit animated and demanded they reinstate the original flights as they were pulling a swifty. (Which they did).

 

[smiliemonster]

Yeah, I get that, but I’d be arguing that you don’t want to change, you want to be reinstated. There’s a difference.

While everyone seems to acknowledge the ‘2 hours = significant’… it’s not actually defined in the conditions of carriage. I dont see how a policy, unknown to passengers, can override the COC.

As I noted above, I didn't have any luck with this approach on the phone so I've written, outlining the issue (again) as you suggested. Thank you; we'll see how it goes!

 

[smiliemonster]

QR did similar to me a couple years back for my multi segment QF OW Classic award J ticket.

They shifted me to a different flight leaving half a day later KUL-DOH will no other option because “the flight was cancelled”, which meant I would miss the subsequent flight DOH-CMN

They then sent an update moving me to the DOH-CMN flight a day later.

I went online and found the original KUL-DOH had not been cancelled, they had merely bumped me for some unknown reason.

Incensed that I was going to be a day late for my booked tour I got a bit animated and demanded they reinstate the original flights as they were pulling a swifty. (Which they did).

Glad to hear it worked out for you. It really does feel like a bait and switch situation which I assume is just as illegal in the UK as it is here in Australia. As in your case, if the flight was really cancelled, that's one thing, but if it's still running and they want more for the privilege of flying on it, it seems like a swifty for sure.

 

[SYD]

@SYD - did you email or just call like I did?

Called. The original flight wasn’t “cancelled”, just rescheduled. If it was AA or AS, you’d normally be able to rebook ANY alternate flight - many actually play the game and book flights more than 6mths out knowing it will most likely be rescheduled.

We booked our BA flight just to lock in a reasonable fare during the Xmas / New Year period over 6mths out. They rescheduled a few weeks later…

 

[clifford]

BA just changed a flight of mine from LHR to LJU in June by >2 hours but I had no alternative but to accept the change as it's the only flight of the day.

It really is a PITA to arrive somewhere late at night when you have transport and access to accommodation to arrange. But that's life (and BA).

 

[smiliemonster]

BA just changed a flight of mine from LHR to LJU in June by >2 hours but I had no alternative but to accept the change as it's the only flight of the day.

It really is a PITA to arrive somewhere late at night when you have transport and access to accommodation to arrange. But that's life (and BA).

Agreed, late arrivals are annoying, but in your case there's not much choice. I've certainly had my share of these flights too.

My irritation is the flight I booked is still running with no change to it whatsoever except the flight number. BA have simply used the number change to shuffle us onto a flight with the old number at a less desirable time. I've never seen passengers tied to a flight number before. Who knows - maybe I'll get lucky and they'll reallocate the flight number to a new destination altogether. The ultimate BA mystery flight!

 

[clifford]

I understand your pain, but I wonder why BA would do what they have done to you. What's in it for them?

Do you have any status with BA?

 

[smiliemonster]

I understand your pain, but I wonder why BA would do what they have done to you. What's in it for them?

Do you have any status with BA?

No I used to, but let it lapse in favour of other programs. I do still have an BAEC account where I collect Avios. The logic (or lack thereof) behind the whole scenario is totally baffling.

 

[kangarooflyer88]

Presumably one could be asked to be moved back to the original time and simply send the bill back to BA for reimbursement as under Article 19 of the Montreal Convention (which covers disruptions such as these) carriers are in the hook for up to $7,000 USD in damages due to disruptions like these

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Presumably one could be asked to be moved back to the original time and simply send the bill back to BA for reimbursement as under Article 19 of the Montreal Convention (which covers disruptions such as these) carriers are in the hook for up to $7,000 USD in damages due to disruptions like these

The passenger’s ticket is now for the later flight. On what basis are they going to claim MC99? Not even EC/UK261 would cover this.

Changing to the earlier flight and sending the bill for $800 to BA will almost certainly fail.

 

[kangarooflyer88]

The passenger’s ticket is now for the later flight. On what basis are they going to claim MC99? Not even EC/UK261 would cover this.

The airline delayed the passenger's departure by at least 2 hours by the poster's own claim. So there is no question that damages stemming from such delays represent something that a passenger can claim under MC99 unless the carrier

proves that it and its servants and agents took all measures that could reasonably be required to avoid the damage or that it was impossible for it or them to take such measures

Well the poster already indicated that BA has the same flight departing at approximately the same time as they had originally booked, yet BA was unwilling to rebook them onto that (to minimize their damage) unless they paid a ransom. So a claim could be made that you paid the ransom to force BA to follow its obligations under MC99 to minimize damages caused by the carrier.

Another interesting theory to try would be that of EU261 as it could be argued that you were denied boarding by BA. You held a flight at a particular time but then they booted you off that flight and put you on a later flight. In which case one would be entitled to compensation irrespective of how much they were delayed.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The passenger has ‘accepted’ the new flight time (albeit accepted for them). There is no delay. Flight times do not form part of the contract.

Neither will EC/UK261 apply. They require you to hold a valid reservation for the affected flight. The OP does not as the new flight has been confirmed.

 

[kangarooflyer88]

The passenger has ‘accepted’ the new flight time (albeit accepted for them). There is no delay. Flight times do not form part of the contract.

In many jurisdictions, it is the passenger not the airline who gets to choose what to do when a flight disruption occurs. An airline cannot unilaterally decide a new time for the passenger. If that was the case then contracts wouldn't be enforceable. The reason we put things in writing is to hold each other to account. Now sure Qantas and heck even the ACCC can get it wrong and say that schedules aren't guaranteed and that instead we are entitled to a bundle of rights, but they aren't the end all be all on such matters.

Neither will EC/UK261 apply. They require you to hold a valid reservation for the affected flight. The OP does not as the new flight has been confirmed.

It would depend on what is going on behind the scenes I suppose. If you were scheduled to depart at 12 PM then they moved your flight over to 2 PM, whilst at the same time created a new flight departing at 12 PM, that is defacto denied boarding. The airline can try to use whatever language they want to wiggle themselves out of it, but it has the same effect of being denied boarding for the flight time you were originally scheduled to depart.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

In many jurisdictions, it is the passenger not the airline who gets to choose what to do when a flight disruption occurs. An airline cannot unilaterally decide a new time for the passenger. If that was the case then contracts wouldn't be enforceable. The reason we put things in writing is to hold each other to account. Now sure Qantas and heck even the ACCC can get it wrong and say that schedules aren't guaranteed and that instead we are entitled to a bundle of rights, but they aren't the end all be all on such matters.


It would depend on what is going on behind the scenes I suppose. If you were scheduled to depart at 12 PM then they moved your flight over to 2 PM, whilst at the same time created a new flight departing at 12 PM, that is defacto denied boarding. The airline can try to use whatever language they want to wiggle themselves out of it, but it has the same effect of being denied boarding for the flight time you were originally scheduled to depart.

Even EC261 only confers rights if the flight is delayed within certain bands, depending on distance.

In this case the flight was below the significant time change under BA policy, which is 2 hours.

Once EC261 kicks in, the passenger may get to choose their options.

Otherwise you’d need to look at the contract of carriage.

You’re right, ‘contracts’ aren’t enforceable with regard to flight times. If your flight is late in the UK/EU, or delayed in Australia, you’re not suing for breach of contract to get compensated, you’re relying on consumer protect laws (EC/UK261 or ACL respectively).