Virtue signalling: clutching at straws

[Must...Fly!]

FWIW the lack of separating rubbish irked me a lot, but on my last flight (about a month ago) PER-MEL they were separating dutifully, recycled material away from land fill.

Also any waste off an international flight is incinerated, this isn't exclusive to any particular airline but a quarantine requirement.

 

[Melburnian1]

So how many plastic straws does VA use anyway?

So far, flying it internationally in Y, it is the only airline I've been on where a request for a full can of soft drink was met with a 'we only have 250ml cans.' (Not 375ml size).

Some other airlines have given me a straw; the cup approach is favoured by yet another group.

So perhaps not many straws used on VA, which makes its issuing of a media release even sillier. Making a fuss about almost nothing!

 

[Melburnian1]

...any waste off an international flight is incinerated, this isn't exclusive to any particular airline but a quarantine requirement.

That's the case in Oz. One doubts if that's true everywhere else.

 

[davidj]

This sort of rubbishy dark green/leftie virtue signalling shows how it's become the new quasi-religion.

Makes people feel warm n fuzzy = big marketing win

 

[alviau]

Speaking to a csm (acquaintance’s partner) about this topic they mentioned that domestic on the A330 they recycle cups, cans, bottles, etc as they have the room. However on 737 it’s a best endeavour situation as they don’t quite have the room for multiple rubbish bins. At the end of the day it all goes back to their supplier gate gourmet who are ultimately responsible for putting the rubbish in the right places.

 

[Bagpuss]

VA doesn't separate its rubbish/recyclables on board, or at any point.

Yes they do or at least if you are given a meal in the open cardboard container.

On a side note : On a recent Perth - Sydney B737 they announced to hold onto the plastic cup for the flight duration.

 

[eastwest101]

Yes they do or at least if you are given a meal in the open cardboard container.

On a side note : On a recent Perth - Sydney B737 they announced to hold onto the plastic cup for the flight duration.

Galley size and shorter flight duration would make sorting recyclables impractical on most B737 sized aircraft, longer legs and larger galleys on A330 and larger aircraft would make recycling easier.

Domestically, reuse of plastic cups would be far better for the environment (from a volume of waste argument) than the very few straws that VA would use on any given day, but banning straws makes for better PR than using less plastic cups so there is a strong PR/Marketing motivation at work here and possibly less about the environment than first appears.

 

[Melburnian1]

Galley size and shorter flight duration would make sorting recyclables impractical on most B737 sized aircraft, longer legs and larger galleys on A330 and larger aircraft would make recycling easier.....

eastwest101, I tend not to peer into the galleys much (although I sometimes visit to request a drink as I don't like pressing the call button) but is there sufficient room in any galley to store bags of rubbish? Obviously they must put it somewhere but how do cabin crew achieve this without bumping into it, or (worse) having to step over it? Space is at a premium in aircraft: it isn't a train.

 

[clipped_wings]

If I was an analyst and listening to the dialogue here, I would come away with one observation: The answer lies in the question.

The issue isn't how to deal with rubbish on a plane. We need to find solutions to reduce the amount of rubbish going ON a plane in the first place.

Solve that and you're Employee of the Month.

 

[Must...Fly!]

If I was an analyst and listening to the dialogue here, I would come away with one observation: The answer lies in the question.

The issue isn't how to deal with rubbish on a plane. We need to find solutions to reduce the amount of rubbish going ON a plane in the first place.

Solve that and you're Employee of the Month.

Until another analyst comes and says, "well we need to provide free food and drink to match the competition"!

 

[stm1sydney]

Put the fares up and that will stop a lot of the rubbish coming onto planes.

 

[Quickstatus]

If I was an analyst and listening to the dialogue here, I would come away with one observation: The answer lies in the question.

The issue isn't how to deal with rubbish on a plane. We need to find solutions to reduce the amount of rubbish going ON a plane in the first place.

Solve that and you're Employee of the Month.

Why not fly less?

 

[eastwest101]

If I was an analyst and listening to the dialogue here, I would come away with one observation: The answer lies in the question.

The issue isn't how to deal with rubbish on a plane. We need to find solutions to reduce the amount of rubbish going ON a plane in the first place.

Solve that and you're Employee of the Month.

Yes thats an interesting observation that packaging goes on the plane but once it is consumed/used the packaging then becomes rubbish....

So given that we all expect some form of individual packaging and there are food safety guidelines that need to be followed.

Maybe the secret is to minimise the proportion of packaging and unnecessary catering that goes on board, in order to minimise the amount of waste that ends up on board. Or have waste/packaging that can be crushed/stored as compactly as possible. Maybe even reduce the different number of packaging materials? I.e. go to an "all plastic" waste stream or an "all paper and cardboard" waste stream so that cabin crew don't have to sort and separate?

 

[VPS]

When I was a BA flight last year the FA said if they opened a packet of plastic cups they had to throw the whole lot away at the end of the flight. I understand this sort of regulations is there to reduce contamination but there does need to be some sensible decisions made

 

[clipped_wings]

I'm going to be the Devil's advocate here and suggest an (almost sacrilegious) notion for debate:

Does anyone really NEED to eat and drink on any domestic flight less than 3 hours long? I use 3 hours, because it is the average span of work time that is allocated to any public servant before they are entitled to a break.

For example, take a flight from Sydney to Melbourne. It's under 2 hours airtime. Is that cup of coffee/water bottle, or breakfast omelette/cookie on board absolutely necessary? Imagine the volume of waste that one flight would generate and multiply it by every domestic leg in Australia of a similar duration in one day. Then multiply that figure by a week. Then a year. Kinda makes your head spin.

Now, before I scramble to change my username amidst cries for my scalp from the lynch mob - please humour me and do this simple exercise: Stand in front of a mirror and ask yourself this: "Do I need food on a short flight - OR do I want food on a short flight?"

Be brutal with your answer people....

I did it five minutes ago. And the sad truth is - I just like the attention that being served anything affords me. There's no health benefit, I don't really need the food. I just like the privilege of eating nice stuff in the air. Would I be just as happy chatting with cabin crew, or immersing myself in work while I fly? Probably. Would I die of hunger before we touch down? No. Would the money saved by serving no food, be better spent on a fabulous new airline seat or a massive discount? ABSOLUTELY.

Please, for the love of God - tell me there's someone out there who isn't sharpening the pitchfork..................

 

[Melburnian1]

clipped_wings, I lack a pitchfork because what you say is sensible.

However, legacy airlines from the 1950s onwards have created this expectation that we'll be served 'free' food and drinks, even on short flights.

Some LCCs are also in on the act by offering preordered meals (for a fee, but still for many part of the travel experience).

When I travel on suburban or shorter distance (two hours or under) rural trains worldwide (or ferries/buses), generally I don't have that expectation (with limited exceptions such as upmarket luxury trains that command a huge fare premium).

Maybe many of us salivate (particularly if we're infrequent travellers) at the mere thought of being fed and watered.

Lots of travellers would believe that any savings to airlines from abolition would mean greater profits (or smaller losses), not fare savings. For those whose travel is paid by an employer, public or private, there's no incentive to see fare reductions (unless it meant you or I could travel in a higher class like W or J).

Additionally, this 'free' activity provides many jobs from farms and manufacturers to distributors and airline catering centres. Just mentioning that.

 

[eastwest101]

I'm going to be the Devil's advocate here and suggest an (almost sacrilegious) notion for debate:

Does anyone really NEED to eat and drink on any domestic flight less than 3 hours long? I use 3 hours, because it is the average span of work time that is allocated to any public servant before they are entitled to a break.

For example, take a flight from Sydney to Melbourne. It's under 2 hours airtime. Is that cup of coffee/water bottle, or breakfast omelette/cookie on board absolutely necessary? Imagine the volume of waste that one flight would generate and multiply it by every domestic leg in Australia of a similar duration in one day. Then multiply that figure by a week. Then a year. Kinda makes your head spin.

Now, before I scramble to change my username amidst cries for my scalp from the lynch mob - please humour me and do this simple exercise: Stand in front of a mirror and ask yourself this: "Do I need food on a short flight - OR do I want food on a short flight?"

Be brutal with your answer people....

I did it five minutes ago. And the sad truth is - I just like the attention that being served anything affords me. There's no health benefit, I don't really need the food. I just like the privilege of eating nice stuff in the air. Would I be just as happy chatting with cabin crew, or immersing myself in work while I fly? Probably. Would I die of hunger before we touch down? No. Would the money saved by serving no food, be better spent on a fabulous new airline seat or a massive discount? ABSOLUTELY.

Please, for the love of God - tell me there's someone out there who isn't sharpening the pitchfork..................

I don't have the pitchforks out for you either, its a reasonable question that you ask. I think that like IFE, the idea of food and drinks is just there as more of a habit and a distraction for pax so they forget they are crammed into an aluminium tube with 150 or so other unfortunate random people, but maybe it sets a higher perceived standard of service that is a bit of an illusion now. As other posters have said - we wouldn't expect food and drink on a bus or train until we are on there for more than 2-3 hours.

The only thing I would mention is that there is only a limited few things to do on an aircraft that are socially acceptable (reading, watching IFE and eating/drinking) and for some people who are busy - often this 'downtime' could be the few opportunities to grab a snack during a hectic road trip/flight schedule. Remember a 1hr 45min SYD-MEL hop is actually a 3-4 hour grind once you add in the time to get to the airport, check-in, fly, deplane, luggage, taxi/train/uber to get from the airport to your destination so thats a timeframe that some people may begin to feel peckish.

 

[JohnK]

Stand in front of a mirror and ask yourself this: "Do I need food on a short flight - OR do I want food on a short flight?"

Be brutal with your answer people....

I did it five minutes ago. And the sad truth is - I just like the attention that being served anything affords me. There's no health benefit, I don't really need the food. I just like the privilege of eating nice stuff in the air. Would I be just as happy chatting with cabin crew, or immersing myself in work while I fly? Probably. Would I die of hunger before we touch down? No. Would the money saved by serving no food, be better spent on a fabulous new airline seat or a massive discount? ABSOLUTELY.

Please, for the love of God - tell me there's someone out there who isn't sharpening the pitchfork..................

Firstly the money saved is not going to reduce airfares.

Secondly I hardly have time to eat in the lounge. On Friday leave work around 2:30pm and rush to get home then out to airport. I don't usually get home in SYD until after 10:00pm. On Sundays I'm at golf and again rush to get out to airport and I'm in apartment in BNE until after 9:00am.

These are only 1 hour flights but onsidering the number of hours I'm away getting to/from then dinner on the flight can be a really good idea.

 

[Quickstatus]

a lot of J class pax dont want whats offered. so there must be some waste

 

[mannej]

I wonder if expanding the ability to order meals online prior to a flight domestically would help reduce some of the food wastage?