We really want to fly QF, but can't justify the price

[hutch]

So because a vendor has offered a product for a certain price, I'm not allowed to go to said vendor and ask "I want to use you guys, but I don't like the price, can you do better"? That's pretty much the basis behind negotiation. If they say no, I'll reevaluate my position, if they say yes, then I'm better off. Besides, after speaking with a QF rep on FB, it sounds like they are wanting to see if they can do a better deal for us, and if that is the case and I like what they offer, then I will chose to fly with them.

Keep in mind that half the reason why this forum exists is to discuss methods for stretching the travel dollar further.




It make perfect sense. How much profit do you make on a sale of $0? If your business makes no sales, then you will not be in business for very long.
Yes AirNZ are having a sale on right now, that said prior to their sale, their airfares was still $4,000 cheaper than QF. In fact, by letting QF know about my feelings on the issue rather than simply going straight to AirNZ, I've effectively given them a free-be.

Yes I'm under no illusion that my contact with QF means anything more to them than feedback from customer #62326, but in my experience of running a business, feedback about when you only just missed the mark was more valuable than when everything was peachy.

If QF wants to do a deal for you, then I wish you well. Just like when shopping around for other products, you can always go back to your preferred retailer and ask them to do a deal. I just don't agree with complaining about it. YMMV.

Your assumption that there is no profit on a sale of $0, relies on Qantas not selling those seats. If they sell those seats at the advertised price, then they have made much more profit than bringing the price down for you. Qantas's little computer would be sitting the background making the necessary calculations on load/price point etc.

 

[harvyk]

So just as a follow up, we have booked with QF for $7,128, which is much better than the original asking price of $10,157 (glad I waited for a sale)...
AirNZ's sale ended (and the price went up to $8,500) before we had all the money saved (which is a little bit of a pity), as I thought their sale ended tomorrow, not last Friday.

I've also signed the missus and the kids up to QFF, so we should net just under 100K points... I'm pretty sure that with that many points (plus the 15K sitting in my account right now) I can do something towards getting a better status than PS or at the very least do some J flying, both of which will offset the slightly higher expense compared to UA or FJ...

 

[drewbles]

So just as a follow up, we have booked with QF for $7,128, which is much better than the original asking price of $10,157 (glad I waited for a sale)...
AirNZ's sale ended (and the price went up to $8,500) before we had all the money saved (which is a little bit of a pity), as I thought their sale ended tomorrow, not last Friday.

I've also signed the missus and the kids up to QFF, so we should net just under 100K points... I'm pretty sure that with that many points (plus the 15K sitting in my account right now) I can do something towards getting a better status than PS or at the very least do some J flying, both of which will offset the slightly higher expense compared to UA or FJ...

I hear that SJU is nice this time of the year (heck, any time of the year)

 

[BD1959]

But thats is my point, those flights between SIN-MEL etc are cheap... so Qantas is pricing its product to sell seats in a market where it has poor loads.

Sure - by my point was that QF *must* be making a profit on those SIN-MEL flights ... after all a certain Mr Joyce stated on the 7:30 Report that every remaining flight was making money and he surely wouldn't mislead the very public he's looking to garner for political pressure ... would he??

Regards,

BD

 

[11sjw]

So just as a follow up, we have booked with QF for $7,128, which is much better than the original asking price of $10,157 (glad I waited for a sale)...
AirNZ's sale ended (and the price went up to $8,500) before we had all the money saved (which is a little bit of a pity), as I thought their sale ended tomorrow, not last Friday.

I've also signed the missus and the kids up to QFF, so we should net just under 100K points... I'm pretty sure that with that many points (plus the 15K sitting in my account right now) I can do something towards getting a better status than PS or at the very least do some J flying, both of which will offset the slightly higher expense compared to UA or FJ...

Hope you enjoy it!

 

[knasty]

I can do something towards getting a better status than PS or at the very least do some J flying, both of which will offset the slightly higher expense compared to UA or FJ...

If you do AA platinum challenge for USD 200 each you will get platinum after the outbound flight and 100% AA miles bonus for it and all after it during your platinum period. Oz-US J is perfect for the challenge.

 

[lovestotravel]

So just as a follow up, we have booked with QF for $7,128, which is much better than the original asking price of $10,157 (glad I waited for a sale)...
AirNZ's sale ended (and the price went up to $8,500) before we had all the money saved (which is a little bit of a pity), as I thought their sale ended tomorrow, not last Friday.

I've also signed the missus and the kids up to QFF, so we should net just under 100K points... I'm pretty sure that with that many points (plus the 15K sitting in my account right now) I can do something towards getting a better status than PS or at the very least do some J flying, both of which will offset the slightly higher expense compared to UA or FJ...

So basically your whinge was about sale prices and picking who was on sale at the right time for your flights.

 

[Simo]

I can never understand why costs can vary so much between carriers when both are full service.

I understand some differences with wages and ground costs but not that much.

 

[harvyk]

So basically your whinge was about sale prices and picking who was on sale at the right time for your flights.

Pretty much... That said a $3K saving is worth having since we're flying the exact same flights (and no doubt will be in the exact same seats) as had we brought the flights for $10K...

 

[drewbles]

If you do AA platinum challenge for USD 200 each you will get platinum after the outbound flight and 100% AA miles bonus for it and all after it during your platinum period. Oz-US J is perfect for the challenge.

Yes, but the OP is flying in Economy, with his family. In addition, the AA challenge is only on AA codes (always a lot more than QF codes when on QF metal), and won't give you access to domestic lounges unless flying as part of an international itinerary (which may need to be an AA itinerary, not QF; not sure about that one).

The challenge is great, but not much use to the OP (over a quick run somewhere in F to top up to WP). The 100% points bonus also would not be that great IMHO (considering you'd be up for $800 straight away to sign everyone up, and having to cough up a premium for the AA codes, means you could probably buy the equivalent number of points for less when they have the buy and bonus offers).

 

[BD1959]

So basically your whinge was about sale prices and picking who was on sale at the right time for your flights.

I see it more a statement of fact rather than whinge.

The OP couldn't justify paying the original asking price. QF recognized that the fares were overpriced compared with what the market (not the sole OP!!) was prepared to pay and adjusted the price accordingly.

Basic revenue management.

Regards,

BD

 

[JohnK]

I can never understand why costs can vary so much between carriers when both are full service.

Sometimes airfares vary on the same carrier depending on how you book it?

 

[Mick1969]

As much as I was hoping that one of the Qantas sales would cover the June/July school holiday period it never happened. With frequent monitoring over the last six to eight weeks the Qantas fares have stayed around $2500 for the dates I needed. A quick check of the Virgin website last night showed similarly timed flights on my dates with fares for $1250 each. Needless to say I jumped on this deal, saving $2500 which will pay for more fun in the USA.

 

[Melburnian1]

Mick1969, well done for both saving yourself money and travelling on a better airline than QF.

While many airlines are unprofitable, QFi of late has become exceedingly so.

Unfortunately the staff are being paid too much. It may not be the only cause of losses, but it is a contributing factor. Competitors in many cases offer a superior aircraft or onboard service or both.

You are just doing what lots of us have steadily been doing for a few years now. Although the number of Australians (and foreigners into and out of Oz) has increased steadily, QFi's passenger numbers have not risen in line. QFi continues to shrink its own metal route network, and increasingly fails to offer what marketers call a 'value proposition.'

It's a good case study of what unionism can do to an enterprise. One wonders how many more years QFi will last in its present form. It was a surprise that AJ did not recently announce the truncation of QF9 to run to DXB only and not LHR, but perhaps those sort of changes are still being considered or worked through given that there are longish lead times to implement alterations like that.

 

[Mick1969]

My partner and I are actually flying Qantas, it's my teenage children that I have booked on Virgin on different dates (they will be joining me in the USA). I thoroughly enjoy flying Qantas and have yet to have a poor experience. It was unfortunate that I could not justify the extra $2500 for my boys to join us on the return Qantas flight.

 

[BD1959]

While many airlines are unprofitable, QFi of late has become exceedingly so.

Unfortunately the staff are being paid too much. It may not be the only cause of losses, but it is a contributing factor.
It's a good case study of what unionism can do to an enterprise.

Hi Melburnian1,

Given Mr Joyce - on the 7:30 Report - stated that all existing route were making QF money, I'd be interested to understand:

1. How much higher (in percentage terms) QF staff costs are compared with .... let's say UA and VA ... given that Mick1969 is talking about the US route

2. Given the shutdown was supposed to have been the nail in the coffin of the Unions, what ways - other than costs - has "unionism" (not individual Unions) been the undoing of Qantas

I'm no union lover - far from it - so I'm intrigued to understand the facts behind sweeping generalisations.

Regards,

BD

 

[Deleted member]

Hi Melburnian1,

Given Mr Joyce - on the 7:30 Report - stated that all existing route were making QF money, I'd be interested to understand:

1. How much higher (in percentage terms) QF staff costs are compared with .... let's say UA and VA ... given that Mick1969 is talking about the US route

2. Given the shutdown was supposed to have been the nail in the coffin of the Unions, what ways - other than costs - has "unionism" (not individual Unions) been the undoing of Qantas

I'm no union lover - far from it - so I'm intrigued to understand the facts behind sweeping generalisations.

Regards,

BD

I think that anecdotal evidence will show that QF staff are extremely well paid by international standards .
I figure bandied about by a jet connect person two weeks ago to me, was that an FA with QF can quite easily earn $100k pa.
If this is true then I suspect some of the pilots in the US would like to trade in their wings for a new role working on Australia.
All that said, I would have no idea what he majority of QF flight crew earn, other than knowing through personal experience the incomes of a few pilots as a result of my work with them as clients for IP.
They are well paid.

 

[harvyk]

As much as I was hoping that one of the Qantas sales would cover the June/July school holiday period it never happened. With frequent monitoring over the last six to eight weeks the Qantas fares have stayed around $2500 for the dates I needed. A quick check of the Virgin website last night showed similarly timed flights on my dates with fares for $1250 each. Needless to say I jumped on this deal, saving $2500 which will pay for more fun in the USA.

Yeah, we decided to simply take the kids out of school for a couple of weeks. The way I see it, seeing the world has as much educational value as school.

I remember that my high school had a similar view when they organised a central Australia trip when I was in year 10. There was 30 of us out of a school of 800 who went on the trip (no pre-req with grades, just pony up the $$$), and we missed a week of school to do it and no they did not provide us lessons / homework on the bus / plane in it's place, they figured the educational experience of travel was the perfect classroom / teacher. Since then I see nothing wrong with taking the kids out of school every so often (say a week or two a year) for the purposes of travel.

 

[BD1959]

I think that anecdotal evidence will show that QF staff are extremely well paid by international standards .

"Paid" as in take-home pay or purely base salary? What happens when accommodation and living expenses are factored in to that "pay".

Sure, there's plenty of anecdotal evidence, a lot of it gets posted here, what I'd like to see are the actual costs analysis to justify the anecdotal.

I figure bandied about by a jet connect person two weeks ago to me, was that an FA with QF can quite easily earn $100k pa.

Yes, lots of bandi-ing!! A figure I've read has discussed Senior Flight Crew and CSMs having a range of $80-120,000 ... seniority, NOT "easily".

If this is true then I suspect some of the pilots in the US would like to trade in their wings for a new role working on Australia.
All that said, I would have no idea what he majority of QF flight crew earn, other than knowing through personal experience the incomes of a few pilots as a result of my work with them as clients for IP.
They are well paid.

Again, some comparative figures of flight crew here vs elsewhere would be interesting.

We all know someone who is the flip: a neighbour of mine is currently flying for DragonAir because they pay (and here we mean the whole package) better than he can earn in Australia, with far less flying hours than was the case with JQ (that beacon of cost minimalisation).

Regards,

BD

 

[suparockin]

A friend was a hostie for Emirates, I believe she was getting $120K (tax free) + living arrangements.

That would make them very well paid, although I suppose fuel is practically free in the Middle East.