Well I'm stumped. Classic Reward, multicity, release dates, I must be doing it wrong.

[JennyMG]

I just wanted to report two things on my search from Syd>Europe next year.
1. that thanks to your help, I was able to book CR direct J on 29.4.25 with QFF pts, first with JAL to NRT and second J from NRT to Paris with Air France. I have NO IDEA how I found that second leg booking. It was on the multicity tool, which I absolutely hate. But suddenly it showed this AF flight, direct, with points, that never showed up in the single flight search tool. I was so shocked, I booked it immediately without taking my eyes off the webpage. It wouldn't let me book seats but I just rang AF and they did it for me. (Because Qantas couldnt. :/ ) Seriously pleased. But QFF search is a debacle right? Seems so random even the single flight tool to the multicity tool, the stupid calendars etc, ... other airlines have it all together, Qantas must have hired a dyslexic narcissistic non flying 12 year old to develop their website.

2. Now I have to find flights from Europe back to Sydney. I have Seats Aero looking, thanks again to you people who suggested it.
I'm looking for Frankfurt (would be easiest from where I am) to either HKG, Taipei, Seoul, Japan, KL, or something like that. I really hope to get a direct, with QFF points. (I also probably have enough velocity points for the trip back.) All searches on Seats Aero.
Then the second from wherever I landed to Sydney. But I'm pretty flexible as long as it doesn't take me too long and there are no giant layovers.
Would I be right in assuming that most CR seats would drop around 350 days out? (from 9 June 25 means about 23 July 24?

Any advice on this return 2 x legs would be appreciated, patterns...likely dates...airlines. Thanks.

 

[Human]

I just wanted to report two things on my search from Syd>Europe next year.
1. that thanks to your help, I was able to book CR direct J on 29.4.25 with QFF pts, first with JAL to NRT and second J from NRT to Paris with Air France. I have NO IDEA how I found that second leg booking. It was on the multicity tool, which I absolutely hate. But suddenly it showed this AF flight, direct, with points, that never showed up in the single flight search tool. I was so shocked, I booked it immediately without taking my eyes off the webpage. It wouldn't let me book seats but I just rang AF and they did it for me. (Because Qantas couldnt. :/ ) Seriously pleased. But QFF search is a debacle right? Seems so random even the single flight tool to the multicity tool, the stupid calendars etc, ... other airlines have it all together, Qantas must have hired a dyslexic narcissistic non flying 12 year old to develop their website.

2. Now I have to find flights from Europe back to Sydney. I have Seats Aero looking, thanks again to you people who suggested it.
I'm looking for Frankfurt (would be easiest from where I am) to either HKG, Taipei, Seoul, Japan, KL, or something like that. I really hope to get a direct, with QFF points. (I also probably have enough velocity points for the trip back.) All searches on Seats Aero.
Then the second from wherever I landed to Sydney. But I'm pretty flexible as long as it doesn't take me too long and there are no giant layovers.
Would I be right in assuming that most CR seats would drop around 350 days out? (from 9 June 25 means about 23 July 24?

Any advice on this return 2 x legs would be appreciated, patterns...likely dates...airlines. Thanks.

Well done on that booking to Europe!

You say you have enough Velocity points for the trip back.

If you don’t mind paying the relatively high carrier charges on Qatar, and you can be awake at midnight AEST exactly 330 days before the date you want to fly home, and you’re willing to be a little flexible with the city of departure and city of return (ie. Melbourne, Brisbane or Adelaide if you can’t find Sydney), then you’ll have a very good chance of finding reward seats on Qatar — as long as there are no more than two of you.

That would definitely be my Plan A if your desired return date is more than 330 days out. Some nights there’s nothing available, but you probably wouldn’t have to wait more than 2-3 nights for something to come up if you’re able to delay your trip home.

But you need to log on at midnight: more often than not the seats are taken within a couple of hours.

 

[ben95]

as long as there are no more than two of you.

what are the chances of me finding 4x J availability to SIN in mid Jan with SQ? The alternative is to fly Scoot in Y

 

[Human]

what are the chances of me finding 4x J availability to SIN in mid Jan with SQ? The alternative is to fly Scoot in Y

I think your chances are greater than zero if you’re willing to be patient and flexible. But why not fly Premium Economy as an alternative?

 

[ben95]

But why not fly Premium Economy as an alternative?

The family isn't interested if its PE. They think on a day-time flight for 8 hours just preload the iPad with plenty of entertainment Scoot is not terrible.

 

[JennyMG]

Well done on that booking to Europe!

You say you have enough Velocity points for the trip back.

If you don’t mind paying the relatively high carrier charges on Qatar, and you can be awake at midnight AEST exactly 330 days before the date you want to fly home, and you’re willing to be a little flexible with the city of departure and city of return (ie. Melbourne, Brisbane or Adelaide if you can’t find Sydney), then you’ll have a very good chance of finding reward seats on Qatar — as long as there are no more than two of you.

That would definitely be my Plan A if your desired return date is more than 330 days out. Some nights there’s nothing available, but you probably wouldn’t have to wait more than 2-3 nights for something to come up if you’re able to delay your trip home.

But you need to log on at midnight: more often than not the seats are taken within a couple of hours.

That's a FANTASTIC idea, thanks Human! I've been wanting to try Qatar, and am sad that Qantas (and Aus) had a bit of a tussle and seems we've both gone off in a huff. Right. I'm calculating. Thankyou!!!! I'll let you know how I go. Being up at midnight is nothing for me if you want reward seats.

 

[kcwalker]

Surely it can't be that hard booking a classic award from Syd to Italy or thereabouts next April/May 2025 and back from France or thereabouts to home next May/June 2025?
I've done it before, fairly easily before 2019/20 stuffed everything, but now... rather than getting better, more streamlined, more detail, more availability,.. QFF and booking screens seem far worse.
I'm just trying to get the lay of the land, prepare, know what to look for and when to look for it so I'll be ready. I can't make heads nor tails of the classic award options and flights.

I'm only a silver. Possibly be a nothing by the time I book.

• The multicity tool never works properly, (and if there's no award flights on the day you picked beforehand, there's no way to flick a day forward with the top calendar, you have to go all the way back to a changed search.)
• There seems no rhyme or pattern to the release dates of any of the airlines in the partnership. Sometimes they turn up only 2 months before a flight, yet we're being 'told' to look almost a year in advance.
• There are rivalries, and coughing going on, between airlines...QTR for example.
• I see BA flights consistently for a couple of months in a predictable pattern, then they disappear. Same with Cathay.
• Things that appear on single flight, don't appear on Multiflight and VV. Things that appear on Seats Aero and Expert Flyer don't sometimes appear on Q, or don't explain that they're code share with some lesser airline.
• And far from seeing more award flights, (in J, and particularly direct) I'm seeing way less than before. Sure there are circuitous routes via goodness-knows-where and a zillion hour layovers but I would have thought my flexibility would allow some shorter more direct flights to turn up.
• there are few BA, few Air France, nil KLM, nil Qatar, ...what the heck is going on? are we ONLY to fly Chinese airlines? There's millions of those, and emirates, if you're willing to part with $3000 each ticket on top of the points.
  
  I have Seats Aero account - what a great tool, enjoy Flight Connections, and a premium Expert Flyer account (which I'm still learning.) I get it, no one tool gives 100% accuracy.
  
  If anyone has any bright ideas, or can suggest route options, or can explain the above patterns...so I can look in the right place at the right time (OK, stop your chortling..)
  
  And I think I'm being pretty flexible. I have some preferences, but who doesn't?
  Dream itin is Syd>somewhere> FCO CDG >somewhere> Syd.
  Will go via Melbourne or Brisbane etc, if I need to. I'll stop anywhere that is not dangerous, would RATHER a pleasant stopover place, Sing, HKG, etc, but that's not essential. Don't want to fly Chinese airlines, or stop in super off beat places, dangerous places, or have wild long layovers, or stop anywhere in China. (not racist, just my preference as had a very bad experience.) Would rather fly the big airlines, with nice J/O/C (depending on who you're looking at). Happy to go Cathay, JAL, Finnair, AF, BA, etc...but prefer to give Q a wide berth until they get their act into gear. Last J flight I took with Q to HKG was horrendous.
  Want to end up in Rome...or at least in the country, or close to. Coming home, want to leave from somewhere near Strasbourg. Don't care which country. Could be Stuttgart or Frankfurt. Paris or wherever. As long as the points are not diabolical and the loading doesn't give me an aneurism.
  
  Lastly, have not heard/seen much about the new look Concierge (except a million ads.) 10% fee is super steep. But would do it if it helped a lot, and wonder who HAS had a good experience, can only find poor experiences on the forum.

Classic Awards have become very difficult to book to certain destinations since Covid.

I used to be very creative and had lots of energy and was able to redeem 3 seats to BKK often either direct or via SIN/HKG for a few extra points. Now close to impossible as we have zero flexibility and if we find awards seats outbound there are no award seats inbound and vice versa.

And it seems to be getting worse. Not sure it will ever improve. Time to stop playing the game.

It's a rort. I've travelled first and business multiple times for 15 years, creativity, persistence, flexibility, energy..and those hard earned points..did the job. Now...Classic award in business and first mostly does not exist on international routes, it's a futile, frustrating, pointless exercise and you can waste a lot of life finding nothing...and even if you are that desperate to burn your points on the 300% 'penalty points' with the new 'Çlassic plus'.. it is still not easy and it leaves a nasty taste..knowing you have been stiffed by Qantas!
There's quite a few contributors that parrot that with time and flexibility and with a long term view, you can snag a seat up front..if you know the 'tricks'...these guys are either magicians or Qantas plants..because it just isn't true!

 

[JennyMG]

It's a rort. I've travelled first and business multiple times for 15 years, creativity, persistence, flexibility, energy..and those hard earned points..did the job. Now...Classic award in business and first mostly does not exist on international routes, it's a futile, frustrating, pointless exercise and you can waste a lot of life finding nothing...and even if you are that desperate to burn your points on the 300% 'penalty points' with the new 'Çlassic plus'.. it is still not easy and it leaves a nasty taste..knowing you have been stiffed by Qantas!
There's quite a few contributors that parrot that with time and flexibility and with a long term view, you can snag a seat up front..if you know the 'tricks'...these guys are either magicians or Qantas plants..because it just isn't true!

I have to disagree (that it's pointless - I'll pardon your pun) but probably agree on the rort part.
I've a trip to Europe almost booked next May/June. 3 our of 4 legs done.
I've been patient, I've looked most days and nights, I enlisted seats aero to help.
I only want Business class, and I have quite a lot of points that I'm FINALLY spending.
It seemed to me (as per my OP) that it was much more difficult than I found it last time, precovid (which I had to cancel). But, with persistence, being flexible with dates and times and airlines, and even destinations, and without resorting to Classic+, I have found 3 great flights for 3 of my 4 legs. Syd>HND JAL, NAR>CDG Air France, and HK>Syd Cathay. I just need the 3rd leg to join the loop. I found all the 3 above within about 10 days of eachother, all about 350 days out. The most expensive one was the AF at 104,500 + tax. The other two 90K ea. I'm really happy. There's a bit of a struggle finding the 3rd leg europe to HK, but I'm prepared to be flexible and there seems to be a bit of a lack of any flights at all around those dates. But I have no doubt that one of 4 things will happen.
1. Either I find a good flight that fits, on points or
2. I don't find a good flight that fits and have to go CR on Emirates (because they're always available) and be charged a lot of tax or
3. I have to fork out for one leg with cash, or
4. I go CR PE or E for one leg.
It's funny that flights pop up suddenly when we used to know sort of when they were going to, since there seems no rhyme or reason to the release of partner airline seats, (or Q for that matter), and I think that may be also what you don't like doing? Sure it takes time, flexibility and a long term view, but I think it was like that before, just it's less predictable now.
I'm looking for the 'almost' holy grail, Eur>HK, but I might have to go via Helsinki or Taipei first, it just is what it is if you want a points flight.
I'm really glad everyone helped me think outside the square.

 

[p--and--t]

It's a rort. I've travelled first and business multiple times for 15 years, creativity, persistence, flexibility, energy..and those hard earned points..did the job. Now...Classic award in business and first mostly does not exist on international routes, it's a futile, frustrating, pointless exercise and you can waste a lot of life finding nothing...and even if you are that desperate to burn your points on the 300% 'penalty points' with the new 'Çlassic plus'.. it is still not easy and it leaves a nasty taste..knowing you have been stiffed by Qantas!
There's quite a few contributors that parrot that with time and flexibility and with a long term view, you can snag a seat up front..if you know the 'tricks'...these guys are either magicians or Qantas plants..because it just isn't true!

Just because you can't find what you want does not give you the right to call or assume those who diligently look and are flexible, "Qantas plants".

 

[kcwalker]

Just because you can't find what you want does not give you the right to call or assume those who diligently look and are flexible, "Qantas plants".

It’s not supposed to be an exercise in diligent stoicism, it’s supposed to be a usable Frequent Flyer programme.. the points are accumulated by some hefty expenditure and loyalty to Qantas products, promoted with great vigour by Qantas itself. My point is, it used to be an excellent programme with reasonable access to flight opportunity up the pointy end (which I think is the purpose of most of us..) but now, as can be demonstrated by the huge efforts and rigours of many of these members, its a full time job and a ridiculously complex procedure.. the programme is diminished, you need to have extremely low expectations to be satisfied.. much fewer seats up front, especially for two.. greater number of points required and a higher $ component…if that is acceptable and enjoyable as some sort of ‘challenge’ then i sort of get it…

 

[p--and--t]

It’s not supposed to be an exercise in diligent stoicism, it’s supposed to be a usable Frequent Flyer programme.. the points are accumulated by some hefty expenditure and loyalty to Qantas products, promoted with great vigour by Qantas itself. My point is, it used to be an excellent programme with reasonable access to flight opportunity up the pointy end (which I think is the purpose of most of us..) but now, as can be demonstrated by the huge efforts and rigours of many of these members, its a full time job and a ridiculously complex procedure.. the programme is diminished, you need to have extremely low expectations to be satisfied.. much fewer seats up front, especially for two.. greater number of points required and a higher $ component…if that is acceptable and enjoyable as some sort of ‘challenge’ then i sort of get it…

And you missed my point - Complain about the program as much as you want but don't insult other members in the process.

 

[jase05]

the points are accumulated by some hefty expenditure and loyalty to Qantas products, promoted with great vigour by Qantas itself

Maybe for you but for many other millions of QFF customers they earn easy points via CC churn and numerous other options where points are thrown at you like confetti. There would also be plenty that hardly step foot on a Qantas plane with millions of points in their account thanks to these promotions and spend options.
The reality that there is never going to be enough reward seats available for how many members QF have and you also have to factor in all the other frequent flyers out there from other programs that have access to the same seats and you can see why it’s hard work

 

[Tiki]

The airlines just aren't releasing award seats which is extremely frustrating after you have been saving for months. I can't find anything on QF/LA to SCL from SYD, MEL, BNE or AKL in October, not even in Y although I would prefer PE or J. I have been monitoring this route for a few months. Ever since these ridiculous classic plus awards came out, I haven't heard of a bulk award seat drop either. There are routes via the USA but since I want to go to Chile it's a bit tortuous to go via LAX.

 

[kcwalker]

How many points do you have? And how desperate are you to book with points?

Classic Rewards + is set to be launched in July. With that new program, you should be able to book return business class tickets to Europe for about 800,000 — 1,200,000 Qantas points + Taxes/Fees per person.

Maybe for you but for many other millions of QFF customers they earn easy points via CC churn and numerous other options where points are thrown at you like confetti. There would also be plenty that hardly step foot on a Qantas plane with millions of points in their account thanks to these promotions and spend options.
The reality that there is never going to be enough reward seats available for how many members QF have and you also have to factor in all the other frequent flyers out there from other programs that have access to the same seats and you can see why it’s hard work

Like confetti…? Every point is earned by expenditure..credit card churn is not free.. it comes with annual credit card fees, FF rewards fee and 20+% interest rate. Wine, insurances, hotels etc..can have great points opportunities… but a premium is factored into the increased price you are generally paying. Qantas have created all these ‘opportunities’ to funnel their customers into a profitable side show outside flying, but.. have not expanded the opportunity to use these bountiful points into seats.. hence the gaping hole.. worse, the few opportunities that are available are increasingly available only under the classic plus version, which comes at a red hot burn of often 300% penalty…nice business!

 

[11sjw]

Searching for rewards ex Asia is a good strategy. Pay cash to get to from there and allow an overnight (or two) to accommodate schedule changes, each way.

 

[ronlon]

Searching for rewards ex Asia is a good strategy. Pay cash to get to from there and allow an overnight (or two) to accommodate schedule changes, each way.

Yes I agree this is a good strategy. This strategy also works with reward seats from Australia to Asia, spend a night or two then fly reward to Europe. There are however less reward seats to Asia during peak season. Nonetheless I just managed booking my family of 4 complete reward seats to Europe for the peak Victoria 2025 winter school holiday period. Mixture of business and economy class.

Kcwalker does however have a point. It took hours of research and planning to achieve my booking. It used to be easier. It is still better than forking out for my family a total of $9000 plus for economy class airfares.