Why do we hold unreal expectations of Qantas??

[MEL_Traveller]

this comes across as a little bit of envy tbh....

Yes and no

‘no’ in the sense that I don’t fly QF very often because of these issues.

‘yes’ but in the sense of being slightly cheesed-off that when I go to the F lounge the tables are all occupied by families who then turn right on boarding. Last visit to the MEL F lounge I got told ‘sorry, you’ll have to find a seat ... *hand motion* ... ‘over there’ ‘and then not a single person came with any follow up.

 

[RichardMEL]

Yes and no

‘no’ in the sense that I don’t fly QF very often because of these issues.

‘yes’ but in the sense of being slightly cheesed-off that when I go to the F lounge the tables are all occupied by families who then turn right on boarding. Last visit to the MEL F lounge I got told ‘sorry, you’ll have to find a seat ... *hand motion* ... ‘over there’ ‘and then not a single person came with any follow up.

While crowded lounges are definitely an issue, I can't really see how the airline actually providing published status benefits to their passengers to be an "unreal expectation" as per the thread title.

I get it. I've been in MEL F and had to sit at the bar due to lack of seats but eh I dont worry about it too much.. (and for me usually solo I feel better that I'm not taking up a table for two, for example).

And actually in terms of expectations while it may create more people in lounges, QF's policy re kids/family not being included as included guests is fairly generous in lounge access rules for most carriers.. I am sure there are a number of folks in this group who have found this aspect of QF's service to be very valuable over time.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

So the choice for Qantas is to either have a family of four in jetsar economy to bali, or a single $14k first class passenger to london.

If they choose the former, don’t come cap in hand to the government seeking taxpayer guarantees.

 

[RichardMEL]

And, if you had status with airline X, and were on a cheap holiday and could use a nice lounge and get seats (ie: shoe on the other foot) would you give two hoots what the guy sitting in the corner scowling at you paid for their ticket? Also would it be any of your business?

 

[dajop]

So the choice for Qantas is to either have a family of four in jetsar economy to bali, or a single $14k first class passenger to london.

There is always assumptions that F class passengers are the holy grail of profitability. But, if you do the math, one first class is typically equivalent in space to 5-6 economy seats in space it occupies on a plane. So $14K return to London, is for arguments sake $2400-$2800 return in economy. Translating on a distance basis, this is equivalent to $620-$720 return to DPS. Sure the $14k pax bring in more revenue, but they also cost a lot more (5-6 times more airplane) to service. This is why airlines are starting to talk about real estate on planes. Personally I think F is just vanity and branding product. Even SQ, where space profitability is critical, don't offer it (eg on SIN-EWR non stop).

 

[MEL_Traveller]

But economy isn’t $2800 to London.. it’s $1100. The F passenger is paying 13 times the fare, but is not getting 13 x the real estate (the forward lower deck cabin of an a380 accommodates approximately 74 economy class pax (EK), or between 12-14 first class suites, based on SQ and QF). So It’s around 6x.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

And, if you had status with airline X, and were on a cheap holiday and could use a nice lounge and get seats (ie: shoe on the other foot) would you give two hoots what the guy sitting in the corner scowling at you paid for their ticket? Also would it be any of your business?

I’m not arguing that point.

QFi isn’t doing badly, but it isn’t raking in the money either.

The $6k business class passenger is in the QFi lounge in MEL fighting for baked beans and a hash brown, while the family of four off to bali for $399 is sipping champagne and eating salt and pepper squid. And you wonder why you’re not making more money?

It’s not envy... it’s being annoyed when the airline then demands taxpayer guarantees.

this isn’t limited to airlines. Same thing with car manufacturers. If you refuse to make a product that people want, don’t come cap in hand (although a terrible shame for the folk out of work )

 

[dajop]

The $6k business class passenger is in the QFi lounge in MEL fighting for baked beans and a hash brown, while the family of four off to bali for $399 is sipping champagne and eating salt and pepper squid. And you wonder why you’re not making more money?

But you are making good money on QFF and QF domestic. And why? For some reason, travellers, especially if your company is paying and permits it, will rig their travel to only fly QF, even if it costs significantly more than VA, so they get enough status to enjoy sipping champagne and having salt and pepper squid on their trips to Bali. You only have to read the boards here the importance of the F lounge offering in hooking people into the QF system.

The international F lounges are an important part of the domestic offering, not just the international offer.

(now I am being a bit argumentative, as I agree the QF J lounge at MEL is not the best, although last time I was there, flying MH at a time when QF had no flights, so catering was particularly bad, I understand that before the QF flights they do have slightly better catering they bring around to pax, but last couple of times I've departed MEL on QF - QF37 - I've gone straight to the EK lounge).

 

[amaroo]

So the choice for Qantas is to either have a family of four in jetsar economy to bali, or a single $14k first class passenger to london.

If they choose the former, don’t come cap in hand to the government seeking taxpayer guarantees.

FWIW, I seem to recall you giving me some stick for flying QF F SYD-LHR-SYD at Xmas ..... and I only paid $11,000 per ticket.

Do you have an issue with QF or passengers that don't fly F?

 

[UP4014]

kyle said: And on trips since then once I've moved to Australia, my memories are always of old and overweight flight attendants.

You are joking right?

tofidog I don’t know what you think of, but When I think of a person named Kyle I think of old overweight radio announcers past their used by date.

Oh, did I generalise I hope no offence is taken.

 

[kyle]

You are joking right?

Absolutely serious. That was my first memories and during the times when Ansett was still around.

 

[kyle]

tofidog I don’t know what you think of, but When I think of a person named Kyle I think of old overweight radio announcers past their used by date.

Oh, did I generalise I hope no offence is taken.

More like Kyle of South Park fame.

 

[juddles]

..........

The $6k business class passenger is in the QFi lounge in MEL fighting for baked beans and a hash brown, while the family of four off to bali for $399 is sipping champagne and eating salt and pepper squid. ........

MEL_T, isn't the only reason that family of four "going to Bali for $399" is in the F lounge is because they have earned status by spending a lot of cash with Qantas already??

 

[MEL_Traveller]

MEL_T, isn't the only reason that family of four "going to Bali for $399" is in the F lounge is because they have earned status by spending a lot of cash with Qantas already??

Not necessarily. As discussed above, with DSC promos, it’s a MEL-SYD around once a fortnight on a red e-deals. But that’s where this part of the discussion started... the person on DSCs is paying the same as a single round-trip in business class to the states, but the latter gets no benefits.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

FWIW, I seem to recall you giving me some stick for flying QF F SYD-LHR-SYD at Xmas ..... and I only paid $11,000 per ticket.

Do you have an issue with QF or passengers that don't fly F?

Did I give you stick? (serious question)

The issue is QF. They should be providing ground handling in line with ticket purchase.

 

[Fergo747]

Not necessarily. As discussed above, with DSC promos, it’s a MEL-SYD around once a fortnight on a red e-deals. But that’s where this part of the discussion started... the person on DSCs is paying the same as a single round-trip in business class to the states, but the latter gets no benefits.

Yes but that’s not every flyer who gets access to the F-Lounge. What about all those people with significant QF spend that then choose to get on a cheap flight to DPS/AKL/CHC etc with their families and use the benefits that they’ve earned. Just because one flies a lot for work to earn status does not necessarily mean they can afford to buy anything more than cheap economy fares for personal travel

 

[opusman]

Anyone smart would be in the EK lounge rather than the QF lounge in MEL if they can. And I suspect the EK partnership is why QF haven't bothered upgrading their own J lounge for such a long time.

 

[levelnine]

Anyone smart would be in the EK lounge rather than the QF lounge in MEL if they can. And I suspect the EK partnership is why QF haven't bothered upgrading their own J lounge for such a long time.

Problem is that it is not open all day and you sometimes get hassled from the EK lounge staff for attempting to use the EK lounge.

 

[opusman]

True, since they dropped their AKL flights from MEL it's open much less often Never been hassled when entering though.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I thought the use of EK lounges was only on select routes within the partnership agreement? So flying TPAC would be excluded?