Why fly business? I don't see the value?

[extracta]

, but I'm not going to blow over 50% of the budget on less than 5% of my holiday.

People who fly on Air Asia in the cramped seats have the same argument. If you did a bit of research and broadened your choice of airline you would find that you could probably travel more comfortably at a lower price.

 

[Smackbum]

People who fly on Air Asia in the cramped seats have the same argument. If you did a bit of research and broadened your choice of airline you would find that you could probably travel more comfortably at a lower price.

Extracta, you keep inferring that I am a fool that flys Qantas and suffers the ignomy of being behind the ruling class, when I could be in business class on some other un-specified airline.

Please elaborate.

As mentioned before, my family and I (that's 4 people) flew SYD-LHR (QF), GTW-EDI (BA), EDI-HKG (BA), HKG-SGN (CX), HAN-HKG (KA), and HKG-SYD (QF). This cost me $5K and around 450K points. All up. Including taxes.

Now I may be a total newbie when it comes to booking "upper class" tickets, but it never occurred to me that for less money and points I could have flown the family in business class on some other unspecified airline.

Please tell me the name of this airline so that I can use their services next time. Oh, and BTW - this was at peak season (Christmas).

In anticipation of you NOT being able to name this mythical airline, and instead possibly falling back into describing economy-class travel as some sort of concentration camp in the sky, I would like to point out the following :-

• We had lounge access for all departures (even Hanoi)
• We scored a business class upgrade on the overnight SYD-HKG leg
• The status credits for my (paid) flight will keep me in Gold for another year

When I can fly business class without impacting our travel opportunities I will give it some serious thought - though probably not with Qantas - but until then I will maximise my travel value and leave it to others to get fleeced.

 

[extracta]

As mentioned before, my family and I (that's 4 people) flew SYD-LHR (QF), GTW-EDI (BA), EDI-HKG (BA), HKG-SGN (CX), HAN-HKG (KA), and HKG-SYD (QF). This cost me $5K and around 450K points. All up. Including taxes.

Please tell me the name of this airline so that I can use their services next time. Oh, and BTW - this was at peak season (Christmas).

In anticipation of you NOT being able to name this mythical airline.

When I can fly business class without impacting our travel opportunities I will give it some serious thought - though probably not with Qantas - but until then I will maximise my travel value and leave it to others to get fleeced.

The 450K points you mention does have a dollar value even if it is only in a lost opportunity cost.

As an example if you read a number of threads on here in regards to people allocating the QFF points to AA you will notice that they get much better value for money and it is quite possible that the flights that you booked could have been cheaper or in a higher class if you had used their method, and you would have flown on the same metal.

In regards to the mythical airline, their is no one airline, the idea is to do your research and take advantage of available opportunities as they arise. This method has drawbacks and will not suit everyone.

In regards to being fleeced, if you are booking your flights with QF from Australia and using QFF points then you are the one being fleeced. Unfortunately for us all QF want more cash and points for flights than other airlines. QF even charge people booking in Australia more than they charge people booking overseas for the same flights.

There is even a thread on here at the moment where womble123 is trying to book flights but is finding it is more expensive points/cash with QF than with CX/BA (Qantas FF - Business Class to UK - best way to book?)

 

[BadgerBoi]

In regards to the mythical airline, their is no one airline, the idea is to do your research and take advantage of available opportunities as they arise. This method has drawbacks and will not suit everyone.

Until I read this post I'd all but forgotten about flights that I booked for myself and friends a few short years ago, a domestic flights in a developing country on their national "mythical" airline.

The tiniest bit of research showed me that for an extra $US10 each we could move from Y to J for the two hour flight. Three of us chose to shell out the extra, the other three claimed that they didn't see the value in it. They were a family, cried poor and said that it meant $30 for them where it was only $10 each for us (I don't understand the mathematics there, but when people play the "family" card strange things often seem to happen).

We had access to one of the loveliest lounges I've ever come across in what is otherwise a very basic airport, and had a very comfortable flight in a newish plane. Best $10 I've ever spent, and a very cost-effective few minutes worth of research. This wasn't a special deal, it was their standard rate booked over the phone direct with the airline.

Again, my thanks go to those of you, including my thrifty friends, who insist on sitting down the back of the plane thereby freeing up seats at the front for those of us who appreciate the extra comforts.

 

[extracta]

As mentioned before, my family and I (that's 4 people) flew SYD-LHR (QF), GTW-EDI (BA), EDI-HKG (BA), HKG-SGN (CX), HAN-HKG (KA), and HKG-SYD (QF). This cost me $5K and around 450K points. All up. Including taxes.

If Qantas were to allow you to buy that many points the points would cost $12543.

Frequent Flyer - Using Points - Top-up Points

 

[rechoboam]

I don't know about "misguided". I'm self funded and basically I only travel for recreation or conferences when I want to. So instead of flying Y to Paris every year, I might go every few years and go to the Sunshine coast the rest of the time, but fly J to Europe when I go there. Same with conferences. I am flying to the US partly self-funded, partly with a work allowance this time, and partly with points. It's a four day conference and if I had to sleep sitting up for 48 hours it just wouldn't be worth it. Now if I had a sick grandmother in Romania or something and HAD to fly to Europe twice a year, I would go economy because I couldn't afford to fly J all the time.

 

[Blackadder]

For me as a self funded ticket payer, if I choose to go Y+ OR J it is because I have put money aside and planned for the trip to be part of my holiday, rather than just a mode of transport to my holiday destination.

 

[Smackbum]

Until I read this post I'd all but forgotten about flights that I booked for myself and friends a few short years ago, a domestic flights in a developing country on their national "mythical" airline.

The tiniest bit of research showed me that for an extra $US10 each we could move from Y to J for the two hour flight. Three of us chose to shell out the extra, the other three claimed that they didn't see the value in it. They were a family, cried poor and said that it meant $30 for them where it was only $10 each for us (I don't understand the mathematics there, but when people play the "family" card strange things often seem to happen).

We had access to one of the loveliest lounges I've ever come across in what is otherwise a very basic airport, and had a very comfortable flight in a newish plane. Best $10 I've ever spent, and a very cost-effective few minutes worth of research. This wasn't a special deal, it was their standard rate booked over the phone direct with the airline.

Again, my thanks go to those of you, including my thrifty friends, who insist on sitting down the back of the plane thereby freeing up seats at the front for those of us who appreciate the extra comforts.

Fantastic value - and I would have done the same. But the QF J product is not often a $10 uplift and I suspect your developing country's airline (not sure why you didn't name them or the route) doesn't fly out of Sydney to anywhere I want to go.

I think people are losing touch with the subject here - in Australia are domestic or international business class fares good value? I don't think they are, because every business class trip means I sacrifice 3 or 4 opportunities to fly economy (unless I want my mortgage to take a BIG hit). Maybe with airlines other than Qantas they could be had for 2-3 times the economy fare, but I still wouldn't take it. The only times I have flown a "premium" product was when the uplift was 50% or less. That's my personal opinion of the value of business class, but as they say - YMMV.

 

[drron]

Well in 1969 my mythical country was OZ.The mythical airline TAA.It was also $10 to be in F those days rather than Y flying SYD-POM.I figured quite rightly that I would be able to drink at least $10 worth of beer in the time.

 

[RB]

Well in 1969 my mythical country was OZ.The mythical airline TAA.It was also $10 to be in F those days rather than Y flying SYD-POM.I figured quite rightly that I would be able to drink at least $10 worth of beer in the time.

I thought beer was very cheap in Aust in 1969-how long did the flight take in those days?

 

[cove]

Good thinking drron. Was that about a gallon of beer because beer came in those 26 fluid ounce bottles so you only had to drink about 6?The good old days......

 

[BadgerBoi]

Fantastic value - and I would have done the same. But the QF J product is not often a $10 uplift and I suspect your developing country's airline (not sure why you didn't name them or the route) doesn't fly out of Sydney to anywhere I want to go.

I think people are losing touch with the subject here - in Australia are domestic or international business class fares good value? I don't think they are, because every business class trip means I sacrifice 3 or 4 opportunities to fly economy (unless I want my mortgage to take a BIG hit). Maybe with airlines other than Qantas they could be had for 2-3 times the economy fare, but I still wouldn't take it. The only times I have flown a "premium" product was when the uplift was 50% or less. That's my personal opinion of the value of business class, but as they say - YMMV.

I didn't mention the airline because that fare, afaik, still happens and I want to be able to take advantage of it when I return, without competition from people who may google the route and come up with my post. It's unlikely that you would have found that fare because, as you admit in an earlier post, you 'may be a total newbie when it comes to booking "upper class" tickets'. You wouldn't have done the research and found that particular fare. The airline does indeed fly out of Sydney - you make an awful lot of assumptions.

People aren't losing touch with the subject here at all, this thread has remained remarkable on-topic imho. It mightn't be going the way you'd like it to, but that's life.

I'm by no means a high-income earner but for me, business class fares are good value, and my experience travelling back from Paris last Friday in J on AF and QF has reinforced that in me.

 

[simongr]

One of the reasons for flying J for me is to not remember the journey, to not remember the kid kicking me in the back or the stinking obese person next to me.

I dont have much time for holidays for all sorts of reasons so when I do travel I want to travel in comfort.

In terms of the hit to my mortgage - personally I dont mind that - better than leaving it to my kids to enjoy my money after I am gone...

Frankly calling people suckers and accusing them of having brain damage is borderline breaching the forum guidelines and I would suggest desisting before the posts get reported.

 

[dajop]

For me as a self funded ticket payer, if I choose to go Y+ OR .....

Was just thinking about this thread and Y+. I see the value in business but I don't see the value paying a lot more for Y+. A little, maybe even 50% but not double the price of Y. For the rates I see Y+ for flights to LHR on QF anyway, you can probably pay a little bit extra and do J on different carriers, or pay a little less and do Y to somewhere close in Asia and then J for the long flight.

But as per many of the posts, each to his/her own.

 

[extracta]

But the QF J product is not often a $10 uplift and I suspect your developing country's airline (not sure why you didn't name them or the route) doesn't fly out of Sydney to anywhere I want to go.

I think people are losing touch with the subject here - in Australia are domestic or international business class fares good value? I don't think they are, because every business class trip means I sacrifice 3 or 4 opportunities to fly economy (unless I want my mortgage to take a BIG hit). Maybe with airlines other than Qantas they could be had for 2-3 times the economy fare, but I still wouldn't take it. The only times I have flown a "premium" product was when the uplift was 50% or less. That's my personal opinion of the value of business class, but as they say - YMMV.

What people here are getting at is that all of this stuff is situation dependant. People see Value differently.

Your situation may not allow you to chose to fly J with QF with your own money ( I know I am certainly not going to pay the prices they ask)

The idea is to work the situation so as you have more chance of getting what you want.

Some people use credit cards that allow them to allocate points to another airline that has a better earn and burn rate than QFF.

There is no point stamping your feet up and down and saying you want to fly QF J unless your are prepared to fork out the big bucks or have a strategy that will allow you to accumulate the points (does't have to be in the QFF scheme it may be in another oneworld carrier account).

Possibly if the 450K points you spoke of earlier were accumulated differently you would have had a much better spend ability.

Personally I am prepared to take the long way around or a bit of mucking about as long as it gets me the seat I want, at the price I want.

 

[drron]

Good thinking drron. Was that about a gallon of beer because beer came in those 26 fluid ounce bottles so you only had to drink about 6?The good old days......

Mate I share a birthday with David Boon.Also the Australasian Medical student drinking champion in 1965,66-decided to retire unbeaten!It was a doddle.

 

[Sprucegoose]

It's totally self assessed value dependent, as is everything in life. It is not related directly to income or means either. Most J class travelers however do not go without shoes.

 

[gumpy]

I'm half way through my NAN run in Fiji.

J is fantastic. Especially when Y is about 600-800 and the return J ticket is 1.2k to and from Sydney. The fact that you can go to BNE and MEL as well is just a bonus. In the future my trips to Fiji, even the direct ones from SYD will be in J... I'd be happy to use this airline for LAX as well seeing you can do it for about 3k return. I can't afford normal J but when it's as cheap and comfortable as this, a big yes from me. Pity they aren't all this well priced.

The benefit for me is I no longer dread/cringe at the upcoming flight. Instead I look forward to it and as a result everything about the holiday is enjoyable. Normally if I have to go to Europe or the US I really get down about the flights though I do look forward to the holiday and activities.

 

[Smackbum]

One of the reasons for flying J for me is to not remember the journey, to not remember the kid kicking me in the back or the stinking obese person next to me.

Simon - that's no way to talk about your fellow AFF members!

I dont have much time for holidays for all sorts of reasons so when I do travel I want to travel in comfort.

I .. I .. I quite understand - for you it's all about Me .. Me .. Me. But I prefer to take my family with me and do it as often as feasible. So to ME business class is a poor choice.
.

In terms of the hit to my mortgage - personally I dont mind that - better than leaving it to my kids to enjoy my money after I am gone....

Yep - hearing you loud and clear.

Frankly calling people suckers and accusing them of having brain damage is borderline breaching the forum guidelines and I would suggest desisting before the posts get reported.

But it would be OK for me to say you couldn't walk AND chew gum, wouldn't it?

BTW - maybe YOU can tell me how to get to the UK, Hong Kong and Vietnam over Christmas/New Year for $5K plus 450K points ... for four people in business class. Actually I'll give you $7.5K and 700K points because that's the value of business class to ME. And no - I don't want to go to Fiji, thanks very much, but I don't care what airline you use as long as they take QFF points! (Unless I can direct sweep my credit cards to AA).

 

[Misha]

This thread really is quite interesting... and I totally appreciate the irony in this comment coming from me: but perhaps we could address people's reasons for choosing or not choosing J over Y and just accept other people's choices without trying to 'prove' them wrong?...