Buying Qantas tickets online from Bangkok

[dundas]

I have seen other threads about this but wanted to check one fact.
I booked a QF ticket to Melbourne ex Bangkok and paid using my credit cad. Unfortunately I live in Chiang Mai and now am required by Qantas to either go to Bangkok and show my credit card in the office, or pay again in cash and wait for the Qantas office in BKK to give a refund to my credit card.

I am not planning to go to BKK any time soon, and so that leaves one option - which is to pay cash, and request my credit card transaction to be reversed. As I paid using a Which Bank cc I am now up for a double lashing of foreign exchange charges.

When I complained to QF Customer Care (asking if I could show my ticket at the airport like other folk have described on this forum) I got this response (and this is the 'fact' I want to check):

Whilst we appreciate your feedback unfortunately this restriction is a Thailand Government policy and not a Qantas issued policy.

Is it really Thai Government policy? When I fly Bangkok Airways domestically, no such policy is in operation. Does anyone know?

Thanks

 

[Aussie_flyer]

I have seen other threads about this but wanted to check one fact.
I booked a QF ticket to Melbourne ex Bangkok and paid using my credit cad. Unfortunately I live in Chiang Mai and now am required by Qantas to either go to Bangkok and show my credit card in the office, or pay again in cash and wait for the Qantas office in BKK to give a refund to my credit card.

I am not planning to go to BKK any time soon, and so that leaves one option - which is to pay cash, and request my credit card transaction to be reversed. As I paid using a Which Bank cc I am now up for a double lashing of foreign exchange charges.

When I complained to QF Customer Care (asking if I could show my ticket at the airport like other folk have described on this forum) I got this response (and this is the 'fact' I want to check):

Whilst we appreciate your feedback unfortunately this restriction is a Thailand Government policy and not a Qantas issued policy.

Is it really Thai Government policy? When I fly Bangkok Airways domestically, no such policy is in operation. Does anyone know?

Thanks

Absolute rubbish that it is Thai govt policy. You can buy a Jetstar ticket from BKK to MEL one way in thai baht and no problems!

Also I have purchased SQ and TG flights ex-bkk and no problems at all just showing card at check-in.

 

[straitman]

Absolute rubbish that it is Thai govt policy. You can buy a Jetstar ticket from BKK to MEL one way in thai baht and no problems!

Also I have purchased SQ and TG flights ex-bkk and no problems at all just showing card at check-in.

A fairly conclusive answer. Sounds like QF are stretching the truth (again).

 

[dundas]

Absolute rubbish that it is Thai govt policy. You can buy a Jetstar ticket from BKK to MEL one way in thai baht and no problems!

Also I have purchased SQ and TG flights ex-bkk and no problems at all just showing card at check-in.

Thank you for this comment. I think it's rubbish, too, but I wanted to give QF Customer Care the courtesy of verifying their assertions.

I have also recently booked flights online from Chiang Mai on Jetstar and Asiana, both using Thai baht, and there are no such requirements.

Either that, or the entire aviation industry in Thailand (apart from the QF/BA agent) is breaking the law, I don't think so.

My experience from doing volunteer work in Thailand is sometimes when you come across a badly designed procedure, you'll find ludicrous reasons why it can't be changed. That's what I was thinking was the case here. Actually I'm beginning to think it is the best example of its type I've come across!

Pity that it is such a customer-unfriendly process.

 

[Aussie_flyer]

dundas

Do you have a local TA you could use in Chiang Mai to book the tickets? This would probably be your best bet.

Dazz81

 

[Happy Trails]

I've had the same problem but just called QF and they sorted it out while I was on the phone. Didn't charge for it.
They told me to call them direct in future, rather than booking on-line.
Never had any problems with TG or CX though.

 

[markis10]

Absolute rubbish that it is Thai govt policy. You can buy a Jetstar ticket from BKK to MEL one way in thai baht and no problems!

Also I have purchased SQ and TG flights ex-bkk and no problems at all just showing card at check-in.

I am not so sure, each airline has its own requirements and it is quite possible JQ operate differently to QF in that respect, I know there was a delay in being able to purchase tickets with DJ for that very reason.

 

[drron]

I am not so sure, each airline has its own requirements and it is quite possible JQ operate differently to QF in that respect, I know there was a delay in being able to purchase tickets with DJ for that very reason.

But that doesn't make it Thai government policy though.
Last year i bought on line PG tickets BKK-REP andLPQ-BKK as well as Air Asia domestic Thai flights.I know at least one said you need to show CC at checkin on the confirmation i received but i wasn't asked for it when we did checkin.Same is happening with SAS for domestic Norway flights so i am not cutting up my cancelled Visa yet.

 

[markis10]

But that doesn't make it Thai government policy though.
Last year i bought on line PG tickets BKK-REP andLPQ-BKK as well as Air Asia domestic Thai flights.I know at least one said you need to show CC at checkin on the confirmation i received but i wasn't asked for it when we did checkin.Same is happening with SAS for domestic Norway flights so i am not cutting up my cancelled Visa yet.

DJ blamed the lack of an ability to buy a ticket online at launch as an issue with the Thai Government and approvals, and other members have reported issues with other airlines owing to govt regs when it comes to credit cards etc. There are clearly rules that make it not an easy exercise, so to say QF is saying BS would appear to be inconsistent with previously reported experiences from others. A precedent is hardly something that is understood in Asia, nor is uniform government policy equally applied to all and sundry, rather its same same but different .

http://www.frequentflyer.com.au/com...king-v-australia-ex-hkt-19543.html#post268664

http://www.frequentflyer.com.au/com.../buying-tickets-overseas-5390.html#post213309

 

[Aussie_flyer]

Whatever the government policy is - the other airlines manage just fine including British Airways. You can't tell me that the Thai government has specifically said to Qantas- "we wont allow you to sell your tickets online without showing the card used in the BKK office, but we will allow pretty much every other airline to do it... so there!"

 

[markis10]

Whatever the government policy is - the other airlines manage just fine including British Airways. You can't tell me that the Thai government has specifically said to Qantas- "we wont allow you to sell your tickets online without showing the card used in the BKK office, but we will allow pretty much every other airline to do it... so there!"

See the second link, its not just Qantas that have the rule, like I said, same same but different .

Its also required by others, although I suspect not always enforced:

http://www.bangkokair.com/announcement/index.php?lang=en&id_page=credit_card_restriction

 

[Aussie_flyer]

See the second link, its not just Qantas that have the rule, like I said, same same but different .

Its also required by others, although I suspect not always enforced:

Bangkok Airways - Fly different, to feel extraordinary

Bangkok Air require you to show it at CHECK-IN. Qantas require you to present yourself in person at the Qantas agent in Bangkok's city office, no later than 2 days after buying the ticket!

All that we really want is for Qantas to allow online bookings ex-BKK where you have to show the CC at check-in....

 

[NM]

Whatever the government policy is - the other airlines manage just fine including British Airways. You can't tell me that the Thai government has specifically said to Qantas- "we wont allow you to sell your tickets online without showing the card used in the BKK office, but we will allow pretty much every other airline to do it... so there!"

Have you considered that the Thai policy may possibly be that unless the merchant has specific credit card anti-fraud systems in place they must physically sight the card. Merchants with the government approved systems/processes may be exempt from the physical sighting requirement. So it is possible that different procedures are required by Thai law depending on what systems/processes the company is implemented in Thailand.

 

[markis10]

All that we really want is for Qantas to allow online bookings ex-BKK where you have to show the CC at check-in....

I agree with you there, however we just cannot call an airline's excuse as BS when we dont have all the facts at hand and when others have experienced the same thing with other airlines. Governments in Asia and elsewhere are hardly known for their consistent rulings and fair treatment of all and sundry! This thread is very similar in content to a recent one on FT about China and the QF rules there! It could actually be a PCI compliance issue, which is becoming a major issue with merchants accepting cards.

 

[QF029]

They told me to call them direct in future, rather than booking on-line.

When I tried this the fare they could sell be was $AUD1k more than the cheap online fare.

I've heard second hand that they won't cancel the ticket but I've never been game enough to test it.

 

[dundas]

See the second link, its not just Qantas that have the rule, like I said, same same but different .

Its also required by others, although I suspect not always enforced:

Bangkok Airways - Fly different, to feel extraordinary

Firstly, I don’t know what the evidence for the “Thai government policy” is. I have asked QF Customer Care to show me where this policy is written down, but it’s unreasonable for me to expect them to do the research and provide a response instantly. So in the absence of any definitive information about “Thai government policy”, I can imagine that the QF agent in BKK has taken a very narrow interpretation of a broad policy directive (eg, The Thai government expects all business to be pro-active in reducing credit card fraud).

I am flying with Bangkok Airways next month, and know what their procedure is. Simple! Front up to check in with the same credit card used to pay for the booking online. I have no problem with any reasonable effort to reduce credit card fraud.

However, comparing the BKK Airways process to that used by the QF agent in BKK is like comparing chalk and cheese, one is very reasonable and the other is not.

The QF policy is:

1. We accept credit card payments online (kind of, more or less) but you must front up to the office in BKK (round trip ticket from the provinces, anyone?)to show us the credit card within 2 days of online payment or we will cancel your ticket (that message changes from 2 days to 2 weeks in the email they send out).
2. If you don’t like that, we will invoice you, you can pay at a bank, and we will refund your credit card payment. If you don’t do that your booking will “autocancel”. I guess they get to keep the money in that case - it’s not stated.

It’s useful to ask the question “who does this procedure serve?” Assuming that people in the Thai provinces take the second option of those listed above, this is how the QF agent in BKK benefits:

1. Their profit and loss statement is enhanced at the margins - fewer credit card commissions.
2. Cash in the bank is boosted whilst the punter waits for his refund - remember, I have to pay TWICE - once when my credit card is debited, and once in cash, then wait for a refund.

This is a classic win/lose scenario where the institution (Qantas) benefits, whilst the punter (me) loses:

1. By paying foreign exchange fees TWICE to Which Bank (yes - I used their cc by mistake) and
2. By having diminsed levels of cash - whilst I pay in cash for the second time and wait for my refund.

As an example of user design it takes me back to the first BAS statement I ever filled out in 1999 - a complete nightmare for the user, and it turned out that the form was designed to benefit the ATO, not me nor any of the other taxpayers out there. Not even the ATO could get away with that, there was such a howl of protest they were forced to make the process more user friendly.

This process is in that league - quite an accomplishment (inflexible, makes the user pay whilst the institutioun benefits, Bangkok centric). That’s why I saw red when I realised what was happening.

And if it really is a matter of other airlines not complying with specific policy direction, Qantas should be getting DFAT onto their case making representations to the Thai government about how uncompetitive you can be in Thailand when you comply with the law and other airlines don't. If Qantas are doing anything in that direction, they are doing it very diplomatically, I've never heard a bleat.

I did call the QF agent in BKK, and they certainly did not give me the option of showing my credit card at the airport - good luck to those who have been successful in making that request.

My experience of the QF BKK process is that as a user I feel as if I have been scammed. I'm not saying I am, but that's my feeling. I would like to be proven wrong.

 

[dundas]

Have you considered that the Thai policy may possibly be that unless the merchant has specific credit card anti-fraud systems in place they must physically sight the card. Merchants with the government approved systems/processes may be exempt from the physical sighting requirement. So it is possible that different procedures are required by Thai law depending on what systems/processes the company is implemented in Thailand.

That being the case, the Qantas agent in BKK should be well enough established to do the same as every other airline, and have those government approved systems/processes in place. Sorry but there is no excuse for how Qantas customers are treated compared to anyone else.

 

[yohy?!]

I was told the same story when trying to book flights from QF's HKG office.

Suffice to say the 6 clients who I was booking return mixed W/J tickets to Sydney for are no longer flying QF. . .

 

[markis10]

That being the case, the Qantas agent in BKK should be well enough established to do the same as every other airline, and have those government approved systems/processes in place. Sorry but there is no excuse for how Qantas customers are treated compared to anyone else.

Qantas has their own policies and is very clear in terms of specifically publishing them online prior to the purchase of the ticket, if that did not happen to you then you have a complaint had the booking been a phone one for instance, however if you choose to ignore the policy as advertised prior to purchase then wish to argue the toss post sale then I hardly think accusations of unfairness are applicable, I note you make no note of having heeded the policy advice online as part of the booking process but at the same time its not clear that you booked online either.

 

[dundas]

What I am asking should not be hard.

All I want to do is show my credit card at the airport.

Please put yourself in the shoes of the consumer (for just a second, or maybe two) and think through the consequences of bad user design like this, as alluded to in another post. What's wrong with advocating a better case for consumers? Qantas is making money on the margins, and turning off customers for life.

Next time? Easy, I'll ignore whatever is written on the Qantas website, but this time it won't be an expensive mistake. Next time, I'll fly Thai, and it will be a pleasure my credit card at the airport.

Is that too hard?