A letter to Alan Joyce

[Hvr]

Coming back from the states (4 pax) we had a long wait in SYD before our flight back to ADL and the Qantas employee without us even asking suggested a flight that was leaving in only 30 or so minutes which he then transferred us to. No status and on base fare.

Staff seem to have a lot more discretion to flow forward when there is an INT-DOM connection.

 

[Muppet501st]

Just a point of reference, you were on the Red-e- Deal cheapest fare, VA cheapest fare "Getaway" the fly ahead benefit isnt permitted on that fare type.

 

[JohnK]

I imagine you would be known to Q staff there and probably get the benefit. Or maybe they just want to get you out of there quicker!

I'm known to a lot of staff in BNE but there's one particular staff member that assists. Also out of BNE on Friday afternoon/evening the flights are every 30 minutes so easier to get an earlier flight. I get asked many times to go on earlier flight but I usually refuse as I prefer to keep my forward aisle.

In SYD on Saturday/Sunday nights the flights are every 60 or even 90 minutes. The staff member did not know who I was but they could see that weather and connections were in play so helped out.

Flow forward is not something I expect but it's a nice touch when they do listen and care.

 

[Pushka]

Just a point of reference, you were on the Red-e- Deal cheapest fare, VA cheapest fare "Getaway" the fly ahead benefit isnt permitted on that fare type.

Qantas. Same deal though.

 

[cmon0005]

Well, to be honest it was possibly lucky they let you fly at all due to illness coming from overseas. It is a wonder you weren’t seen by Customs on arrival. That happened on one of my flights. One of the crew became unwell and he had to be checked out by a Doctor before we were allowed to disembark. And another couple I know asked to be near the toilet as she was unwell. They were given back row but were later escorted from the plane for health reasons.

Luckily (in a way), she was sick in Australia with a throat infection before we left for Malaysia, prescribed 7 days of antibiotics, we also got the doctor to write a letter confirming what she was sick from and that she was on medication, in case airline staff asked.

She got better as the days went on, however had terrible mucus in her throat which when combined with Milk made her vomit.

The crew on the QF flight from BKK were beyond amazing, they did follow protocol and ask us questions about her health and whether this came on suddenly or not, we then mentioned that she has had this for a while and was on medication, and as long as she remained fine for the rest of the flight they didn't have to call it in.
As it were, once she vomited she had some snacks and water and fell asleep in her own J suite for the remaining 8+ hours of the flight.

 

[Pushka]

Luckily (in a way), she was sick in Australia with a throat infection before we left for Malaysia, prescribed 7 days of antibiotics, we also got the doctor to write a letter confirming what she was sick from and that she was on medication, in case airline staff asked.

She got better as the days went on, however had terrible mucus in her throat which when combined with Milk made her vomit.

The crew on the QF flight from BKK were beyond amazing, they did follow protocol and ask us questions about her health and whether this came on suddenly or not, we then mentioned that she has had this for a while and was on medication, and as long as she remained fine for the rest of the flight they didn't have to call it in.
As it were, once she vomited she had some snacks and water and fell asleep in her own J suite for the remaining 8+ hours of the flight.

And that forethought was very wise then.

 

[Pleb Status]

Just a point of reference, you were on the Red-e- Deal cheapest fare, VA cheapest fare "Getaway" the fly ahead benefit isnt permitted on that fare type.

For a further point of reference, only the bottom three fare classes are Getaway. Fly Ahead is available on all other fares. The QF Red Edeal effectively spans the VA Getaway and Elevate fare classes.

The QF P1 Fly Ahead benefit is/was only available of Flexi fare classes, which is equivalent to the VA Freedom fare class.

 

[whughes3]

Staff seem to have a lot more discretion to flow forward when there is an INT-DOM connection.

Same for Dom -> Int: This actually happened to me last month when I arrived fairly early for such a trip.

 

[mviy]

Same for Dom -> Int: This actually happened to me last month when I arrived fairly early for such a trip.

Well missed connections do have a cost for QF so they'd rather play things safe where possible. A tight connection leading to a passenger missing a flight is not ideal especially for Dom -> Int connection if your bags were sent on an earlier flight, loaded and they have to take them off again.

 

[whughes3]

Well missed connections do have a cost for QF so they'd rather play things safe where possible. A tight connection leading to a passenger missing a flight is not ideal especially for Dom -> Int connection if your bags were sent on an earlier flight, loaded and they have to take them off again.

In my case, the connection time (scheduled and actual) was quite comfortable; in over 20 years I can recall only maybe a couple of occasions when I have been pulled forward due to possible misconnection.

 

[mviy]

There's always the risk of unexpected delays to your first flight leading to a misconnection even though they may be very small, so flow forwarding makes good Business sense.

 

[Edge]

I'm only making these assumptions based on the tone and content of the letter, but the way the OP handled the first two objections may have had something to do with the reason the subsequent "fly-ahead" was cancelled.

 

[Jack_OC]

Just a point of reference, you were on the Red-e- Deal cheapest fare, VA cheapest fare "Getaway" the fly ahead benefit isnt permitted on that fare type.

For a further point of reference, only the bottom three fare classes are Getaway. Fly Ahead is available on all other fares. The QF Red Edeal effectively spans the VA Getaway and Elevate fare classes.

The QF P1 Fly Ahead benefit is/was only available of Flexi fare classes, which is equivalent to the VA Freedom fare class.

I think Muppet was responding the following part of the OP's letter: "Virgin Platinum flyers have this as a scheduled benefit where they are able to fly earlier should they arrive at the airport before their scheduled flight, if there is a spare seat on an earlier flight then they are welcome to it."

The fact is that VA Platinums are not entitled to the Fly Ahead benefit when travelling on the cheapest fare category (Getaway). In fact, my understanding is that Virgin Getaway fares cannot be changed on the day of travel under any circumstances (even for a fee), so a VA Platinum on a Getaway fare actually has even less ability to Fly Ahead than a QF Platinum on a Red eDeal.

Pleb Status is of course also correct that the Red eDeal category spans a much broader range of fare classes, and in any case, QF Platinums don't have a Fly Ahead benefit on any fare class, so there is certainly a difference between the two programs here. However, it's just not accurate to say that VA Platinums "are welcome" to any spare seat on an earlier flight, at least not without qualification.

 

[opusman]

QF won't upgrade to fill a cabin if they don't need to necessarily. After all they would prefer it if everyone/most flying J paid for those seats

A points upgrade is a form of payment though!

If there are empty seats in J there's no reason why an ODU using points should be declined in the lounge.

 

[mviy]

They may have insufficient catering for more pax to fly in J, they may want a CL passenger flying J to have a shadow. There are multiple reasons why they may want to not fill J when they don’t have to.

 

[opusman]

Catering isn't an issue as they can make the ODU conditional on catering not assured, they have had this for years.

I'm pretty sure I remember an (actual) enhancement from a few years ago where QF specifically promised that all unsold domestic J seats would be available for points ODUs, or did I imagine that??

 

[JohnK]

I never quite understand airlines allowing flights to take off with empty seats. An empty seat on a flight about to take off is money wasted and an empty seat on a later flight is potential income.

And yes I do understand flights are priced differently and the theory behind flexible tickets.

 

[dajop]

I never quite understand airlines allowing flights to take off with empty seats. An empty seat on a flight about to take off is money wasted and an empty seat on a later flight is potential income.

I'm sure the software that airline yield managers use is very good at estimating the probability that an empty seat will be sold in the future, and therefore understanding its potential income. This is why fly forward (for those on the less flexible fares) does happen at the request of the airline, but not at the request of the customer.

If there's 30 empty seats on a later flight, there may be almost zero chance that all 30 will be sold, so why move someone forward, when all you will be doing is training them to buy cheaper fares (as they think they may be able to move forward when they need to)? If there's 2 empty seats, well the probability of generating new revenue is probably much higher, therefore the airline proactively offers passengers the chance to move forward.

It's a combination of behavioural science and statistics ...

 

[Denali]

I never quite understand airlines allowing flights to take off with empty seats. An empty seat on a flight about to take off is money wasted and an empty seat on a later flight is potential income.

And yes I do understand flights are priced differently and the theory behind flexible tickets.

So you're anti shadow?

 

[JohnK]

So you're anti shadow?

I'm all for getting people home and not leaving too many issues for the last flights of the night.

Qantas pro-actively offers flow forward when it suits them so only fitting to listen to and action certain flow forward requests.

Not all of them but some would be ok. "I've spent all night in hospital with a friend" is one such situation. It costs nothing to them.

And yes I do realise that everyone and their dog will ask for flow forward but so be it. Limit the requests to one or 2 flights forward to weed out those that book the 8:00pm cheapie and turn up at 8:00am.