AJ Speech to American Chamber of Commerce - confirms 2800 Qantas job losses

[amaroo]

Jetstar?


Sent from the Throne

Yes, Jetstar...last time I looked it was an airline

 

[777]

Yes, Jetstar...last time I looked it was an airline

I think the question was about "from scratch"?

The IR framework was set up by someone else (Impulse).

The capital came from somewhere else (Qantas).

Much of the fleet came from somewhere else (Impulse and Qantas in the early stages).

Many of the routes were gifted to it by someone else (Qantas).

And FWIW the terminals, Frequent flyer program, lounge access, and were handed to it by someone else (Qantas).

So... what is your definition of "from scratch"?

 

[amaroo]

Most of us have managed to not massively destroy the value of the things we have been given the chance to run, control or manage. So we are mostly way ahead of Joyce on that front.

History is littered with peaks & troughs - wasn't that long ago Toll gave DJ away for free

Toll quits Virgin Blue, books $1.3 billion loss | Crikey

 

[777]

History is littered with peaks & troughs - wasn't that long ago Toll gave DJ away for free

Toll quits Virgin Blue, books $1.3 billion loss | Crikey

Indeed. And that was bad management. What's your point? The fact that Joyce is a bad manager does not get magically better because there have been other bad managers around.

 

[amaroo]

Indeed. And that was bad management. What's your point? The fact that Joyce is a bad manager does not get magically better because there have been other bad managers around.

Well when QF is given away for nothing - you might have a point

Like I said - the man started an airline, ran an airline & made lots of money.....simple facts

 

[777]

Like I said - the man started an airline, ran an airline & made lots of money.....simple facts

Not simple facts at all... You said the man started an airline "from scratch." He didn't. You are now saying he "made lots of money" but the value he has destroyed is far greater than the money he has made.

Simple question: how much money has Jetstar made when he was running it and how much value has qantas lost while he has been running it?

 

[amaroo]

Ok, I get it.....you simply dislike the bloke - Fair enough.

I could post all night and not make an ounce of difference with your opinion of the man!

You seem happy to see the negatives - so I'm going to leave them with you.

 

[RWJ777]

Not simple facts at all... You said the man started an airline "from scratch." He didn't. You are now saying he "made lots of money" but the value he has destroyed is far greater than the money he has made.

Simple question: how much money has Jetstar made when he was running it and how much value has qantas lost while he has been running it?

I don't think that's right or fair. He did establish the airline; it may have been a subsidiary with inputs from the parent but the business model was entirely different and he implemented it. All start ups have the benefit (and burden) of inputs from related organisations. And Jetstar has been a profitable business.

I can see Joyce rebuilding the architecture of Qantas to make it competitive years into the future. Sure, the current metrics are not so hot but the strategy is sound and it has legs for long term realisation. I think he's a genuine talent and Qantas is lucky to have his vision and tenacity.

 

[medhead]

Yes, Jetstar...last time I looked it was an airline

You might try reading the rest of my post, it doesn't say Jetstar isn't an airline. It says that it is easy to set up a successful airline when the market is handed to you on a platter. My question was whether you were referring to some other airline that was actually hard to set up and run successfully.

As for the comments about jetstar making money. It would be interesting to add up all the numbers and compare to QF and then work out how much of the money jetstar is making is at the expense of QF.

 

[Happy Trails]

I think he's a genuine talent and Qantas is lucky to have his vision and tenacity.

Generous too; VA, EK, EY, CX et al are all sharing that luck.

 

[nlagalle]

Most of us have managed to not massively destroy the value of the things we have been given the chance to run, control or manage. So we are mostly way ahead of Joyce on that front.

Are you referring to the share price or the assets of the company?

 

[777]

Ok, I get it.....you simply dislike the bloke - Fair enough.

I could post all night and not make an ounce of difference with your opinion of the man!

You seem happy to see the negatives - so I'm going to leave them with you.

I don't "dislike the bloke". I have no personal opinion on him whatsoever. I am countering two very specific points you have made: 1. That he started a successful airline from scratch and 2. That he has "made lots of money" for Qantas. On reasonable evidence both these claims simply aren't true.

 

[JohnPhelan]

If I could go and live in China and get citizenship, would that make me Chinese?

If you are a Chinese citizen, then yes, you are Chinese.

 

[JohnK]

I am sorry if this sounds too simple but in my opinion the quicker Alan Joyce goes the better chance Qantas has of surviving.

 

[Paddy55]

I don't think that's right or fair. He did establish the airline; it may have been a subsidiary with inputs from the parent but the business model was entirely different and he implemented it. All start ups have the benefit (and burden) of inputs from related organisations. And Jetstar has been a profitable business.

I can see Joyce rebuilding the architecture of Qantas to make it competitive years into the future. Sure, the current metrics are not so hot but the strategy is sound and it has legs for long term realisation. I think he's a genuine talent and Qantas is lucky to have his vision and tenacity.

I can't agree with either point.

In my opinion JetStar benefitted from all manner of bit s and bobs from QF... Routes, hardware, mgmt expertise, the QF FF program, and the 'glow' of the QF brand... Invaluable combination of building blocks.

If he has a vision for QFi I've seen no evidence of it, except 'reduce routes and talk down' its prospects