Am I Really So Out of Touch?

[bossreggie]

Yes my suggestion/thinking is limited to getting in touch with those near and dear, rather than just anyone. Anyway, it is a pointless suggestion, just a bit of random thinking.

I really liked what you wrote though. It truthfully made me cry. It's why my signature is what it is.

I've now lost both my parents and my brother. Trust me when I say....... The people I love in my life, never have a day go by when I don't remind them.

 

[bossreggie]

A number of people I've associated with in the workforce would say that a Doctor earning £70k a year (or more) would also be out of touch with 'normal' people.
As you noted, I think it's more the value he places on his career that would have been the driver to his comment.

I don't think it's neccesarily the amount of money that people earn, IMHO it's what they contribute into relationships (and by this I mean personal, family, work and community relationships) and how they interact with these people that keeps people grounded and 'normal'. As simongr noted, flying coach or limiting spending isn't going to make anyone more 'in touch'; it may give you more insight into what a difference having available money can make to a person's lifestyle though.

Personal traumas such as you have recently gone through often act as a catalyst for introspection and change, and although the comments noted above may seem a bit harsh I think you're heading down the right track in reviewing how you fit in into the world.

Good luck and please keep us updated!

If I could have liked this post 50 times. I would have. Thank you. This is why I love this community.

 

[bossreggie]

OT but acceptable IMHO.

I lost my Father (suddenly) over 25 years ago and Mother last October. I still think fond thoughts of them both nearly every day. Because of that we work very hard to ensure that we keep a great relationship with both of our kids (and their kids).

Bill. It is a big regret of mine that I was so caught up in what was happening in my life. I didn't stop to tell you how sad it made me when your Mother passed. You and I had discussed it a lot. From her going into a home etc. We knew it was inevitable but it still hurts.

I was lucky enough to be holding Mums hand when she died. But with Dad. He went into hospital feeling unwell and within 12 hours he had died. I was in Italy he was in Perth.


I promise we will catch up for a drink soon. You're a man I consider to be a friend and we can toast our parents.

 

[chrisb]

Guesting into lounges is cheating. Having to sit in an airport terminal with thousands of people and not being able to shower after a 14 hour flight while waiting for another 8 hour flight. That's flying economy.

As for the job. It seems a bit pointless. As others have said, you can give it up at any point. Go do some charity work. Actually interact with poor people. Understand their misery and lack of hope then see if you can use your money to do some good.

 

[bossreggie]

Guesting into lounges is cheating. Having to sit in an airport terminal with thousands of people and not being able to shower after a 14 hour flight while waiting for another 8 hour flight. That's flying economy.

As for the job. It seems a bit pointless. As others have said, you can give it up at any point. Go do some charity work. Actually interact with poor people. Understand their misery and lack of hope then see if you can use your money to do some good.

i won't be doing the coach trip without lounge access. I'm not going to lie about that.

The reason for me wanting to work in a kitchen of a great restaurant is because food and wine are 2 of my passions. I'd love to have my own upmarket guesthouse and I'd love to be good enough to cook for my guests.

I have not done any volunteer work as such and to be fair it is not something I particularly wish to do. I do however contribute well in excess of $1Million to charity each year and I believe that I have a responsibility to give as I am able.

I'm about to set up a charitable fund in Australia to ensure that long after I'm gone, people less fortunate get some opportunities I never had.

Even here on AFF. I am always happy to contribute to a worthy cause and I hope this doesn't change.

 

[chrisb]

i
The reason for me wanting to work in a kitchen of a great restaurant is because food and wine are 2 of my passions. I'd love to have my own upmarket guesthouse and I'd love to be good enough to cook for my guests.
.

So is this about getting back in touch or is it more of a midlife crisis and trying to get some passion in your life?

Regardless of the money, simply being forced to work at set times 5 days a week and do what you're told when you're told will bring you back to reality. The small cheque at the end of the week will also reinforce that. Imagine living on that.

Finally - thanks for what you do give to charity. What you do give is a substantial amount and I'm sure it's very much appreciated.

 

[Must...Fly!]

I wouldn't even know where to start with most of this discussion. Some things I (thankfully) have not had to deal with in my life yet. I have only had two people close to me pass away. Though someone from my final year of school recently passed - it does make you wonder how much time you have left, to make the most of today and tomorrow if you get it.

With regards to the flying to Auckland - bossreggie, normally I'd say go for it but it is not comfortable and it is a LONG trip (the perception of time changes when bolt upright for a 14 hour flight...). If you really want to do it, I respectfully suggest you take the premium cabins to Asia (e.g. Singapore) then take an economy day flight(s) to Auckland. Or economy to DXB then F/J the rest of the way depending who you fly. You will get some decent flying experience in Y but also keep it bearable.

 

[ALH]

Time in the kitchen starting as the lowest of the low will be a good thing for me.

I'm guessing that tasting the peanut sauce is going to be a fairly low point!

 

[chrisb]

You will get some decent flying experience in Y but also keep it bearable.

Oh piffle. Thousands of people do 24hour+ long haul journeys in economy every day. There's probably people in here that do it monthly. It's not going to kill him.

That said, NONE of them do it by choice.

 

[MarcB]

bossreggie - I don't know you at all, other than what I've learnt about you reading your many posts. My observations, however, are that you are someone who manages to feel great empathy for many of the people on this forum and, I suspect, in your life. This is a far greater reflection of the person you are then the car you drive or the class you fly. Being on an average wage does not make someone more "in touch" and it certainly doesn't make you a better person somehow. We all know plenty of a*holes on average incomes - many of whom are not just "out of touch" but also arrogantly self-entitled.

That you have a charmed life is not the measure of who you are as a person.

If you feel that working in a low-paid role or flying Y is what is needed to remind you of what you don't have, then I say do it. Although I largely suspect that you already know what you have, and are thankful for it. Certainly I think the stories of your generosity towards other AFFs on here is evidence of that.

I really do hope you find what you're hoping to or looking for out of these experiences.

My partner and I are fortunate that we do share a passion for travel - our only issue is finding enough time (and resources) to do as much as we like. We get to AKL, NYC and Europe with semi-regularity, so next time we are headed off somewhere, I'll be sure to PM you and let you know. Perhaps we can catch up for a drink and you can let us know how you went on your journey. Feel free to do the same.

 

[straitman]

And...... book a night into a Travelodge "hotel" for £19/night

IF you do this then please take photos as I am not about to go there :!:

 

[Moody]

I am a bit of a fish out of water in this forum, yet you have never come across as an arrogant bumhole to me. OK - perhaps arrogant, but with a sort of endearing insouciance that lets you get away with it.

But your plans to deliberately mix with the common people are not going to change you or make you a better or worse person. You don't have to travel in Y to know what it is going to be like, just as I don't need to travel in F to know what I am missing out on. And you're right - giving up lounge access is a bridge too far.

So by all means break out of the (very) comfortable rut you are in, but I think you should expand your network rather than contract it if you are truly on a quest for enlightenment.

 

[penegal]

If you want to catch up for a fosters at a wetherspoons in London (I don't know what else could be more humbling) let me know....

Flashware has been for drinks with me in London. Probably not a Fosters man myself!

Always time to try new things.....

I would like to see a photo of BR holding a fosters can and also drinking out of it. LOL,

LOL

Why Fosters? It's not even owned by Fosters anymore

You haven't lived until you have suffered the indignity of being kicked out of Public Bar on a Monday night after overindulging on $1 pots of Geelong Bitter.

 

[QF WP]

Perhaps the problem is when both sets of people (rich and poor) have a sense of entitlement that is out of proportion to the situation. Again axiom my grandmother taught me was "It is always better to give than to receive, because in giving you do receive". Most people don't take the time after the giving, to receive. Sometimes the most heartfelt and simple "thank you" is all you need to know that you made a difference in their life. Giving doesn't need to be money or clothes, it can be knowledge.

It would be well worth remembering that when things start getting too personal in this Community.

 

[docjames]

I'm going to be contrarian and say "why are you bothering?"

Having money, not having money, doesn't make you in touch or out of touch. Doesn't make you value people more or less. Certainly you've been generous to those on this forum. I have no doubt there are plenty of others in your life to whom you are equally (or more) generous.

I'm not clear what you'll achieve by this "measure of austerity" but i'd argue
a) it's not really that meagre - if you are including an AMG Mercedes and travel "doesnt count" (my parenthesis)
b) it has no reflection of who you are
c) is unlikely to suddenly bring "perspective".
d) what will you do when invited to CL/IO functions? People earning 20k dont get invited to these events typically - will you refuse or is that "travel"? If you go, what will you wear? Cant afford expensive clothes on 20k/year.

So really, how far do you have to (or are you prepared to) go to be "in touch"?

GBP 20k/year?
GBP 70k/year?
UK or Aus defined poverty line?
African Village? Afghani rural life?

I guess the definition will vary.

Good luck if you decide to go ahead, but personally, I don't see the point. Everyone's life is different. How you treat people is not determined by money. What you get back from the people you interact with isn't determined by money either. What makes you happy isn't determined by money - the money just lets you have ease of access to different things, and different things to make you happy. Some of the wealthiest people I know are profoundly unhappy. Some of the poorest people I know are happy with their "lot". And there's plenty of happy rich people, and unhappy poor people.


Once again, money itself doesn't make you "in touch" or "out of touch".



Should I dredge up the past (? a couple of years ago I believe you mentioned on AFF) when you lost the bet with your son about travelling Y to Europe but ISTR that didn't eventuate - what makes you determined to follow through / go ahead this time?

I think it's an interesting concept. I guess I'm not convinced someone's personality or life changes that dramatically based purely on access to money. Others will no doubt disagree with me (this is AFF after all!)

Best of luck either way.

 

[chrisb]

Cant afford expensive clothes on 20k/year.

Actually he said 20000 pounds per month.

Or AUD$347,000 per year. plus travel expenses.

 

[vitagen]

Still waiting for you to drop by to Per for a drink!

 

[bossreggie]

I can assure you docjames that I am not considering giving everything up to get in touch with the common people. (That's in my head now too BTW)

For me, it is about some things that have been said to me in the past week by people that actually matter to me. Do I think for a second that flying coach across the world will re-define who I am? Not a chance. But maybe........ and this is what I'm actually hoping for.......... Just maybe, I will begin to appreciate these things I have in my life again.

I know what you mean about money not being related to happiness. I've been both happy and sad in my life.

I think the big change in my thinking has been my Dad dying this week. It has made me ponder things and question my lifestyle. I'm not particularly religious or I may have posted my thoughts on a spiritual website.

I have truly appreciated the posts of many AFF members though. And like I've said many times before. I don't have to agree with them. We are a diverse community.

 

[bossreggie]

Still waiting for you to drop by to Per for a drink!

I will soon. I promise. My Dads funeral is in Perth!!

But we had better do dinner as well. #js

 

[AVC]

Hmmm, what is out of touch? Out of touch with who? Or what?

Most execs are pretty much out of touch. If you were the CEO of a high end restaurant chain, then there's a good chance you would be out of touch with the boys in the kitchen. In this case, hitting the kitchen for a few weeks would open your eyes. Not sure what your role is now, or the role that you are planning on (but I'm sure it's not going to be like a kitchen hand). And if it was going to be some super-subordinate position, I give you a week. Two weeks tops.

I have a passion for cars, but I'm not about to get a job in a car yard washing them because of it.

I'm a tactician. A middle manager. I'm in touch with the boots on the ground. The exec team are so far out of touch it's almost unbelievable. Retarded policy. Retarded decisions. And nearly exclusively they all used to be at the bottom. That's out of touch. Why? They don't listen. And, they don't consider what their decisions will have on others. Which is important, at any level. Consideration. How will what you do affect the ones around you?

I don't think flying in Economy will do you any favors. If you're comfortable in First. Fly First. But, have consideration for the cabin crew and the rest of the passengers. For you, I don't think that's an issue. And indeed, most premium flyers seem to have more consideration than some of the idiots in Y. It's about attitude. the out of touch ones are ones who have no consideration.

Which brings me to relationships. It's about sacrifice. And consideration. Certainly not about how much money we bring to the table. I have a friend who truly believes that it's very important for partners to have some ventures that don't involve the other half. You need some time out time. There's some sound logic in that one. It's all give and take. Sometimes you have to take the cough. Having said that you need to have a few shared interests.

By the look, you already have plenty of consideration. But, give your venture a go. And best of luck with it. And don't think for a second that I'm having a go at you, or anyone here. If my opinions make someone, somewhere, be a bit more considerate, it's all good.

*I can see Bossreggie pleading with the CSM before they finish climbout, btw.