An Awful Qantas Experience That Must Be Shared.

[juddles]

If we are going exactly by the English language I'm not sure I'd agree the crew are 'suffering'

back at you!

 

[juddles]

....I don't see a problem with passengers asking for compensation. The hope is that in future, remedial or contingency actions by the airline will be lower than the cost of the compensation, and act as a motivation.

But why should the airline bear the cost of things like weather that are out of their control? Why shouldn't pax have to bear the financial brunt of a service that ends up costing more than what the ideal was?

Airlines operate in an environment where weather is a factor out of their control, yet they still have to offer a ticket from A to B a year in advance? IMHO pax have grown to expect, BECAUSE of the amazing reliability that airlines have achieved minimizing these factors, that they can select an exact flight a year in advance. But when the weather Gods play unnice, the expectation is that the airline pays for this?

As for the grabbing buses, would you make the financial call to get buses mobilized when you do not know how long the delay will be? Do you know for certain that said buses were parked up, ready with drivers, just in case such a situation occurred? Has any airline ever used the buses option? I am not saying this is not the case, I am just wondering if it is a real option, rather than simple idealist ideas? (taking into account that Air France apparently took a certain amount of buses - I have been in one of several simultaneous holding patterns over Dubai - I think there were 80 planes aloft in holding that day - that is a lot of buses!)

 

[MEL_Traveller]

But why should the airline bear the cost of things like weather that are out of their control? Why shouldn't pax have to bear the financial brunt of a service that ends up costing more than what the ideal was?

Airlines operate in an environment where weather is a factor out of their control, yet they still have to offer a ticket from A to B a year in advance? IMHO pax have grown to expect, BECAUSE of the amazing reliability that airlines have achieved minimizing these factors, that they can select an exact flight a year in advance. But when the weather Gods play unnice, the expectation is that the airline pays for this?

As for the grabbing buses, would you make the financial call to get buses mobilized when you do not know how long the delay will be? Do you know for certain that said buses were parked up, ready with drivers, just in case such a situation occurred? Has any airline ever used the buses option? I am not saying this is not the case, I am just wondering if it is a real option, rather than simple idealist ideas? (taking into account that Air France apparently took a certain amount of buses - I have been in one of several simultaneous holding patterns over Dubai - I think there were 80 planes aloft in holding that day - that is a lot of buses!)

Yes - if you read my post, this is exactly what Air France did. They got buses and their pax were on their way to DXB after a couple hours. And I acknowledge there is a cost, but that's what you consider in risk management.

The weather is out of the airline's control. But the choice of route is not. DXB is known for fog. Europe and northern America is known for snow in winter and airlines have a commercial incentive to keep flying so they pay for de-icing - do they charge this to passengers on snow and ice days? Preparing for fog in DXB might not be that much different.

 

[Happy Trails]

There's the PR aspect too.
I wonder what the cost / benefit would be if they spent less on maudlin ads and more on service recovery (in general)?

 

[juddles]

Yes - if you read my post, this is exactly what Air France did. They got buses and their pax were on their way to DXB after a couple hours. And I acknowledge there is a cost, but that's what you consider in risk management.

The weather is out of the airline's control. But the choice of route is not. DXB is known for fog. Europe and northern America is known for snow in winter and airlines have a commercial incentive to keep flying so they pay for de-icing - do they charge this to passengers on snow and ice days? Preparing for fog in DXB might not be that much different.

Exactly - air france did that - so even less buses available.

And Dubai is known for delays - isn't Qantas reverting to SIN?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Exactly - air france did that - so even less buses available.

And Dubai is known for delays - isn't Qantas reverting to SIN?

Soooo... you arrange with the company to come back and pick yours up after they have dropped off AF’s? Who knows for sure. But it seems there may have been potential options to be explored in all these things.

 

[DeSchmidt]

Soooo... you arrange with the company to come back and pick yours up after they have dropped off AF’s? Who knows for sure. But it seems there may have been potential options to be explored in all these things.

Whilst AF’s response was great, there is a big difference between their situation and that of QF: the AF flight was terminating in Dubai. Even if QF bussed all passengers to Dubai airport, the only ones benefiting would be those disembarking in Dubai or thos3 continuing on EK codeshares. The QF plane intended to take the rest of the passengers to London would still have been at the wrong airport, and still needing repairs. Lot of effort for little reward IMHO.

 

[RooFlyer]

But why should the airline bear the cost of things like weather that are out of their control? Why shouldn't pax have to bear the financial brunt of a service that ends up costing more than what the ideal was?

Airlines operate in an environment where weather is a factor out of their control, yet they still have to offer a ticket from A to B a year in advance? IMHO pax have grown to expect, BECAUSE of the amazing reliability that airlines have achieved minimizing these factors, that they can select an exact flight a year in advance. But when the weather Gods play unnice, the expectation is that the airline pays for this?

Well, they don't have to offer the ticket A to B a year in advance, or at any time, but the airlines choose to.

I guess the short answer re the airline pays is that its always the airline's call as to how to delay and where and they would have factored such costs into the price of a ticket (they have a LOT of data), so yes, the passengers do ultimately pay.

I'll say the same as I did last time this sort of topic came up. If not all, then those airlines who care to be known as 'responsible' need to have contingency plans for all the likely diversions. For places they don't have a presence in (ie those they don't usually land into), they should have an 'at call' agent. So, when the advice comes, and except for a dire emergency landing it will nearly always be at least an hour in advance of touchdown, the pre-determined plan can be put into action, either by airline reps or the 'at call' agent. I dunno, but:

1. Contact local ground operations (this is beyond the aircraft obviously telling them 'we are inbound') - check the info on file about whether the airport have steps etc to take the plane; is the terminal available for use by xx_ pax?

2. If needs be, start booking hotels.

3. If needs be, put ground transport on stand-by or arrange, depending on situation.

4. Prepare info for pax to their mobile phones, or e-mails, whatever was given at time of booking - send basic info as soon as possible; more detailed later. Not all will get it - but its better than shouting at the airport.

and so on. Yes, this will cost more ... probably quite a bit, but how much does it cost in cash and reputation when things go pear-shaped after a diversion?

The 'problem' with Qantas I think is that they have such a strong brand and semi-captive audience that they can often afford to treat pax like mushrooms and just work things out as they go along. I'm sure they've done the sums.

I wonder why some airlines are pro-active in service recovery and compensation, whilst others do the bare minimum?

 

[harvyk]

I guess he figures people flying in Y wouldn't normally eat at Rockpool.

Then he'd be wrong, I both flown Y and eaten at Rockpool on the same day.

 

[JohnK]

Then he'd be wrong, I both flown Y and eaten at Rockpool on the same day.

Same.

 

[laffer]

Whilst AF’s response was great, there is a big difference between their situation and that of QF: the AF flight was terminating in Dubai. Even if QF bussed all passengers to Dubai airport, the only ones benefiting would be those disembarking in Dubai or thos3 continuing on EK codeshares. The QF plane intended to take the rest of the passengers to London would still have been at the wrong airport, and still needing repairs. Lot of effort for little reward IMHO.

I really have to disagree with that. The reward was not being stuck on a grounded plane for 12 hours. A moving bus and hopefully being able to move around a terminal in Dubai (eat, move, drink and generally try to be entertained) would have been worth it all up. The lack of action from QF is disgraceful. It might not have been there fault but the response was shocking.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Whilst AF’s response was great, there is a big difference between their situation and that of QF: the AF flight was terminating in Dubai. Even if QF bussed all passengers to Dubai airport, the only ones benefiting would be those disembarking in Dubai or thos3 continuing on EK codeshares. The QF plane intended to take the rest of the passengers to London would still have been at the wrong airport, and still needing repairs. Lot of effort for little reward IMHO.

Left home 20+ hours before the diversion to Al Ain with little sleep in economy? Getting on a bus within two, three or four hours and going straight to a hotel for 6 or 8 hours for a shower, something to eat and a nap would be preferable. To me at least. One of the points of QF going via DXB was for connections to EK. So there may have been a fair few passengers in that situation.

These passengers were on the plane for 24 hours. I think that's unreasonable.

 

[eric2011]

Sometimes, it ends up being “time and place” that dictates a less than acceptable trip.

Perhaps we can include "attitude" in with time and place

 

[shane2603]

I Just returned from PER-SIN-JNB in J on Singapore Airlines. The service was excellent on all flights, food was fantastic with book the cook including Lobster and Prime Rib. We were all offered the desert and the cheese platter. Plenty of orderable snack including noodles if you were still hungry. The connections weren't horrible with access to Silverkris lounge in Singapore.
The only issue/surprise was the hardness of the new business bed on the A350. We all found it too hard to sleep on and it really requires more padding to be comfortable. I did manage to grab row 11 so foot space wasn't a problem. It certainly beats the OPs Qantas experience.

 

[eric2011]

To the OP, please don’t pay attention to negative comments made mostly by posters who only like to attack others and make no real contribution to this forum. They are small minority and most regular posters here are nice and helpful.

Oh come on, seriously, do you really think there are that many "others" who "like" to attack others deliberately. And at what stage to you consider "others" who don't agree with the poster, to make a "real" contribution.

 

[UP4014]

Sure, but it does not detract from the fact that Qantas is ripping people off.

Can you please tell us what you paid.

I've been on the same flights without issue other than the interior a bit worn but I don't expect a brand new seat everytime I get on an aircraft.

 

[Flying Fox]

Maybe a bit off topic but as per someone's comment earlier that fog is a regular event at DXB and given that DXB has deep pockets, why don't they have Cat III ILS such that aircraft can land in fog (I'm not a pilot so I stand to be corrected if I'm talking about the wrong technology)???

Hence this situation can be avoided.

 

[Deleted member]

Can you please tell us what you paid.

I've been on the same flights without issue other than the interior a bit worn but I don't expect a brand new seat everytime I get on an aircraft.

Yes, I too would like to know.

 

[UP4014]

Yes, I too would like to know.

Yes the OP infers he was ripped off, so until we know how much he may have in fact got a bargain.

 

[serfty]

locking thread for review