Another AAdvantage versus QFF thread

[hedge]

This may be a really stupid question, but why do people choose to be member of AAdvantage rather than QFF?

 

[serfty]

Generally awards are cheaper ... less points/miles ... less

...

Other than that, see post #1 of this thread.

 

[hedge]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

Generally awards are cheaper ... less points/miles ... less

...

Other than that, see post #1 of this thread.

Toying around with the QFF point calculator. 1 way to SIN is 30 000 points, with AA its 40 000?

 

[serfty]

Toying around with the QFF point calculator. 1 way to SIN is 30 000 points, with AA its 40 000?

AAdvantage do not have one-way flights - that's 40,000 return. Also, for the return booking (and 60,000 points with Qantas),

will be about AUD380; with AA perhaps $50.

 

[hedge]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

AAdvantage do not have one-way flights - that's 40,000 return. Also, with Qantas

will be about AUD380; with AA perhaps $50.

Thank you, I found the AAdvantage table a little hard to read. Well that seals the deal then. I can understand why AA is better for FFlyers. Only problem is getting points into the system via alternate methods other than flying !

Is it possible to use QFF points to upgrade a flight redeemed via points on the AAdvantage system?

 

[NM]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

This may be a really stupid question, but why do people choose to be member of AAdvantage rather than QFF?

Last weekend I booked an award trip, so here is a real life example. I wanted to travel in style (First Class and Business Class when F is not available) to Kuala Lumpur and Bangkok. I used QFF web site and Cathay Pacific Asia Miles web site to find flight availability and compared the "cost" of redeeming the same flights with both QF and AA programs. The flights are as follows:

BNE-MEL (QF Business Class)
MEL-HKG (CX First Class)
HKG-KUL (CX Business Class)
KUL-HKG (CX Business Class)
HKG-BKK (CX First Class)
BKK-SYD (BA First Class)
SYD-BNE (QF Business Class)

With AA, this itinerary for two people cost a total of 360,000 miles plus US$243.

With QF, this itinerary would have cost 725,000 points plus around A$1800.

Considering I have earned the AA miles at a higher rate than QF points (earnings from actual flying) and the award cost me half the number of miles than QF and a fraction of the cash co-payment amount, I think its clear that for my situation AA is a much better program.

Similarly last time I made an award redemption (3 x business class seats to Auckland), QF wanted 3 times the points and 5 times the cash as AA cost for the exact same flights.

 

[Dave Noble]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

Thank you, I found the AAdvantage table a little hard to read. Well that seals the deal then. I can understand why AA is better for FFlyers. Only problem is getting points into the system via alternate methods other than flying !

Is it possible to use QFF points to upgrade a flight redeemed via points on the AAdvantage system?

The points difference becomes even more marked with business/1st class travel.

If it is 30k one way to SIN using QF points, a return trip in premium economy will be 90,000 points , business will be 120,000 and In 1st class it would be 180,000 points. All will have fuel fines to add

With AA , a return trip would be 70,000 points plus taxes in business or 90,000 plus taxes in 1st.

With AA the redemption cost for 1st is the same as premium economy from QF

Dave

 

[simongr]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

Thank you, I found the AAdvantage table a little hard to read. Well that seals the deal then. I can understand why AA is better for FFlyers. Only problem is getting points into the system via alternate methods other than flying !

There are two issues I have with the AA system - the ability to get points into the system from other sources for maximum return and the fact that status earning is based more around the number of trips than premium miles flown.

In relation to mileages from other sources though it is not that simple to critique AA. Using Daves example of the SYD-SIN trip. I did the exact flights - booked a return for me using QFF points and one way for mrssimongr in F using AAdvantage miles. To fund the two using Amex I would have had to have points as follows:

SIN-SYD using QFF:

AMex MR points 90K -> QFF points 90K + $250(ish)

If that had been a return it would have been:

Amex MR 180K -> QFF 180K + $500(ish)

SIN-SYD-SIN on AAdvantage:

Amex MR 227K -> SPG 75K -> AAdvantage 90K + $100ish

So an extra 40K miles but $400 less in cash - quite even really...

Factor into that if you are Plat on AA (equiv of QF SG) you get 100% status bonus rather than 50% - then the maths gets really complex

Is it possible to use QFF points to upgrade a flight redeemed via points on the AAdvantage system?

No, but if you reach top tier on AA you get 8 free upgrades and if you reach mid tiers you get 500 mile upgrade vouchers for every 10K miles flown.

Remember if you have no status with QF then you are unlikely to have that upgrade come through anyway. And for the price of the upgrade on QFF you can often get an award seat guaranteed in the cabin of choice for the same points...

 

[drron]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

However you cant upgrade an AA award flight even with an AA EVIP.

 

[simongr]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

Thats the same for QF though.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

Thanks simongr...interesting stuff.

So say for business that would be...

SIN-SYD using QFF for Business:

AMex MR points 60K -> QFF points 60K + $250(ish)

If that had been a return it would have been:

Amex MR 120K -> QFF 120K + $500(ish)

SIN-SYD-SIN Business on AAdvantage:

Amex MR 176 -> SPG 58.3 K -> AAdvantage 70 K + $100ish

So an extra 56 ish K miles but $400 less in cash - so still quite even really but tilting QF's way.....

With SQ.....if one can get a saver Busines = 90 K and 90 MR +taxes (about $450 as plummeting dollar!!!) = cheaper on SQ, though the saver means flying on "older" business. A new jet such as the SQ 234
(B777-300ER) would be 76500 each way or 153K or 153 MR + $450.


So I guess a question then for people who would be looking to get a large proportion of their Award Flights from MR is what is the availability of flight redemptions on AA like?

In my case for flights originating in Australia?



(((In my case I only pay for about 6 domestic flights per year and mainly fly internationaly using Awards....so my potential flight earn for AA would be small.)))

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

Well that seals the deal then. I can understand why AA is better for FFlyers. Only problem is getting points into the system via alternate methods other than flying !

Yes AA can be If you fly a lot....

You mention in another thread that you might get 10 flights this summer (but maybe not if the compnay uses Virgin instead!! or if the QF flight booked is not an eligibleAA earn).....so I guess the question for you to consider is this Summer a one of or is it the start of actually flying frequently for a while?

You really need paid International flights to boost your AA earn along.

So you might want to calculate what AA points you would earn on the flights vs QF earn (remember that QF has a 1000 point minimum per flight).

Would this give you enough for an AA redemption? Will you keep earning in future by flying?

With QF you can more easily add points from a number of sources and in particular credit cards with sign on bonuses.

 

[NM]

Re: The great points transfer to AAdvantage

So an extra 56 ish K miles but $400 less in cash - so still quite even really but tilting QF's way.....

If all your FF account points/miles come from Amex, then the equation is indeed marginal. I earn more miles from frequent flying and I am earning AA miles at least as fast (and sometimes faster) than QF points for the same flights. So for a frequent flyer, the pendulum swings well in favour of AA when it comes to premium cabin redemptions.

If you are a frequent spender rather than a frequent flyer, then your situation is likely to be different.

So I guess a question then for people who would be looking to get a large proportion of their Award Flights from MR is what is the availability of flight redemptions on AA like?

Award availability for is exactly the same for AA and low-status QF members. High status QF members get better availability for QF flights. However, in my experience the availability of premium cabin awards is much better on the likes of BA and CX than on QF even with high QFF status.

For example, I was looking for F seats between Australia and HKG and BKK. I was looking in the time range of 300-350 days out. I did not see one QF F seat available over that time, but did find BA F seats (generally multiple on the same flight) most days and CX F seats (again multiple per flight) at least 2 or 3 days each week.

QF and AA members have exactly the same access to BA and CX premium cabin award seats. So unless you have Gold or Platinum FF status with Qantas, the award availability is the same.

The only other difference is that QF FF members get access to QF award seats 353 days ahead while AA members have to wait until 330 days ahead for QF award seats.

 

[ArseneV]

Thanks for taking the time to post all this info guys!
Makes a lot sense now why most of you are members of AA now.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

To complete the set..economy..
So that would be...

SIN-SYD using QFF for Economy:

AMex MR points 30K -> QFF points 30K + $180 ($204 other way)

If that had been a return it would have been:

Amex MR 60K -> QFF 60K + $384

SIN-SYD-SIN Economy on AAdvantage:

Amex MR 126 -> SPG 42ish K -> AAdvantage 50 K + $100ish

So an extra 66 MR points but $280 less in cash - so now tilting QF's way if mainly geeting points from MR as opposed to flying.....

In my case I get very Cheap QC membership...so on QF Tickets I get to use the International QC...a big plus.

Another factor bein an Oz resident I get various points from other earn that I can only get for QF easily.

As I normally redeem for 5 for family holidays my past redemptions have been mainly Economy....thought I do now have enough in MR for Business on SQ for 4.

Depending how the No Limit Amex Promo goes that may change for some more future flights.

 

[serfty]

AA gives a minimum of 500 EQP/EQM/RDM for any Qualifying flight - this includes most classes (including O class red e-deals) on QF posted to AA. Avoid N, E & Q classes and award flights.

If you get to Platinum status you earn a minimum of 1000 RDMs.

 

[NM]

AA gives a minimum of 500 EQP/EQM/RDM for any Qualifying flight - this includes O class red e-deals on QF posted to AA.

If you get to Platinum status you earn a minimum of 1000 RDMs.

And, if like me you have a reasonable number of CX flights, the fact that AA pays the status bonus for CX flights while QF does not can mean a better earning rate on AA. Similar benefit towards QF is you have a lot of BA flights.

But one of my favourites is the 8 x EVIP upgrades given to AA EXP members. These can be used for confirmed upgrade and not have to waste points/miles and play an upgrade lottery. I have never failed to be able to apply an EVIP when wanting.

 

[simongr]

And, if like me you have a reasonable number of CX flights, the fact that AA pays the status bonus for CX flights while QF does not can mean a better earning rate on AA. Similar benefit towards QF is you have a lot of BA flights.

But one of my favourites is the 8 x EVIP upgrades given to AA EXP members. These can be used for confirmed upgrade and not have to waste points/miles and play an upgrade lottery. I have never failed to be able to apply an EVIP when wanting.

The lack of bonus on BA is a pain but not insurmountable. I am more likely to fly to the UK on CX or heaven forbid QF than BA and if flying TATL I can't fly BA.

I am going to be giving away a couple of eVIPs to an old friend to up him to J flying to the UK from the US

The sad part for me next year is that due to very few (meaning 0) planned flights to the US I wont have a chance to use them - I am missing the NYC trips more than using the eVIPs

 

[Shano]

And, if like me you have a reasonable number of CX flights, the fact that AA pays the status bonus for CX flights while QF does not can mean a better earning rate on AA

More and more of my flights now are to Asia, which CX serves very effectively via HKG. I have avoided CX to date based on this factor, preferring to fly QF instead as much as possible (as well as fully utilising WP status).

I may struggle to retain WP in the future so a change to AA is becoming more appealing if a choice between SG and AA Plat.

But then there are the points UG's on QF, which are a bonus when only flying Y....... decisions, decisions.......

 

[serfty]

AA gives a minimum of 500 EQP/EQM/RDM for any Qualifying flight - this includes most classes (including O class red e-deals) on QF posted to AA. Avoid N, E & Q classes and award flights.

If you get to Platinum status you earn a minimum of 1000 RDMs.

It's just came out this will change from January 1st 2009.

• Minimum Mileage Guarantee For Elite Status Members

What it means is that a non statused AAdvantage member will no longer have a minimum earn of 500 EQM's.

See this thread:

• http://www.frequentflyer.com.au/com...nimum-mileage-guarantee-15101.html#post199718