Are A380's safe enough to fly? [hairline cracks found in wings]

[oz_mark]

The latest on German newsmagazine Spiegel is that Qantas has grounded all its A380s until repairs are done... Anyone know more?

Haarrisse in den Flügeln: Qantas stoppt A380-Flüge - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten - Wirtschaft (Sorry- it's in German, bad enough that SMH and the likes are completely ignorant towards the news for now...)

Just the one A380 AFAIK.

But apparently all A380's in service (all airlines) are going to be inspected for cracks.

 

[Berlin]

I just tried a Google search and found nothing to that affect.

Yep, I just saw that as well. Wouldn't be the first time that Australian news shows up on Spiegel hours before the Australian media so let's see- I'm just quoting what they say and that article specifically mentions "all their A380s".

 

[amaroo]

Yep, I just saw that as well. Wouldn't be the first time that Australian news shows up on Spiegel hours before the Australian media so let's see- I'm just quoting what they say and that article specifically mentions "all their A380s".

Gotta love the image below the QF take off:shock:

 

[drron]

Well I found this article re ALL 380s being grounded-
Superjumbo Airbus A380 Grounded in Wing Crack Scare - International Business Times

Aircraft-maker Airbus has been ordered to ground and check the wings of every A380 superjumbo in service - less than six months after the flagship passenger jet started operations for some of the world's biggest airlines.

Though another article suggests just all to be checked-
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20120208-704241.html

 

[drron]

And now the BBC are saying that it is just all 380s to be checked-
BBC News - Airbus to inspect all A380 superjumbos for wing cracks

Ai

rcraft maker Airbus has been ordered to check all A380 superjumbo planes currently in service after cracks were found in wing components.
The European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) has ordered all 68 Airbus A380 superjumbo planes currently in operation to be checked.
Last month, EASA ordered checks of 20 A380 jets worldwide.

So it looks like spiegel got this one wrong.Haven't been taken over by Rupert have they?

 

[straitman]

This story was not available two hours ago so I'm sure it will be updated quickly. Also a little more info in it about OQA.


Qantas Discovers Cracking In A380 Wing Parts


Feb 8, 2012


[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: storyAuthor, align: left"]By Adrian Schofield [email protected][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: left"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: storyBody, align: left"]

Qantas has temporarily grounded one of its Airbus A380s while it waits to hear whether the manufacturer recommends any fixes for hairline cracks discovered in wing rib feet.

The airline describes these cracks as “minor,” unlike the more serious – or type two – cracks that led to the European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) issuing new inspection guidelines for the wing parts. Qantas found cracking in about 35 rib feet, out of about 2,000 in an A380 wing.

Qantas has sent inspection results to Airbus, and the manufacturer will advise if any repairs are needed, or if the carrier is simply required to inspect the aircraft again during its next maintenance check. Either way, the airline expects the aircraft to be back flying within a week.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Must...Fly!]

Some part of me sees 80A diminishing from view

 

[dfcatch]

If I get subbed from my 388 F in a cpl of weeks I'm gonna be very upset!!

 

[jb747]

Whilst I am not at liberty to pass on everything I hear, I can say that ALL of the aircraft ARE NOT grounded. The single aircraft that is on the ground was the one involved in the turbulence event a couple of weeks ago, and Airbus have required some extra checks be done on it. That requires entry to the fuel tanks, and as such requires a week on the ground.

It's due back on line in a few days, so I expect that most of the seats that you are worried about a quite safe.

 

[dfcatch]

Whilst I am not at liberty to pass on everything I hear, I can say that ALL of the aircraft ARE NOT grounded. The single aircraft that is on the ground was the one involved in the turbulence event a couple of weeks ago, and Airbus have required some extra checks be done on it. That requires entry to the fuel tanks, and as such requires a week on the ground.

It's due back on line in a few days, so I expect that most of the seats that you are worried about a quite safe.

Excellent news JB

 

[Berlin]

Excellent news JB

Glad to hear that Spiegel was wrong in this case, got a trip to La coming up fairly soon

 

[NM]

Given that the aircraft are not going to be inspected while in the air, it is quite accurate to suggest they are being grounded for the inspections. I am sure this is just Qantas and Airbus taking the easy option to perform the inspections on the ground rather than in the air or under water, but hey, it makes sense to me to ground an aircraft while doing the inspection.

And while the term "all" may also be accurate, in that all of the Qantas A380 fleet will be inspected (and inspected on the ground), the use of the word "all" does not necessary mean concurrently or immediately.

So a headline such as "Qantas to ground all its A380 aircraft for wing inspections" may really mean that they will be inspected (on the ground) one at a time, over a period of days/weeks/months or even when the next routine inspection becomes due.

[Note this is in no way trying to interpret what Qantas is actually doing regarding A380 wing inspections, merely suggestion how a media headline can imply things that may not be completely accurate]

 

[The Rok]

Given that the aircraft are not going to be inspected while in the air, it is quite accurate to suggest they are being grounded for the inspections. I am sure this is just Qantas and Airbus taking the easy option to perform the inspections on the ground rather than in the air or under water, but hey, it makes sense to me to ground an aircraft while doing the inspection.

And while the term "all" may also be accurate, in that all of the Qantas A380 fleet will be inspected (and inspected on the ground), the use of the word "all" does not necessary mean concurrently or immediately.

So a headline such as "Qantas to ground all its A380 aircraft for wing inspections" may really mean that they will be inspected (on the ground) one at a time, over a period of days/weeks/months or even when the next routine inspection becomes due.

[Note this is in no way trying to interpret what Qantas is actually doing regarding A380 wing inspections, merely suggestion how a media headline can imply things that may not be completely accurate]

According to this article the checks will be done over the coming weeks, so yes, you are right, they are not "grounding the fleet" as it was put. I do sometimes wonder that the unions are thinking though, I was of the understanding that they did not run the airline, were not its maintenance managers and were not contracted to carry out maintenance work, so how is this any of their business? I think they need to spend more time fighting FOR their members instead of ATTACKING their members employer.

Qantas A380 checks two months late: union

But Australian Licensed Aircraft Engineers' Association (ALAEA) federal secretary Steve Purvinas said while the inspections were necessary, they should have been made sooner.
Mr Purvinas said cracks were first discovered in the so-called "wing rib feet" - the metal brackets that connect the wing's ribs to its skin - in a number of A380s in the global fleet months ago.
"We've been calling for these checks to take place for two months now," Mr Purvinas told AAP

 

[lovestotravel]

From what I have heard ALL A380's will be grounded (one by one) and this will mean some 744 substitutions.........

 

[drron]

The sayings of Mr. Purvinas become sillier with time.surely what he is doing is deliberately damaging the QF brand putting his members jobs at further risk.
But just for him-the cracks were discovered whilst repairing the A380 Nancy Bird Walton.Despite having those cracks in the wing and then suffering a catastrophic engine failure where the wing was punctured in several places by pieces of that engine the wing stayed on the aircraft.It retained its structural integrity so allowing the plane to land.Surely this is proof that these cracks are not a major imminent threat to the A380.
The cracks on the A380 currently"grounded"are the same as those found initially.Why then Mr. Purvinas should the inspections have occurred earlier.Your foot is in serious danger of "trench foot" seeing the amount of time it spends in your mouth.

 

[maninblack]

The sayings of Mr. Purvinas become sillier with time.surely what he is doing is deliberately damaging the QF brand putting his members jobs at further risk.
But just for him-the cracks were discovered whilst repairing the A380 Nancy Bird Walton.Despite having those cracks in the wing and then suffering a catastrophic engine failure where the wing was punctured in several places by pieces of that engine the wing stayed on the aircraft.It retained its structural integrity so allowing the plane to land.Surely this is proof that these cracks are not a major imminent threat to the A380.
The cracks on the A380 currently"grounded"are the same as those found initially.Why then Mr. Purvinas should the inspections have occurred earlier.Your foot is in serious danger of "trench foot" seeing the amount of time it spends in your mouth.

Irrespective of the comments of Mr Purvinas you seem quite certain about the engineering issues here. I assume therefore that you an aeronautical engineer with particular expertise and knowledge of the structural components and engineering details of the A380 and that you have been briefed by Airbus or perhaps Qantas about the exact nature of the cracking that is occurring. Can you provide us with a little more detail?

 

[nlagalle]

According to this article the checks will be done over the coming weeks, so yes, you are right, they are not "grounding the fleet" as it was put. I do sometimes wonder that the unions are thinking though, I was of the understanding that they did not run the airline, were not its maintenance managers and were not contracted to carry out maintenance work, so how is this any of their business? I think they need to spend more time fighting FOR their members instead of ATTACKING their members employer.

Qantas A380 checks two months late: union

I don't recall Steve spouting this 2 months ago..

 

[jb747]

The European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) has expanded a previous Airworthiness Directive (AD) regarding the inspection of the wings on A380s, for possible cracks.
A previous AD, which became effective on the 24[SUP]th[/SUP] January, followed the discovery of cracks in the wing brackets on a number of A380s and applied to aircraft that had accumulated up to 1,800 flight cycles. The latest directive, which mandates “a so-called High Frequency Eddy Current inspection of the wings”, applies to all A380s in service.
Aircraft that have accumulated less than 1216 flights will have to be inspected upon completion of 1300 flights. Aircraft between 1216 and 1384 flights must be inspected within six weeks of 13 February 2012. Aircraft that have completed more than 1384 flights will have to be inspected within three weeks of the date of the latest AD, which was the 8 February.
The Agency said that it is working closely with Airbus “to ensure the continuing safe operations of the A380 aircraft type. In accordance with EASA, Airbus has established a repair scheme if cracks are found during the inspection. In parallel EASA and Airbus are working on a long-term fix to be defined by the summer of 2012”.

A day is a long time in aviation.

 

[drron]

Irrespective of the comments of Mr Purvinas you seem quite certain about the engineering issues here. I assume therefore that you an aeronautical engineer with particular expertise and knowledge of the structural components and engineering details of the A380 and that you have been briefed by Airbus or perhaps Qantas about the exact nature of the cracking that is occurring. Can you provide us with a little more detail?

Well you must-a/ be joking.
b/just like to have a go at people.
c/have not read the numerous links in this thread.

1/The wing cracks were found when the A380 in SIN was being repaired-Fact.
2/That A380 suffered a catastrophic engine failure-Fact.
3/The wing was pierced by several engine fragments-Fact
4/The plane landed with the wing still attached-Fact.
5/The cracks were there when the engine failure occurred-OK not a fact but common sense tells me yes because-
6/the A380 now grounded has the same type of cracks-Fact
7/QF and airbus state that these cracks are due to a manufacturing,design problem-Fact
8/Trench foot is caused by exposure to damp unsanitary conditions-Fact.
9/Mouths are humid places occupied by lots of infective agents-fact.
10/Mr. Purvinas often has his foot in his mouth-OK conjecture but many agree with me.

So for my statements to be wrong you need to prove to me that at the time of the engine failure the Nancy Bird Walton did not have wing cracks and that there was another cause of the cracks found in the presently grounded A380 thereby contradicting the manufacturer-I presume you have the knowledge to do so.

 

[maninblack]

Well you must-a/ be joking.
b/just like to have a go at people.
c/have not read the numerous links in this thread.

1/The wing cracks were found when the A380 in SIN was being repaired-Fact.
2/That A380 suffered a catastrophic engine failure-Fact.
3/The wing was pierced by several engine fragments-Fact
4/The plane landed with the wing still attached-Fact.
5/The cracks were there when the engine failure occurred-OK not a fact but common sense tells me yes because-
6/the A380 now grounded has the same type of cracks-Fact
7/QF and airbus state that these cracks are due to a manufacturing,design problem-Fact
8/Trench foot is caused by exposure to damp unsanitary conditions-Fact.
9/Mouths are humid places occupied by lots of infective agents-fact.
10/Mr. Purvinas often has his foot in his mouth-OK conjecture but many agree with me.

So for my statements to be wrong you need to prove to me that at the time of the engine failure the Nancy Bird Walton did not have wing cracks and that there was another cause of the cracks found in the presently grounded A380 thereby contradicting the manufacturer-I presume you have the knowledge to do so.

Where did I ever say you are wrong I was simply interested in your expertise in the matter. I don't profess any.