Article: Airlines, Please Stop Selling Ridiculously Tight Connections

[frodo]

I/we don't need this stress. We need time to relax.

Noone is forcing you to book these tight connections - you can simply pretend they don't exist and look for something more suitable for your needs.

I prefer to have these connections available to be booked if I feel like it's suitable and if missing the connection does not cause many issues.

 

[Sprucegoose]

I enjoy tight connections, as they can open more attractive options and enhance bargaining positions when things don't work.

 

[JohnK]

Noone is forcing you to book these tight connections - you can simply pretend they don't exist and look for something more suitable for your needs.

I prefer to have these connections available to be booked if I feel like it's suitable and if missing the connection does not cause many issues.

That'd be OK but that's not always the case. And yes we always have the choice but that choice could come at a hefty cost which defeats the purpose.

e.g. Booking on Webjet and select outbound legs and the return from BKK-SIN-BNE only has one option which is 9:30pm BKK-SIN followed by 12:30am SIN-BNE. There are another 4-5 earlier flights ex-BKK that are not offered. Yes can try find these flights on SQ website or another OTA at a hefty increase in cost.

Why try to flog the 9:30pm BKK-SIN? Because no one wants it? I prefer the 6:30pm or 3:30pm BKK-SIN so I can have a few hours to relax in lounge and have something to eat.

In the end I waited and waited and changed plans ever so slightly and we're now going ex-SYD for ~$700 less than ex-BNE with ~9 hours overnight transit on outbound and ~3 hours transit on inbound.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

That'd be OK but that's not always the case. And yes we always have the choice but that choice could come at a hefty cost which defeats the purpose.

e.g. Booking on Webjet and select outbound legs and the return from BKK-SIN-BNE only has one option which is 9:30pm BKK-SIN followed by 12:30am SIN-BNE. There are another 4-5 earlier flights ex-BKK that are not offered. Yes can try find these flights on SQ website or another OTA at a hefty increase in cost.

Why try to flog the 9:30pm BKK-SIN? Because no one wants it? I prefer the 6:30pm or 3:30pm BKK-SIN so I can have a few hours to relax in lounge and have something to eat.

In the end I waited and waited and changed plans ever so slightly and we're now going ex-SYD for ~$700 less than ex-BNE with ~9 hours overnight transit on outbound and ~3 hours transit on inbound.

The bigger question is why pay webjet’s extraordinary high fees?

I think you’re right, the later 930pm flight in your example is cheaper because SQ wants to feed traffic onto selected flights for the cheaper price. This might be because demand is limited for the 930pm, but it might also be that they can keep seats for the earlier flights to sell for higher prices, or to connect to other destinations. Or, by filling the cheaper seats on the 930pm with connecting traffic, they can charge a premium for the seats left for those just wanting to go to SIN.

 

[JohnK]

The bigger question is why pay webjet’s extraordinary high fees?

2 reasons

- Webjet was actually cheaper on this routing (they may have had a sale at the time but the other reason could also be that we arrive into SIN at 12:30am and depart for BKK at 9:30am and most hate those sorts of transits where as we love them if it means we save money)
- I love using Afterpay (pay in 4 instalments by end of March when I booked flights in January)

 

[frodo]

That'd be OK but that's not always the case. And yes we always have the choice but that choice could come at a hefty cost which defeats the purpose.

e.g. Booking on Webjet and select outbound legs and the return from BKK-SIN-BNE only has one option which is 9:30pm BKK-SIN followed by 12:30am SIN-BNE. There are another 4-5 earlier flights ex-BKK that are not offered. Yes can try find these flights on SQ website or another OTA at a hefty increase in cost.

I guess that is a problem. Another way of looking at it is if the tight connection wasn't offered, you would not have this extra option to select and would be forced to book the more expensive options with longer connection times.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

VA862, the 1630 with service from Sydney to Melbourne is scheduled to commence boarding at 1600.

The inbound aircraft is on time. Landing at 1550.

Tight connections aren’t the issue, it’s ridiculous scheduling like the above

 

[CaptJCool]

VA862, the 1630 with service from Sydney to Melbourne is scheduled to commence boarding at 1600.

The inbound aircraft is on time. Landing at 1550.

Tight connections aren’t the issue, it’s ridiculous scheduling like the above

If the jet is Airbus
It’s 1 2 3 baggage containers FORKLIFTED Orf and bang 1 2 3 on

It’s a 10 minute turn-around

If it’s a BOEING Well then baggage handlers get a real workout bag by bag by bag 180 bags or more one at a time

 

[Himeno]

My first (solo) overseas trip in 2005 had a DL flights FLL-OAK via SLC.
The connection was shortish, no longer remember how short it was planned to be, but the inbound from FL was late and had around 10 mins to get to the next flight.
I rushed from one concourse at SLC to the other. I made it in time, only for the flight to be held for "late connecting passengers" (which turned out to include the seat kicking vomiting kid sitting behind me from the prior flight).

 

[AIRwin]

VA862, the 1630 with service from Sydney to Melbourne is scheduled to commence boarding at 1600.

The inbound aircraft is on time. Landing at 1550.

Tight connections aren’t the issue, it’s ridiculous scheduling like the above

Looks like VA862 still ended up arriving in MEL on time

 

[dajop]

VA862, the 1630 with service from Sydney to Melbourne is scheduled to commence boarding at 1600.

I see reference again and again to "commence boarding" in relation to connections (particularly on FlyerTalk). But it's the conclusion of boarding that is the critical time. For domestic probably not such a big difference, but for example at SIN, many don't realise that it's not the sign that flashes "gate open" that is critical, it's T-10 when the gate closes that is the important time to have reached the gate by.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I see reference again and again to "commence boarding" in relation to connections (particularly on FlyerTalk). But it's the conclusion of boarding that is the critical time. For domestic probably not such a big difference, but for example at SIN, many don't realise that it's not the sign that flashes "gate open" that is critical, it's T-10 when the gate closes that is the important time to have reached the gate by.

yes, but not always for the purposes of off loading pax. Friend of mine last year was connecting off AY in SIN to QF. AY was about 10 mins late, pax could have easily made the QF flight, but they’d already been off loaded and put onto JQ leaving 30 mins later.

once you fall below MCT airlines can, and do, off load. even if the connection is doable

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 12:11 AM

Looks like VA862 still ended up arriving in MEL on time

Thanks to take off at the terminal end, and being the only plane waiting to go.

if we’d had to go down the bay end, and if we were two or three in line… probably late.

 

[alexczarn]

Based on my last experience in HKG this is another that can be tight, IIRC the MCT is around 50 minutes. I seem to recall prior to covid there was areas that you could de-board go through security and get back into the terminal quite quickly. On my last trip I had to jump on the train to get back towards immigration, go through security and then back into the terminal. This can be quite time consuming if you arrive at the gates close to 47/48 or 66/67 and then need to get back to the same vicinity.

They must still exist because I used one of them in October to transit between flights with a 1hr MCT thanks to my incoming flight delay

 

[SYD]

They must still exist because I used one of them in October to transit between flights with a 1hr MCT thanks to my incoming flight delay

I have a copy of the main terminal map on my iPad to remind me where the smaller in between screening points are. Sometimes they’re behind you but it’s quicker to go the other way to them then the big main screening points.

HKG often have walkers waiting to escort PAX with tight connections.

 

[jsoprano]

I've done aircraft to airside NRT-HND connections, in both directions, in 80 mins a number of times.

Stupid question, but how do you do that in 80 mins if the transit in between the two is pretty much 1+ hour alone? I mean it's 80 kms in distance, every planner I look at shows me, even at 2am in the morning, it takes about an hour between the two, with a speeding taxi driver maybe 50 mins I guess?

I assume no checked luggage and probably a JP passport or residency card to speed up immigration?

Really curious.

 

[Himeno]

Stupid question, but how do you do that in 80 mins if the transit in between the two is pretty much 1+ hour alone? I mean it's 80 kms in distance, every planner I look at shows me, even at 2am in the morning, it takes about an hour between the two, with a speeding taxi driver maybe 50 mins I guess?

I assume no checked luggage and probably a JP passport or residency card to speed up immigration?

Really curious.

Depends on the timing of arrival. If the aircraft door opens before the immigration rush, you can get through into to baggage claim in minutes. Baggage is almost always fast in Japan.

The bus timetable uses the worst case transfer times along a standard route (eg, the expressway through Tokyo and Chiba). The bus company monitors traffic conditions and reroutes buses to avoid the worst traffic. Depending on the traffic, the bus can reroute through the Aqualine and avoid a lot of the traffic through Chiba. The Tokyo/Yokohama end of the Aqualine is right next to HND.

The bus between airports itself can take anywhere from 45 to 75 mins, depending on the time of day, which route is used and the traffic conditions.

The only time travel from NRT to anywhere in Tokyo has taken me more then an hour has been when I use the normal JR train (not the Narita Express) or used the N'Ex to somewhere past Tokyo Station.

It is doable to make the transfer between airports, including immigration, baggage collection and transport confirmation/boarding in 80 mins if everything works out timing wise with no delays. You need no line at immigration, bags coming out as you get into baggage claim and the bus ready to go just as you get on.

 

[jase05]

AA are selling a ticket CLT-MIA-GND with only 55 minutes at MIA. Having not travelled through the US is this doable for a D—>I transfer?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

AA are selling a ticket CLT-MIA-GND with only 55 minutes at MIA. Having not travelled through the US is this doable for a D—>I transfer?

Yes. No outbound immigration control. And you’ll already be in a sterile area having completed security in CLT. Simply walk from one gate to the next.

 

[jase05]

Yes. No outbound immigration control. And you’ll already be in a sterile area having completed security in CLT. Simply walk from one gate to the next.

Cheers, just read a few horror stories of the train at MIA being out of order currently so was a little nervous plus I’ve just realised it will be the 4th of July. I might just check everything in though in case I have to run
The flight is actually LGA-CLT-MIA-GND but has overnight stop of 11hrs in CLT so we will stay at one of the nearby hotels.

 

[jsoprano]

Depends on the timing of arrival. If the aircraft door opens before the immigration rush, you can get through into to baggage claim in minutes. Baggage is almost always fast in Japan.

The bus timetable uses the worst case transfer times along a standard route (eg, the expressway through Tokyo and Chiba). The bus company monitors traffic conditions and reroutes buses to avoid the worst traffic. Depending on the traffic, the bus can reroute through the Aqualine and avoid a lot of the traffic through Chiba. The Tokyo/Yokohama end of the Aqualine is right next to HND.

The bus between airports itself can take anywhere from 45 to 75 mins, depending on the time of day, which route is used and the traffic conditions.

The only time travel from NRT to anywhere in Tokyo has taken me more then an hour has been when I use the normal JR train (not the Narita Express) or used the N'Ex to somewhere past Tokyo Station.

It is doable to make the transfer between airports, including immigration, baggage collection and transport confirmation/boarding in 80 mins if everything works out timing wise with no delays. You need no line at immigration, bags coming out as you get into baggage claim and the bus ready to go just as you get on.

Thanks for that. I was really curious because when I use Google Maps or Apple Maps to simply plan the drive from say T1 NRT to T2 HND (assume an ANA connection), then it never comes up with less than 60 mins trip time, even in the middle of the night. That's by car, not by bus or train that run to schedules. To hear that the bus can actually make it in 45 mins at times is surprising.