Ask The Pilot

[MEL_Traveller]

further investigation explains that the ding coincides with gear up and gear down and used to control the no smoking sign and the interior exit signs if this is selected to the AUTO position in the flight deck (emergency lighting systems remain armed).

now smoking is banned, the only remaining thing tied to this is the illumination/extinguishing of the exit signs.

 

[jb747]

well, whatever the term is, the exit sign does not illuminate until the gear is down and I think stops extending (the sign does not come on as soon as the gears start to go down cause you can hear the noise from the airflow and that's not when the sign comes on)

This is the wording relating to the EXIT signs from the 380 manual:

No Smoking SW
ON -The NO SMOKING signs and the EXIT signs come on in the cabin. An associated low tone chime sounds in the cabin.
AUTO-The NO SMOKING signs and the EXIT signs come on automatically in the cabin, when: The slats are extended, or The main landing gear is extended. An associated low tone chime sounds in the cabin.
OFF-The NO SMOKING signs and the EXIT signs go off in the cabin. Depending on the CIDS programming, an associated low tone chime sounds in the cabin.

further investigation explains that the ding coincides with gear up and gear down and used to control the no smoking sign and the interior exit signs if this is selected to the AUTO position in the flight deck (emergency lighting systems remain armed).

now smoking is banned, the only remaining thing tied to this is the illumination/extinguishing of the exit signs.

The signs work as they always did. A ding related to this still makes no sense. The signs are still commanded on (exit, no smoking and seat belts) until the slats are retracted. That's a long time before, and after, gear extension.

 

[Tortuga]

When you are told to go into a holding pattern due to delays how and what distance do you set the turn radius, is it a setting or is the flying done manually? I spent 2 hours above Bangkok doing circles a few years back because the Thai Royals had decided they needed the airport. Not great fun !! Do you have any opinions on the Embraers? I am a passenger on the Embraer 190 monthly and find them quite nice, no idea what they are like up front for the pilots and safety.

 

[sail0r]

My books (!) are devoid of an explanation. ...

It may be in the cabin crew manual...they do have some secret information. Our million page book covers doors in about 2 pages.

I suppose, in an emergency, the people up the front have done a magnificent job in getting to the stage where the doors are still able to be used. After that, leave it to the FA's to sort the doors out and get everyone off safely.

 

[markis10]

well, whatever the term is, the exit sign does not illuminate until the gear is down and I think stops extending (the sign does not come on as soon as the gears start to go down cause you can hear the noise from the airflow and that's not when the sign comes on)

In your experience maybe, however it is variable and I believe changeable in the cabin config menu, recent JQ35/36 flights last month had the chime and lighting of exit signs occurring before gear down, concurrent with flap deployment.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

In your experience maybe, however it is variable and I believe changeable in the cabin config menu, recent JQ35/36 flights last month had the chime and lighting of exit signs occurring before gear down, concurrent with flap deployment.

ok, now we just need to know the take-off sequence... is the exit sign extinguished solely by gear up, or are flaps also possibly involved in that sequence?

 

[AVC]

As long as it's not the "Oops" button...

Or the big red button with the label, "DO NOT press this button!"

that would be this button:

Instant No Button! Star Wars funnies FTW!

except it's blue...

 

[markis10]

ok, now we just need to know the take-off sequence... is the exit sign extinguished solely by gear up, or are flaps also possibly involved in that sequence?

Again variable, given flap retraction and gear retraction are often simultaneous events post takeoff its harder to tell from the cabin!

 

[jb747]

When you are told to go into a holding pattern due to delays how and what distance do you set the turn radius, is it a setting or is the flying done manually? I spent 2 hours above Bangkok doing circles a few years back because the Thai Royals had decided they needed the airport.

Holding patterns are generally programmed into the FMC, and flown automatically. All you need to define one, is the track (inbound or outbound from the aid), the direction, and the time duration of the inbound leg (so, inbound to ABC, track 090, left hand, 1.5 minutes). The speed will also be entered, although the defaults are generally quite legal.

Do you have any opinions on the Embraers? I am a passenger on the Embraer 190 monthly and find them quite nice, no idea what they are like up front for the pilots and safety.

Know nothing about them....

 

[jb747]

I suppose, in an emergency, the people up the front have done a magnificent job in getting to the stage where the doors are still able to be used. After that, leave it to the FA's to sort the doors out and get everyone off safely.

I was actually thinking about things like the ovens. And where the peanuts are hidden.

 

[jb747]

ok, now we just need to know the take-off sequence... is the exit sign extinguished solely by gear up, or are flaps also possibly involved in that sequence?

I don't think we've resolved the sequence in either direction yet. The behaviour thus far seems at odds with what the 380 manual says. It's quite possible that the 330 is totally different, but Airbus are normally consistent to a fault.

There are other switches at play too. The squat switches also have an involvement with the doors. Let's wait for an official answer.

 

[jb747]

Again variable, given flap retraction and gear retraction are often simultaneous events post takeoff its harder to tell from the cabin!

In the big jets that's quite a long drawn out affair. Gear retraction happens as soon as we're off the ground, and definitely going up. Flap retraction won't start until somewhere between 1000 and 4000 feet, and may not be finished until as late as 6000 feet.

 

[bryanjones]

I flew from Washington (Reagan) to LAX on AA recently and for the first time I can remember saw obvious hail damage on the engines and leading edge of the wing. It made me wonder, is this normal or something specific to the lovely AA shiny aircraft.

Would it affect the aero performance dramatically?

Obviously you can't park all the craft under cover in hail or if it happens in the air, but would the airline bother to get this fixed or is it quite normal?

 

[jb747]

I flew from Washington (Reagan) to LAX on AA recently and for the first time I can remember saw obvious hail damage on the engines and leading edge of the wing. It made me wonder, is this normal or something specific to the lovely AA shiny aircraft.

Would it affect the aero performance dramatically?

Obviously you can't park all the craft under cover in hail or if it happens in the air, but would the airline bother to get this fixed or is it quite normal?

Hail only attacks lovely things. Just ask anyone who lives in Melbourne and had their car parked outside last Christmas day.

I'm sure those who live in Sydney remember this 1999 Sydney hailstorm - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Numerous aircraft received extensive damage. QF had a brand spanking new 767 caught out in it (amongst others, but I only cared about 767s at the time). I recall visiting the hangar to have a look at it from overhead. Without exception, every composite panel looked like a golf ball. Until that day, I had no idea there was that much composite on a 767. The metal panels, on the other hand, were generally in pretty good shape. It did take a while before all of the panels were replaced, but the drag penalty was quite small. I guess the companies that make golf balls are right, and dimples are low drag.

Basically, some panels are allowed a certain level of damage. As long as this isn't exceeded, the panel doesn't need to be replaced immediately. From the 99 experience, it would seem that the metal panels are the ones with tolerance....the composites were replaced very quickly.

In flight...that sort of hail could be very bad. I'd prefer not to experiment with it. Radome, probes, and engines...all come to mind as being very (large) hail intolerant. If it won't dent your car, it isn't a problem...

 

[mjt57]

Just read the news item about the pyjama pair on QF94.

Mind boggles, really...

JB, you guys must have an infinite amount of patience, I reckon...

 

[jb747]

Just read the news item about the pyjama pair on QF94.

I wasn't sure whether to laugh, cry, or do both, when I read it. I wonder what was said on the PA.

JB, you guys must have an infinite amount of patience, I reckon...

Not really. I'm probably pretty short on it when it comes to people capriciously delaying my aircraft.

 

[mjt57]

I wasn't sure whether to laugh, cry, or do both, when I read it. I wonder what was said on the PA.



Not really. I'm probably pretty short on it when it comes to people capriciously delaying my aircraft.

I think that they said something about what was said in the article.

In any case, why would these people have decided not to fly home after their tickets have been paid for. Are they really that rich that they can afford to blow away $10k on a whim? And then they have to find another flight home, and they may not necessarily get a first class seat, either.

I hope that Qantas sends them the bill for delaying the aircraft.

 

[jb747]

An official answer with regard to the A330 'ding' after take off.

It is associated with the emergency exit signs being extinguished. It is triggered by the position of the nose landing gear air/ground logic. The dings have been suppressed in the 380.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

An official answer with regard to the A330 'ding' after take off.

It is associated with the emergency exit signs being extinguished. It is triggered by the position of the nose landing gear air/ground logic. The dings have been suppressed in the 380.

thanks jb - so (in lay person's terms ) that means nose gear down/up = ding plus exit sign illuminated/extinguished?

 

[anat0l]

Getting OT and should probably be shifted into the proper thread, but...

In any case, why would these people have decided not to fly home after their tickets have been paid for. Are they really that rich that they can afford to blow away $10k on a whim? And then they have to find another flight home, and they may not necessarily get a first class seat, either.

Qantas F tix are generally refundable or changeable without much fuss. In any case, had QF not reaccommodated them quickly, they probably would've really kicked up a fuss which would be much worse than what has been reported (if a fuss was kicked up, that is).

For what we know, they could've cancelled their tix, perhaps got a refund for part or all of what was spent, and rebooked on another carrier. It would not be the first time that someone of considerable assets (or even not of considerable assets) has done something like this which seems to cut the nose to spite the face, but is done out of principle.

I hope that Qantas sends them the bill for delaying the aircraft.

Considering QF didn't have to send the aircraft back to the airport (viz. after taking off) and arrived fairly much on time, I doubt there is any merit or appreciable liability in sending them the bill. This is not like that old woman on the Trans-Tasman flight who forced QF to return to MEL after getting belligerent.