Ask The Pilot

[docjames]

Fatigue gets a mention now. As recently as 5 years ago, it did not. But, now it will simply be another reason to blame the pilot. He came to work fatigued, and so broke the rules by not getting enough sleep. I can't sleep to order. Can you? Airlines will never accept responsibility for it.

It's a big issue. The study that equated it to blood alcohol basically said that at the end of a long flight, the crew were at about the 'lock up' stage. Sadly though, accountants look at safety issues and they invariably come up with unsafe answers. Safety is not cheap...nor is it something you can buy cheaply. Something always has to give.

Fatigue is looked at in studies of Medical Practitioners (there's a lot of crossover with aviation fatigue analysis). Most institutions / health departments in Aus now have fatigue management policies that are designed to reduce risk. Typically, the error rate and fatigue score goes up significantly after the third consecutive night shift, so "best practice" (not always followed for a multitude of reasons - some valid, some not) is to not roster more than 4 overnight shifts in a row. Many intitutions also have fatigue policy whereby staff who are forced due to clinical necessity to work "beyond roster" if they meet certain thresholds, once the acute issue is resolved, they are rostered off (at pay) from subsequent work until they've had sufficient rest.

As an example, here's a public document from Queensland Health regarding Fatigue Risk Management (not saying it's 100% perfect, but at least there's a policy!)
:
http://www.health.qld.gov.au/hrpolicies/other/FRMS_web.pdf

(I'd be interested to know how that compares to say Qantas' or Jetstar's policies)


The data i've seen suggests that at 24hrs without sleep (eg. previously adequately rested, wake up at 7am, stay awake until 7am the following day), your reaction times are slowed to the equivalent of being ~ 0.05 Blood alcohol. The data doesnt really measure particularly well long periods of broken sleep (oncall), late nights / early starts, extended durations, long term lack of "off" days etc, but one could summise that you'd not do particularly better on concentration / awareness scores in those sorts of scenarios.

Hope I havent strayed too far off topic! I'd add that fatigue is well recognised, and the institutions are usually held to account when a preventable error is found to have been caused by unsafe rostering etc. Not just "blame the doctor" (although there can be elements of that at times / institutions!)

 

[awilcockson]

Any time the aircraft is towed, and often when the engineers are working on it, they will insert large pins, about 20 cm long, into the landing gear. These pins are inserted in such a way, that they will stop the landing gear from retracting. Good idea when towing or doing some work on the hydraulics, but not so good if you take off with one still inserted.

like this??

 

[harvyk]

How common is it that something abnormal happens mid flight, which requires special actions to be taken by the pilots (and involves running through an abnormal flight checklist), but once handled the flight can continue without any need for diversion (and due to the minor nature the pilots elects not to tell the pax)

 

[drewbles]

How common is it that something abnormal happens mid flight, which requires special actions to be taken by the pilots (and involves running through an abnormal flight checklist), but once handled the flight can continue without any need for diversion (and due to the minor nature the pilots elects not to tell the pax)

Well put. I also wanted to know similarly but was struggling to find a way to put it into words (thanks for doing so!)

 

[jb747]

like this??

No, not at all. We've already discussed this, but the event mentioned in the article was caused by an air/ground switch. There are multiple of these, and they must always agree before they allow retraction. They also inhibit, or enable, depending upon the mode, things like autopilot engagement, ground spoilers or speedbrakes, and reverse thrust.

If a pin is left in, you'd normally end up with one individual wheel still extended.

How common is it that something abnormal happens mid flight, which requires special actions to be taken by the pilots (and involves running through an abnormal flight checklist), but once handled the flight can continue without any need for diversion (and due to the minor nature the pilots elects not to tell the pax)

Not something I've ever tried to quantify, but quite common. Perhaps a quarter of all flights would have an ECAM or EICAS message at some point, although many of them consist of little more than 'crew awareness', have no actions to perform, and simply require you to put it in the tech log at the end of the flight. ECAMS that actually mean something, probably occur on about 10% of flights, but the vast majority will be resolved without any effect upon the flight (examples might be a fuel pump failure, which we'll work around by manually moving the fuel).

Of course, some pilots are '**** magnets' whilst others aren't, so perhaps my view is coloured.....

 

[craven morehead]

What an interesting thread!! Many thanks JB747

 

[anat0l]

Whilst we can't do much about bean counters (having been in a few companies I unfortunately already harbour a rather distasteful opinion of the Accounting department - except the one I'm currently at), if there was one (or two if you must) significant change to procedures, allowances or the workforce you would make in the interests of safety, what would it be?

And perhaps I should ask for a slightly more tangible answer than, "More sleep. More breaks. Four PE return seats per year and a free trip to the Bahamas."

 

[jb747]

Whilst we can't do much about bean counters (having been in a few companies I unfortunately already harbour a rather distasteful opinion of the Accounting department - except the one I'm currently at), if there was one (or two if you must) significant change to procedures, allowances or the workforce you would make in the interests of safety, what would it be?

And perhaps I should ask for a slightly more tangible answer than, "More sleep. More breaks. Four PE return seats per year and a free trip to the Bahamas."

I'll have to think about this. Give me a couple of days.

 

[SenZubEanS]

A massive thanks to jb747, this has made for the most interesting forum reading i've had the pleasure to look over in some time!

Was wondering if it was very likely that an airline schedules a pilot to fly on different aircraft regularly? ie: Would QF have you doing MEL-LHR on a 744 and flying the return leg on an A388 or anything like that?

Also, If there were a few pointers of words of wisdom as it were that you would pass on to anybody who was maybe thinking about becoming a flyboy for a career?

 

[jb747]

Was wondering if it was very likely that an airline schedules a pilot to fly on different aircraft regularly? ie: Would QF have you doing MEL-LHR on a 744 and flying the return leg on an A388 or anything like that?

No, you only fly one type. When you're on a conversion course, you work very hard to forget everything about previous aircraft. There are some types that have dual endorsements, 757 & 767, 330 & 340, but we don't have any of those pairs.

Also, If there were a few pointers of words of wisdom as it were that you would pass on to anybody who was maybe thinking about becoming a flyboy for a career?

Don't.....the days of it being a good career look to be over.

 

[Craigie]

Don't.....the days of it being a good career look to be over.

Is there any area of aviation that you would say would be a good career?

 

[markis10]

Is there any area of aviation that you would say would be a good career?

Airline CEO/Accountant

 

[Craigie]

Airline CEO/Accountant

You'd need less training to do those jobs than be a airline pilot! (coming from an accountants point of view!)

All you need to know how to do is keep promising bigger and bigger profit to the shareholders every year while stripping away little bits and pieces of the airline over time, until one day you wonder why your customer base is decreasing rapidly and then not have the ability to fix it.

But I digress...

 

[jb747]

Is there any area of aviation that you would say would be a good career?

Worldwide, management are merrily trying to lower the status (and so pay) of pilots. The advent of cadets, and paying for an airline seat, is really just the thin edge of the wedge. This goes along with a belief that less qualified pilots are all that is needed in today's, more or less, crash proof jets. This is pushed quite hard by Airbus as a selling point.

The reality is that modern jets are every bit as easy to crash as were the older ones. When the automatics fail, which they do quite readily in the Airbus, the aircraft are actually quite a bit more difficult to operate than the old stuff. Plus, because the automatics are almost always engaged (manual flying is actually banned by some airlines), the pilots won't even have recent practice to fall back on. Eventually the lowering of standards will come back to bite, most likely with an increase in worldwide accidents. But, the management will have taken their bonus and nicked off by then, so why would they care.

It is not a job that can be done by anyone. The air force used to take 1 percent of applicants, and then fail half of them. Cadet schemes that boast a 95% pass rate, are really boasting about their mediocre standards.

 

[Sifor]

How often does this St. Elmo's fire phenomena occur? According to the video, it looks like mini lightning on the windscreen. I'm assuming because aircraft are shielded there is no effect on electrical systems?

[video=youtube;4sA-Hk_jnPg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sA-Hk_jnPg[/video]

Edit: better video here..: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Py5mkrrcLPU

 

[harvyk]

Plus, because the automatics are almost always engaged (manual flying is actually banned by some airlines), the pilots won't even have recent practice to fall back on.

Noticing that manual flying is actually banned by some airlines, is there a reason for this?
Would any commercial flights done completely manually without engaging the autopilot?
And even in a normal flight (say a stock standard SYD-MEL B767, daylight in good weather, but using the autopilot where appropriate), what percentage is done manually?

 

[jb747]

Noticing that manual flying is actually banned by some airlines, is there a reason for this?

The airline that I'd heard had done this is a European LCC. Perhaps their pilots aren't any good.....or they don't trust them.

Would any commercial flights done completely manually without engaging the autopilot?

No. Well, it would be extremely rare anyway. The autopilot MUST be engaged when flying in RVSM airspace (reduced vertical separation), which is most of it these days. Most manual flying I've done recently was last year, when we flew for 5 hours after the aircraft had dropped back to alternate law 2...and taken the automatics off us.

And even in a normal flight (say a stock standard SYD-MEL B767, daylight in good weather, but using the autopilot where appropriate), what percentage is done manually?

Varies depending upon what the boys feel like. Nice day...perhaps up to 10,000 feet or so, but most likely to leave the a/p engaged at the other end until around 3000 feet. I brought a flight that had diverted to Sydney down to Melbourne the other day...autopilot was engaged at about 150 feet, and disconnected at around 70 knots at Melbourne.

 

[jb747]

How often does this St. Elmo's fire phenomena occur? According to the video, it looks like mini lightning on the windscreen. I'm assuming because aircraft are shielded there is no effect on electrical systems?

St Elmo's is common. It can also show up in the engines, and as an arc off the nose (though the windscreen is the most common manifestation). It's caused by the aircraft accumulating a very large static charge.

Normally there is no effect upon the aircraft systems, other than the HF radio becoming useless, and in the Airbus, the VHF also becomes very noisy. I've seen a couple of aircraft in which one of the intercom panels starts to flicker.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Thom...0608244/&sid=c3f5e1e7b8369e2d1cf159d24276f006

 

[straitman]

Don't.....the days of it being a good career look to be over.

I agree whole heartedly.

Is there any area of aviation that you would say would be a good career?

Airline CEO/Accountant

If only it were true.
I spent many years in the corporate world working for a V-large multi national including roles as Chief Pilot and Aviation Manager and have to agree with jb747 that the fun police have all but destroyed it for everyone.

 

[Saab34]

This shot of Elmo's fire is just amazing, taken by a JQ Capt.

JetPhotos.Net Photo » VH-VQF (CN: 3474) Jetstar Airways Airbus A320-232 by Darren Howie - Vortex Aviation Photography