ATO (tax office) payments by credit card

[serfty]

...
Have I missed something as I do love my points so, and will happily spend a few hours a month to maximise returns!

Everyone's situation is different and what can work for one may not work for another.

My suggestion is that with a cash flow of that magnitude it should not be difficult to get a 1½ point per dollar earning credit card with no Annual points earning cap.

With that you would be able to pay up to the credit limit and reload every few days, repeating until the monthly payments are complete. You can work credit cards the same way as the Amex, getting at least forty days to pay, interest free as long as it is paid off in full by each monthly due date.

You would need to work at setting this up, but once done, even those SQ suites could be attainable ...

It is really up to you.

PS I do suggest reading this entire thread - it may take several hours, but that's part of the working at start up.

 

[Cynicor]

People always whinge about the size of the thread and then say they can't read it all. It really isn't that hard and will give you a good idea of the evolution of this game. Set your account to 40 posts per page so that you only have 86 pages to read. Next, it's not as they are 80 pages of prose. Half of them are cove and shintaro telling us where in the world they are flying next. About 10% are us thanking the gods (JS) that this exists in the first place. 30% are people asking what cards currently work, which leaves only about 10% actually informative posts, and many of them repeat each other. The same goes for the DM and LM threads, so you really can mostly just skim them and read the useful stuff.

If you can put in a bit of effort then the payoff will be much better, plus others will be more willing to help further.

From reading your situation, (unless all your cashflow comes in at the same time) by the end of the month you still end up with the correct amount so you could still pay up a CC over the month with reloads and payments.

 

[Danger UXB]

This horse will drink long and hard but is relatively simple so if some-one (Cove seems the most informed) could step me through what I'm missing. This thread is over 300 pages long and I can't find the upstream thread mentioned.

My situation is this. We submit our BAS statements quarterly, then apply to the ATO for an installment plan to pay the amounts over 3 months. Our business is in a growth phase and cash is always short. We never have the funds to pay the amounts when they are due, so I have adjusted the due date on my charge card to fall in the first few days of each month, so we can collect some of receipts before paying it off. The monthly payment amount is usually about $115K which includes about $70K of taxes. I pay the ATO amounts on time using the card, collect the points (at a lower level than other cards - I know), then take advantage of the extra 40 days. We don't have the spare cash to load up, then pay down on lower limit cards in order to get a better point return because (as I understand it) you need to have the actual cash in your account to manage this.

Have I missed something as I do love my points so, and will happily spend a few hours a month to maximise returns!

Hi ben6
There are those far more qualified than me to comment on this at AFF but my understanding is you only need to preload the card, to get the tax deduction on the credit card fee, if you are paying personal taxes. If you are paying business taxes then preload is only required if you are paying an amount greater than your credit limit. Some of us use multiple cards to avoid the preload issue to pay larger tax bills

Hope this doesn't add to you confusion, and do spend some time reading the thread. There is some info like all the Citibank stuff which is now history but you will probably find info on just about every other card there is available.
Cheers Danger UXB

 

[The Rok]

Of course if you really wanted to you could just go along to an AFF get together and maybe buy Cove a glass of 1998 Vintage Dom and he will probably gladly fill you in!

 

[albatross710]

Have I missed something as I do love my points so, and will happily spend a few hours a month to maximise returns!

I am seeing your situation. When you are paying taxes on credit card, they are usually personal credit cards which clears the way for the points earned to be a personal benefit. When you consider that your business is constrained for cash is it a good idea to be moving 'company' debts from your protection through your company structure to private debts which are claimable directly on your personal assets in the event that the music stops and you are left without a chair.

For me, and I hope for others. the miles are a side game to the actual business ( although it doesn't always seem that way. ) Get your cash flow first becaiuse it becomes too easy for people to let the credit card and the ATO debts roll over.

End of rant,

Alby

 

[Ben6]

Thanks everyone and I'll certainly read the entire thread with that great tip for changing the post count per page. I spent about half and hour reading just a few pages due to the constant page changing as much as anything.

I think part of my problem is that I am literally collecting more points than I have time to use, so may have been lacking in motivation to maximise but to coughise Kerry Packer "It is everyone's duty to minimise taxes AND maximise FF points!"

 

[Beta4Me]

Thanks everyone and I'll certainly read the entire thread with that great tip for changing the post count per page. I spent about half and hour reading just a few pages due to the constant page changing as much as anything.

I think part of my problem is that I am literally collecting more points than I have time to use, so may have been lacking in motivation to maximise but to coughise Kerry Packer "It is everyone's duty to minimise taxes AND maximise FF points!"

Here's a suggestion...Get Westpac Altitude Black with max credit limit you can. Max out the limit on ATO payments. Put rest on Amex Charge. Best of both worlds? The girl from the Mexican taco ads certainlysays: why don't we have both?

 

[burmans]

has anyone attempted to increase their credit limits post the positive credit reporting? i got an increase offer letter the other day, but i'm not sure they know about the card i was 'going to cancel'...

I've said this before but here goes again. The changes to the law "allow" positive credit reporting not require it and if you get your free credit report you'll find no one is reporting yet and probably unlikely most will until at earliest late this year, this is a big piece of work for them.

 

[burmans]

It would be interesting to know whether credit providers/fin. institutions have an obligation to provide data of clients' terminations of financial obligations, and any timeframe there is to action this.

How far in arrears will the database be?

IF they have provided your Consumer Credit Liability (Account) Information (its not mandatory and as at today no-one is actually providing yet) to the Credit Bureau they have a resposiblity to keep it up to date. One of the fields that can be provided is close date of an account, The Credit Reporting Code generally requires monthly updates and without going back and reading the Code I think this applies for notifying a closure of an account.

But this does mean that at any point your data could be up to a month old (possibly slightly longer should anyone have processing issues etc.).

Same applies for repayment information, i.e. if you are in arrears last month but are now up to date could take a month to work its way through the system.

 

[legroom]

I think part of my problem is that I am literally collecting more points than I have time to use, so may have been lacking in motivation to maximise but to coughise Kerry Packer "It is everyone's duty to minimise taxes AND maximise FF points!"

Cousin Ben

You forgot about me ?

Click & Transfer - I'm willing & ready.

Cheers

 

[Ghostdunks]

Newly armed with my new Westpac Altitude Black Amex+Mastercard, a large 100k tax bill coming up, some advice from Cove, and plenty of information from reading all 341 pages of this thread, I'm now ready to start farming points with my good friend, the ATO. Nothing certain in life other than death and taxes, and while I won't be able to avoid death as yet, and I hate paying tax, at least I can try and soften the blow with the taxes

Like others, I too have calculated that with the Altitude Black promo of double points for 3 months, I'll be able to get the return of 0.48c per FF point(transfer to KrisFlyer). This is before any tax deductibility of said credit card surcharge, so in the end, should work out to be just over half that, so somewhere between 0.25c to 0.27c per KF point after taking into account the tax deduction? Awesome value I think. Obviously, if I pay via mastercard, it'll be even cheaper(raw 0.34c per KF, raw meaning before tax deduction), but I'm willing to pay the extra premium to get a ton more points by paying with Amex.

Since I had the spreadsheet going, I decided to see what else was worth putting on the Amex/Mastercard... Going to buy a car, and having already agreed a very good price for the car(already ordered and should be arriving in July) of just over 50k, asked how much to pay via credit card, and was told an extra 2% surcharge. Running this through the spreadsheet gave me a figure of 0.67c per KF if paying via Amex during the double points period, which I think is still pretty good, so going to run that through the Amex as well.

Also, planning to have a wedding overseas soon. Have to pay for that too, Westpac have told me they charge a 3% foreign currency fee for Mastercard and 3.5% foreign currency fee for Amex. This foreign currency fee is effectively the surcharge I'll be paying for the benefit of using the card, and since both Mastercard and Amex earn the same amount of points but Mastercard has a smaller fee, I'll run the numbers through with 3% foreign currency surcharge. During the double points promo, this works out to be 1.0c per KF, which I think would be the limit I'd pay for chasing/farming FF points. If redeeming for J class or First class flights, I think I'd value the points at around 4c per KF, so if I can get them at 1/4 the value, I think that's good value.

After getting the Altitude Black card recently, I also realised that they offered 0% interest on purchase rate for 12 months, which I didn't know before. Free money up till my credit limit for 12 months, what a bargain!

Thanks again to everyone who's contributed to this thread, love your work

 

[Mark3000]

awesome post Ghostdunks. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one obsessive enough to read all 340 pages.
Great calculations re the car. I wonder if you could negotiate with them to reduce that fee - i.e. tell them, look guys I know you don't pay 2% merchant fees, can we make it 1.5% for the Amex

 

[Danger UXB]

awesome post Ghostdunks. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one obsessive enough to read all 340 pages.
Great calculations re the car. I wonder if you could negotiate with them to reduce that fee - i.e. tell them, look guys I know you don't pay 2% merchant fees, can we make it 1.5% for the Amex

Think you might struggle to get lower than 2% from a car dealer. Most professional services are at 1.95% with medical and dental at about 1.49%. But if you can I would love to hear about it

 

[Ghostdunks]

awesome post Ghostdunks. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one obsessive enough to read all 340 pages.
Great calculations re the car. I wonder if you could negotiate with them to reduce that fee - i.e. tell them, look guys I know you don't pay 2% merchant fees, can we make it 1.5% for the Amex

I was thinking about the whole renegotiating business, but figured since I had already put down the deposit for a very specific configuration(its for my mum), I didn't want to jeopardise the whole car purchase thing, considering that I got quite a good deal on the car in the first place after a lot of haggling already. He did say I could pay 5k of it with no credit card fee, but balance will require 2%.

Also, just to confirm to anyone who's interested, I paid some of my BAS with Westpac Altitude a few days ago, and Altitude reward points posted, so ATO payments still working fine for that purpose. I'm not expecting to see the double points till after the promotion ends so hard to tell with that, but if the original points posted, the promotional points should post too I think.

Think you might struggle to get lower than 2% from a car dealer. Most professional services are at 1.95% with medical and dental at about 1.49%. But if you can I would love to hear about it

Ya I'm thinking the same way. Depending how much of a deal I'm getting on the car already....if I didn't haggle it down already, they'd probably let me get away with not paying any credit card fee at all on the whole amount just to get the sale, but at the stage I'm at now, where I've committed to the purchase and and price I'm paying(which I think is quite good), don't think there's much margin for movement

 

[nonpop]

awesome post Ghostdunks ... Great calculations re the car. I wonder if you could negotiate with them to reduce that fee - i.e. tell them, look guys I know you don't pay 2% merchant fees, can we make it 1.5% for the Amex

2 wks ago we purchased a new car. Dealer wanted 2% for any CC and we negotiated down to 0.9% for Visa / MC & 1.1% for Amex. The first $5k was also fee free. We did the fee negotiation with their finance person and explained it was not likely they were paying anywhere near the 2% and that the surcharge was meant as cost recovery. We also suggested that a call to another dealer may be in order to spice up the competition.

 

[Cruiser Elite]

2 wks ago we purchased a new car. Dealer wanted 2% for any CC and we negotiated down to 0.9% for Visa / MC & 1.1% for Amex. The first $5k was also fee free. We did the fee negotiation with their finance person and explained it was not likely they were paying anywhere near the 2% and that the surcharge was meant as cost recovery. We also suggested that a call to another dealer may be in order to spice up the competition.

Paid 100% purchase price of my last car on AMEX - gave 3 dealers 1 chance and 1 chance only on a quote to supply - no trade-in - clearly indicated that AMEX was going to be used for total purchase price so price they came back with in writing must clearly show 'Payment in full via AMEX CC' - leaves no wriggle room for anybody.

 

[prozac]

A couple of years back I paid full purchase of motorcycle ($27,000) on Amex. As the dealer had always accepted the amex for previous servicing it never dawned on me that I needed to negotiate it into the deal. When it came time to pay they didn't bat an eye.

Just about completed paying a big chunk of tax to ATO using the pay then top-up method on Alt Black so hoping this may lead to an offer of a higher limit soon. Just thinking ahead to next vehicle purchase.

 

[get me outta here]

I agree, I also bought a new car across 3 credit cards w' no fee and 3 dealers agreed to this reluctantly. The cc point was the last part to be negotiated so that the price inclusions were already known and agreed. I said it was a deal breaker and that if they could not do it, 2 other dealers within travel distance have agreed, but I'f prefer to buy local. We agreed that in writing, I bought local, then Ford went out of business.

Paid 100% purchase price of my last car on AMEX - gave 3 dealers 1 chance and 1 chance only on a quote to supply - no trade-in - clearly indicated that AMEX was going to be used for total purchase price so price they came back with in writing must clearly show 'Payment in full via AMEX CC' - leaves no wriggle room for anybody.

 

[prozac]

................................ We agreed that in writing, I bought local, then Ford went out of business.

Good luck getting parts in future. My Berlina wagon was rear-ended by a texting woman. I am about to get a new tailgate fitted after a wait of 3 months for that panel to be supplied from Holden. Apologies for thread creep.

 

[Pushka]

Slight hijack. Re the Westpac Black card - given Q's abandoning Adelaide we are more likely to fly SQ. We were kris members but due to non use those memberships expired. But easy to create new memberships. So I take it you just transfer your Altitude Points en masse direct to the Kris membership number? I tried booking flights directly through the Altitude redemption and gave up with the low value. Tx.