Australian Housing Affordability Discussion

Status
Not open for further replies.
Perth real estate might have to change their growth legend.

i've rad about 3 times that the perth market has bottomed and is primed for growth. not sure how prices can go up when pop growth is in the sheeter and construction is still at relatively high levels.

throw in continued job losses and the fact state final demand has been in a recession for an extended period, and yeah, i wouldn't be looking to invest in WA housing for quite a while yet.

mining capex is still around 16% of state final demand and was only 6% pre boom, so expect a few more years of negative sideways growth.

i love that the turnbull government has once again held an inquiry and decided to do, well, nothing. there is no problem with housing affordability, just like there's no issues with the banking industry.

suppose they need to ensure a smooth transfer into the private sector.
 
In Perth if you get a low cash offer you may want to take it rather than wait for another buyer who may have to sell their place.
With redundancies and job losses Perth probably won't recover for a while.
It isn't something to worry about unless you a buyer or seller and we are neither. You get twice the bang for your dollar in Perth compared with Sydney but the big jobs are still in Sydney.
 
You get twice the bang for your dollar in Perth compared with Sydney but the big jobs are still in Sydney.

The age old saying. It's a recession when you're neighbour loses their job.

It's a depression when you lose yours.

I look at WA, and their massive budget problems, and see that is what the east coast will be facing in 12 to 18 months tops.
 
You may be correct Jeff. The problem is that many have predicted a tumble in Sydney but it has not happened so far. Sydney prices are ridiculous but so is Vancouver and Auckland. Vancouver has stopped foreign speculators now.
 
In Perth if you get a low cash offer you may want to take it rather than wait for another buyer who may have to sell their place.
With redundancies and job losses Perth probably won't recover for a while.
It isn't something to worry about unless you a buyer or seller and we are neither. You get twice the bang for your dollar in Perth compared with Sydney but the big jobs are still in Sydney.

Big jobs are in Sydney and Melbourne, infact increasingly Melbourne. And perhaps a smattering in Brisbane. But you are right - pretty much nothing in Perth.
I was recently offered a medium sized gig in Perth, a turnaround 12 month contract loaded at three times base as an incentive plus the normal ancillaries - but what had me smiling (though not very good for our Perth residents) was in the offer letter it reads '....another point to consider is that due to the economic downturn in Perth, the subsequent and enduring property market crash means should you choose to purchase in the city.....'. Didn't realise it had been called a CRASH officially ;)
Melbourne market is an interesting one. Oversupply of apartments which is punishing investors with consistent price drops. Undersupply of free standing and still a strong net immigration number, and in most areas still strong employment which is holding up house prices. Will be interesting to see what the new year brings though as many inner city suburbs have appeared to have topped out and have been very flat over the last quarter...
 
A mortgage interest rate rise of more than 1% will have the biggest effect on Sydney and Melbourne as the loans are so large. No one knows when that will happen so the smartest borrowers have not lowered their monthly mortgage payments as the lending rate fell over the last couple of years.
 
There's block at Playford for $80,000 that no one wants to buy

it goes like this

"all blocks in this suburb sell for $300,000"

"hang on, didn't you buy tha block a few years back for $300,000 and now you subdivided it into 4?"

"yes, that's because all blocks in this suburb sell for $300,000 so I'm gonna sell 4 blocks for $300,000 each"

"But they're only a quarter of the size..."

"nobody cares about that, they will pay $300,000 for a block in this suburb"

go figure!
 
Melbourne market is an interesting one. Oversupply of apartments which is punishing investors with consistent price drops. Undersupply of free standing and still a strong net immigration number, and in most areas still strong employment which is holding up house prices. Will be interesting to see what the new year brings though as many inner city suburbs have appeared to have topped out and have been very flat over the last quarter...

If you look at wage growth it's at the lowest level on record (since 1997). Average wages growth is even worse as the rolling over of high paying jobs into lower paying jobs, and as part time work increases at the expense of full time jobs.

Underemployment was also at a record high 1.1 million people (8.5%) as at November 2016.

The total value of Australia’s dwelling stock was an all-time high 7.2 times incomes as at September 2016, up from 7.0 times incomes the year prior.

The mortgage debt supporting Australian housing hit an all-time high 96% of GDP as at September 2016, up from 92% of GDP a year earlier.

Once the construction cycle turns, it will weigh heavily on employment. There are currently nearly 1.1 million Australians (9% of the workforce) employed directly in the construction sector, which has increased from around 700,000 at the beginning of the mining boom.

To date, the the dwelling construction boom has offset the decline in mining investment. However, by the end of 2017, we are likely to see employment activity in the housing construction industry finally begin to unwind, dragging on jobs growth in unison with the cratering of mining investment.

The annual state accounts showed that New South Wales and Victoria were the key drivers of Australian GDP in the year to June 2016, growing by 3.5% and 3.3% respectively; driven to a significant extent by strong population growth.

Their impacts on employment growth was greater again. In the year to November 2016, employment in New South Wales and Victoria grew by 127,200 combined, more than offsetting a 34,100 contraction in employment across the rest of Australia.

The RBA might be able to drop interest rates by another 1%, depending on how foreign lenders react to the loss of the Govt AAA rating, banks will prob keep 0.5% of and drop in rates to cover their increased costs. Combine that with the Govt still increasing the budget deficit this year, even though the ToT had an amazing turn around in the second half of the year, and there is limited budget the support the Govt can provide the economy.

My feeling is when things turn down, it will gather pace quite rapidly due to the over reliance on house price growth to prop up consumption, and employment in construction. The car industry closure this year is a lot of high paying jobs lost in VIC and SA, then 2018 will see prob 200,000 jobs lost in the construction industry, with more in 2019 as pop growth continues to slow and the level of approvals continues to fall.
 
Many folks confuse investment with lifestyle. Having a second or third place in other cities for personal use is purely a lifestyle improvement if you never put it into the pool of rentals in that city. You may inadvertently make a profit out of it and the ATO will want their share.
The advantage of apartments (above the ground floor) is you can generally pull the front door closed and off you go.
 
i suppose this will eventually hit aaustralia too

Japanese white collar workers are already being replaced by artificial intelligence — Quartz

Fukoku Mutual will spend $1.7 million (200 million yen) to install the AI system, and $128,000 per year for maintenance, according to Japan’s The Mainichi. The company saves roughly $1.1 million per year on employee salaries by using the IBM software, meaning it hopes to see a return on the investment in less than two years.

A ROI of 2 years would be hard for most businesses to ignore.

Not conducive in helping workers maintain their jumbo mortgages.
 
Yes I saw automation in the US and Switzerland in 2016 where the number of manufactururing staff was diminishing. It will be something we will see in the next 10 years for sure in Australia.
Prices of real estate near the ocean in California have fully recovered now from the Global Financial Crunch of 2008 that we did not have in Sydney.
 
New report showing Australia a leading destination for laundered Chinese money. Also Australian authorities dithering on clamping down on money laundering.

Australia is one of the world’s four top destinations for Chinese money-launderers. This from a Canadian expert this week:

$2,000,000,000,000 in Proceeds of Corruption Removed from China and Taken to US, Australia, Canada and Netherlands | Duhaime's Anti-Money Laundering Law in Canada

There is no sign it will slow. The irony of our housing affordability crisis is that it is not the fault of the Chinese, but rather, of the Australian government which knows: 1. it can do something about it, and 2. it said it would do something about it 12 years ago.
We have just entered the ninth year of equivocation by assorted governments over anti-money laundering laws which should have been fully implemented by now. The first tranche of AML-CTF (Anti-Money Laundering and Counter-Terrorism Financing Act) legislation was introduced in 2006.
The second was supposed to be enacted in 2008. For the sake of stating the obvious, it is now 2017. The past eight years has been a dither-fest, a shaggy-dog story of ‘finalising industry reviews” and “consultation with stakeholders”, a festival of stonewalling.

House prices surge on China black money; authorities dither | Michael West
 
Have just been looking at mortgage arrears suburbs around Perth on the ABC news web site. Now interest rates on many mortgages are still quite modest but lots of layoffs have caused mortgage stress where only one family member is now working. There are likely to be more mortgagee sales across Australia if the mortgage interest rate rises by 1% from the current low levels.
Now would be a good time to make advance mortgage payments or hold 9 months of emergency living money to cover the just in case scenario.
 
Put an offer on a house we liked yesterday. An offer we considered reasonable given the market and the listing. Sellers countered with something ridiculous. We moved up, and still they have said no. For now.

Place has been empty and listed for several months, and their expectations don't seem to match the market.

Our offer - which we know is right in the ballpark for the area and listing - was subject to sale, which for us the only way we can do it. They don't want that. Whatever.

But oh well. No emotions on our part. We'll keep looking until things line up in our favour.

Would not be surprised if the listing stays untouched for a while. And if they come back to us in the future, we might even knock a bit off our offer too.
 
Australia's highest-earning Velocity Frequent Flyer credit card: Offer expires: 21 Jan 2025
- Earn 60,000 bonus Velocity Points
- Get unlimited Virgin Australia Lounge access
- Enjoy a complimentary return Virgin Australia domestic flight each year

AFF Supporters can remove this and all advertisements

Yes GarrettM the market is weak in Perth for sales and rentals so don't fall in love with a place enough to go bridging finance and end up with 2 places.
 
Should people outside of Inner Melbourne and Sydney (houses not apartments) be worried buying a home now and the value of that home dropping?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Become an AFF member!

Join Australian Frequent Flyer (AFF) for free and unlock insider tips, exclusive deals, and global meetups with 65,000+ frequent flyers.

AFF members can also access our Frequent Flyer Training courses, and upgrade to Fast-track your way to expert traveller status and unlock even more exclusive discounts!

AFF forum abbreviations

Wondering about Y, J or any of the other abbreviations used on our forum?

Check out our guide to common AFF acronyms & abbreviations.
Back
Top