Australian Reports of the Virus Spread

[jb747]

I suspect Dan will go mad with lockdowns, but it looks to me like they've actually managed to lose control, if, of course, they were ever actually in control of a virus anyway. Karma is working overtime at the moment...but I'm sure there's more than enough to go around.

 

[Must...Fly!]

As an aside, the boyfriend of my daughter was on the way to work at 5AM in the previous curfew when he had stopped due roadworks on a freeway, only to have a carload of joyriding young ladies slam into his stationary vehicle at 60-80kkmph. His vehicle was written of ad he suffered a TBI and was in hospital for many days.

Sorry for his injury and write off. If we banned cars, this wouldn't have happened....

 

[pagingjoan]

I don't need to read the media to tell me how to interpret other people's emotions... and it wouldn't be like the media to sensationalise the story...

OP was painting a picture that all the presenters were "stressed and emotional" and that is absolutely fiction. Did some get emotional at times? Yes. They were articulate, appropriate and delivered the desired message to perfection. "stressed and emotional" means something completely different to me..

"What you see depends on where you sit."
As you say, the terms mean different things to different people.
And who could blame any of the players for being emotional, in the circumstances.

 

[justinbrett]

"What you see depends on where you sit."
As you say, the terms mean different things to different people.
And who could blame any of the players for being emotional, in the circumstances.

"Emotional" sounds very different to me to "Stressed and Emotional".

The latter implies to me the person is not coping, speaking out, not performing etc.

Quite a misogynist thing to say if I'm honest. You are allowed to show emotion, that should be welcomed.

 

[antycbr]

On 30/8, it is replaced by rules allowing authorised workers to leaving their LGA where either they are going to a worksite with a rapid antigen test (I guess mainly covering those unvaccinated, but of course applicable to all workers) or they have had 1 dose (the three week after 1st dose requirement that construction had has not been specified on the NSW media release).

They'd better get some communications to business quick smart about

a) can we lawfully ask for vaccination status
b) where you can actually buy roughly 1400 RATs that we need for one week of our operations - waste services so kinda essential
c) who is going to administer, process and record the RATs to ensure compliance with the same law.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

They'd better get some communications to business quick smart about

a) can we lawfully ask for vaccination status
b) where you can actually buy roughly 1400 RATs that we need for one week of our operations - waste services so kinda essential
c) who is going to administer, process and record the RATs to ensure compliance with the same law.

I think I heard the answer to
(a) yes, the workers shows Medicare records and in due course Service NSW will work a solution to show covid vaccination status.
(c) is that the employer needs to keep records.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

I guess my argument is that NSW does not have a high level of community cases - yes, by fortress Australia standards - but considering Doherty models daily cases getting to 60K per day, I don't think we need to throw that modelling out the door - it's not going to be substantially different. According to WA they are going to be updating the modelling - but it's updating, not a completely different scenario.

UK never got back to 30 cases. They opened up at 50K daily cases. Cases dropped.

I think behind closed doors NSW has done its own research as well, specifically a lot with Canada. No doubt there is a lot of information both levels of government aren't sharing with us. NSW seems hell bent on their strategy though, and I support them, the covid zero strategy is just ludicrous at this point.

The Doherty modelling is not that relevant as it basically is all about having an outbreak, and the vaccinations along with some other measures controlling the adverse health outcomes including entering that outbreak with health system not already overstressed. That is what was modelled.


Whereas what is much more likely going to keep happening is an ongoing steady stream of new outbreaks, with some covid cases hospitalised pretty much all the time though there may be seasonal or surge fluactions.. And eventually new variants again.

So to me it is more about getting to a living with covid vaccination rate that is robust enough to sustain that ongoing attack with acceptable adverse health outcomes. The more we open up the more we will get peppered with new outbreaks. Now that may be 80%. However I would tend to think to really get down to minimal interventions and measures that it may well need to be somewhat higher and to also have some of the under 12s vaccinated. This includes have a buffer so that if an outbreak surge happens for whatever reason, that we are not having to rollout serious restrictions again, or at least not at short spacings.

Having a high enough vaccination rate will eventually mean not worrying about outbreaks apart from some minimal interventions unless of course a mutation happens that changes the rules engagement.

And the end of the day we both agree I think that we need a high vaccination rate to get back to a "normal" existence.

 

[pagingjoan]

"Emotional" sounds very different to me to "Stressed and Emotional".

The latter implies to me the person is not coping, speaking out, not performing etc.

Quite a misogynist thing to say if I'm honest. You are allowed to show emotion, that should be welcomed.

Okay. Last try.

”Emotional” was my term.
But I cannot believe that any of the people carrying the huge burden of this situation would be anything other than stressed. How could they not be?

No idea where “misogynist” entered the discussion.
But I will assume that you are not applying it to me, and will leave the debate here.

 

[justinbrett]

Okay. Last try.

”Emotional” was my term.
But I cannot believe that any of the people carrying the huge burden of this situation would be anything other than stressed. How could they not be?

No idea where “misogynist” entered the discussion.
But I will assume that you are not applying it to me, and will leave the debate here.

I wasn't calling you a misogynist. I rebutted the original "Stressed and Emotional" comment. You posted a news article in response to that, and this started.

I think we are in agreement

 

[MARTINE]

Sydney anti-lockdown protest organiser sentenced to eight months’ jail

Anthony Khallouf, originally from Victoria, will serve at least three months in prison after pleading guilty to charges related to Covid restrictions breaches

www.theguardian.com

… change of tack…. Anti-lockdown protester in Sydney.. 8 months jail.. he pleaded guilty which is interesting …

 

[justinbrett]

The Doherty modelling is not that relevant as it basically is all about having an outbreak, and the vaccinations along with some other measures controlling the adverse health outcomes including entering that outbreak with health system not already overstressed. That is what was modelled.


Whereas what is much more likely going to keep happening is an ongoing steady stream of new outbreaks, with some covid cases hospitalised pretty much all the time though there may be seasonal or surge fluactions.. And eventually new variants again.

So to me it is more about getting to a living with covid vaccination rate that is robust enough to sustain that ongoing attack with acceptable adverse health outcomes. The more we open up the more we will get peppered with new outbreaks. Now that may be 80%. However I would tend to think to really get down to minimal interventions and measures that it may well need to be somewhat higher and to also have some of the under 12s vaccinated. This includes have a buffer so that if an outbreak surge happens for whatever reason, that we are not having to rollout serious restrictions again, or at least not at short spacings.

Having a high enough vaccination rate will eventually mean not worrying about outbreaks apart from some minimal interventions unless of course a mutation happens that changes the rules engagement.

And the end of the day we both agree I think that we need a high vaccination rate to get back to a "normal" existence.

Yeah I agree on the last point.

I'm betting once we get to 80% we will have no idea how much covid is circulating, as testing will slow down dramatically. Contact tracing will be impossible. There won't be any controlling outbreaks.

But it won't matter, due to the vaccination rate. I think NSW will get up to 90%+ vaccination, government is not shying away from making it mandatory for industries and certain activities.

 

[Pom-DownUnder]

Sydney anti-lockdown protest organiser sentenced to eight months’ jail

Anthony Khallouf, originally from Victoria, will serve at least three months in prison after pleading guilty to charges related to Covid restrictions breaches

www.theguardian.com

… change of tack…. Anti-lockdown protester in Sydney.. 8 months jail.. he pleaded guilty which is interesting …

doesnt sound like he was prosecuted overly harshly for being an organiser ... oh wait ...

 

[pagingjoan]

I wasn't calling you a misogynist. I rebutted the original "Stressed and Emotional" comment. You posted a news article in response to that, and this started.

I think we are in agreement

Phew!

 

[justinbrett]

Phew!

Moral of the story- showing emotion doesn't imply weakness! We should welcome emotion from our politicians. Many other premiers and CHOs have been accused of being heartless.

I know from your comments you support this.

 

[MARTINE]

doesnt sound like he was prosecuted overly harshly for being an organiser ... oh wait ...

Hmmm.. 8 months jail is not insignificant and does send a message this is unacceptable. Also pleading guilty to lawful directives when the ‘law’ upon which it is based not recognised by your movement I did find interesting...

Post automatically merged: Aug 20, 2021

Hmmm.. 8 months jail is not insignificant and does send a message this is unacceptable. Also pleading guilty to lawful directives when the ‘law’ upon which it is based not recognised by your movement I did find interesting...

*breaching lawful directives…

 

[Princess Fiona]

Sadly, there seem to be some people who believe ICU beds should be sitting empty. Much like the dedicated COVID wards.

I should hope not.
ICU usually operates at 85% or higher occupancy and around a third of their bed days are critically ill elective surgical patients.


The dedicated Covid wards went as soon as the first lockdown ended in 2020.
They have been reinstated in NSW in the areas with Covid inpatients but they are not empty at all a present.

Looks like the vaccination rates in NSW coupled with the public health measures will hopefully get them to be decommissioned sooner rather than later.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Sorry for his injury and write off. If we banned cars, this wouldn't have happened....

The average lifespan before cars was much shorter than post-cars.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

I should hope not.
ICU usually operates at 85% or higher occupancy and around a third of their bed days are critically ill elective surgical patients.


The dedicated Covid wards went as soon as the first lockdown ended in 2020.
They have been reinstated in NSW in the areas with Covid inpatients but they are not empty at all a present.

Looks like the vaccination rates in NSW coupled with the public health measures will hopefully get them to be decommissioned sooner rather than later.

Yes Covid 19 patients may come and go, but sick patients never will.

The negative pressure rooms just revert to their normal patents. TB, immune compromised etc.

Plus not all ICU is suited to covid patients due to its infectious nature. Many Melbourne hospitals created special covid wards instead. Though these come and go and beds are a scarce resource. So no no bed or ward stays vacant for long in non-covid surges.

What active Covid 19 outbreaks can do though is lead to less patients being treated in part due to patients avoiding/delaying treatment and in part as when special extra covid wards get created the measures involved often lead to less overall capacity at the hospital. If it gets really bad as in the Vic Second Wave a whole lot of surgeries and treatments get deferred.

 

[N860CR]

The dedicated Covid wards went as soon as the first lockdown ended in 2020.
They have been reinstated in NSW in the areas with Covid inpatients but they are not empty at all a present.

Not quite. Had at least one open during the Northern Beaches outbreak, although admittedly it only saw two people. I’ve left that facility so not sure of it’s current status but I’d like to hope it’s back in service.

Shutting down facilities in the middle of a global pandemic though…. There’s some serious government forward planning.

 

[N860CR]

Hmmm.. 8 months jail is not insignificant and does send a message this is unacceptable. Also pleading guilty to lawful directives when the ‘law’ upon which it is based not recognised by your movement I did find interesting...

Its a dangerously slippery slope though. Even in this forum alone we can all at least agree on one fact; plenty of people aren’t happy with and don’t agree with governments actions. If we’re actually at the point where the government is imprisoning people purely to stop them protesting, then I’m not sure there’s any going back.

For what it’s worth, we’ve now converted a protester into a criminal and, as history will show, prison only tends to send them further down that road.