Booking extra full fare ticket to block seats / upgrades

[Matty F]

Oh, please …

Care to finish that thought?

I have no problem with the OP musing about their plans here. It’s a flyer’s forum isn’t it? Much gaming the system discussed before and I hope into the future.

Then discuss it, instead of throwing around these cheap one-liners. No one is trying to silence the thread, just calling out this BS for what it is.

Can't you find other ways to game the system that doesn't artificially reduce inventory?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

That could be a perspective on a certain airline’s behaviour over Easter, and more ( catering, bags etc). All those people turning up wasn’t a surprise - they all had advance bookings after all …

I have no problem with the OP musing about their plans here. It’s a flyer’s forum isn’t it? Much gaming the system discussed before and I hope into the future.

At worst I see the plan no different from an airline overbooking. Selling tickets on a flight they know cannot all be flown. Check the quote above again. Does overbooking not sound like that?

I am totally opposed to overbooking - I think it's an outdated legacy carried over from the 50s and 60s but somehow airlines have managed to get away with it and have it accepted as a 'standard' business practice. Well.... almost... except in the EU and a couple of other countries where consumer law steps in and protects the passenger. In Australia we're not so lucky.

 

[RooFlyer]

Care to finish that thought?

No, brevity can be virtuous and say a lot more than some long winded diatribe

Then discuss it, instead of throwing around these cheap one-liners. No one is trying to silence the thread, just calling out this BS for what it is.

Discuss it… see couple of posts above yours

By all means call away … at least the OP has put their money up where their idea is and is to report back. If unsuccessful, then your own cracks may have more traction.

 

[Austman]

I think one thing to consider is intent. The laws around fraud have an “intention to defraud” component.

So an airline might have to establish that intent.

Booking flights across multiple days with an intention to take one of them might be seen as different to booking a flight with no intention of ever taking it, even if both actions are done within the booking rules.

 

[Must...Fly!]

I think one thing to consider is intent. The laws around fraud have an “intention to defraud” component.

So an airline might have to establish that intent.

Booking flights across multiple days with an intention to take one of them might be seen as different to booking a flight with no intention of ever taking it, even if both actions are done within the booking rules.

But quite different to booking 2 or 3 seats on one flight IMO

 

[aikman]

Over at the Qantas forums, people proudly book multiple J award flights for the same trip so they can choose later which one they want to fly, all because cancellation fees are waived.

Similar situation yet nobody seems bothered by that practice.

 

[Austman]

Similar situation yet nobody seems bothered by that practice.

It might be similar but it's not the same.

Booking multiple flights for the same passenger with an intention to take one of them else pay any cancellation penalty that applies is not quite the same as separately booking a seat (beside a certain another passenger) without ever intending to fly.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Over at the Qantas forums, people proudly book multiple J award flights for the same trip so they can choose later which one they want to fly, all because cancellation fees are waived.

Similar situation yet nobody seems bothered by that practice.

I'm bothered by it if origin and destination is more or less the same and it's just for choice later...

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I'm bothered by it if origin and destination is more or less the same and it's just for choice later...

In reality these days it’s more like seeing which of the five options is actually left flying by the time you wanna go

 

[RooFlyer]

Airlines also proactively trawl through reservations to find duplicate bookings, or ‘impossible’ bookings… multiple flights that cannot all be taken due to timing.

They needn't look very hard - as anyone who has had Qantas (at least) cancel one of a pax's multiple flights and substituted an 'impossible' sector (eg departing before the connecting flight arrives)

They will contact passengers to ask which one of the multiple bookings they actually want, and cancel the rest (sometimes the passenger isn’t even asked, the first booking is kept and the rest cancelled).

And sometimes they will cancel ALL of a pax's non-duplicated flights and not even tell them!!

I'm OT, I know, but just indicating that airlines (one in particular) treat their passengers the same way as the OP is suggesting they wish to try the other way round. That's why I'm relaxed about the attempt, and interested to see how it pans out.

 

[thecatinthehat]

At last the long awaited update to the saga.

So I had a nice long flight booked with some family (4 pax inclusive myself) and low and behold 3 decided to cancel 12 hours before the flight due to gastro. This is all full fare J for them and Flex Y for me ( I always like to treat them).

Within 1 hour my upgrade cleared to J. It happened on the hour so I'm not sure if this is an hourly system process. Had no one sitting next to me although the other seats were full.

The second flight (the way back) only 2 of my relatives were booked, one decided to cancel their J ticket around 24 hours out, and I cleared an upgrade about 4 hours in. The second one (beside me at that point after I chose my seat) cancelled 1 hour out and the seat was unoccupied for the flight.

This was on a load factor of >95% and >90% (I asked each time at the gate "how full is the flight"...)

To be quite honest changing travel plans are quite a hassle so not something I would do regularly. But there were no issues. The only thing is you don't get back the credit card fees (~10 pp i think)

I'm ready for all the rage comments and the moral indignation... 3,2,1....

 

[Astro]

Oh boy. Here we go again.

 

[TMP]

Oh boy. Here we go again.

*Gets the popcorn*

 

[Must...Fly!]

At last the long awaited update to the saga.

So I had a nice long flight booked with some family (4 pax inclusive myself) and low and behold 3 decided to cancel 12 hours before the flight due to gastro. This is all full fare J for them and Flex Y for me ( I always like to treat them).

Within 1 hour my upgrade cleared to J. It happened on the hour so I'm not sure if this is an hourly system process. Had no one sitting next to me although the other seats were full.

The second flight (the way back) only 2 of my relatives were booked, one decided to cancel their J ticket around 24 hours out, and I cleared an upgrade about 4 hours in. The second one (beside me at that point after I chose my seat) cancelled 1 hour out and the seat was unoccupied for the flight.

This was on a load factor of >95% and >90% (I asked each time at the gate "how full is the flight"...)

To be quite honest changing travel plans are quite a hassle so not something I would do regularly. But there were no issues. The only thing is you don't get back the credit card fees (~10 pp i think)

I'm ready for all the rage comments and the moral indignation... 3,2,1....

Won't be hard to find out who you are based on this information

 

[JohnK]

I am totally opposed to overbooking - I think it's an outdated legacy carried over from the 50s and 60s but somehow airlines have managed to get away with it and have it accepted as a 'standard' business practice. Well.... almost... except in the EU and a couple of other countries where consumer law steps in and protects the passenger. In Australia we're not so lucky.

It's actually a disgusting practice and one that should be stopped. I don't care what reasons airlines give. If people are gaming the system then stop the loopholes allowing people to game the system.

By the way I was on the receiving end of this a few years ago. Booked SYD-OOL for myself then new booking for daughter at a later time but forgot to link the bookings.

At the airport they said I was on the flight but daughter not on the flight. Given seats on next flight but luggage put on later flight so had to wait at OOL for luggage and stroller.

Once a flight is full stop selling tickets for the flight in the hope that someone cancels or does not show. If all show up then you'll almost certainly inconvenience someone.

 

[Must...Fly!]

This topic comes up every now and then, but the question really is @JohnK would you be willing to pay an extra 3-5% across the board?

Or, perhaps, this is another add-on opportunity....

 

[thecatinthehat]

Won't be hard to find out who you are based on this information

I don't actually care. Good for them.

I hope I waste hours of their time so they can do what exactly? Take away my frequent flyer points which I cashed out before they went bankrupt for gift cards? Or maybe take away my status which has been literally on repeat with no action required by me.

There's always "banning" someone but I'm not quite sure how this works in Australia given they don't check IDs on flights like in the US. You could book a ticket in the name of Mickey Mouse and fly. As long as you are using different payment methods I don't see how they could do anything, heck even Revolut lets you make virtual cards.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I don't actually care. Good for them.

I hope I waste hours of their time so they can do what exactly? Take away my frequent flyer points which I cashed out before they went bankrupt for gift cards? Or maybe take away my status which has been literally on repeat with no action required by me.

There's always "banning" someone but I'm not quite sure how this works in Australia given they don't check IDs on flights like in the US. You could book a ticket in the name of Mickey Mouse and fly. As long as you are using different payment methods I don't see how they could do anything, heck even Revolut lets you make virtual cards.

FF points won’t be an issue. Criminal charges would be the concern.

 

[thecatinthehat]

FF points won’t be an issue. Criminal charges would be the concern.

Nah.

 

[ozstamps]

Seems like an AWFUL lot of stuffing about (and the CERTAIN loss of the credit card fees on the 3 Biz Class 'cancels' outlined above, as you have agreed) just to 'maybe' get an empty seat next to you, or having an upgrade bid maybe clear - that might have cleared anyway in the normal way.

Airline staff hover around all gates praying for seat cancels, to use their generous 10% or whatever of fare perk for Biz flights, and unless your phantom rellies check in 30 or 40 mins ahead, those seats are released back into inventory.

As others have pointed out, you have ID'd yourself pretty much, and your account getting flagged or clobbered is pretty real I'd suggest. All to 'maybe' get a spare seat alongside. Makes zero sense to me anyway.