Bumped Onto Jetstar To Japan

[ricco]

Here's today's answer from Qantas.
Before I give it, I'd urge you to read my original posting to understand why this has gone on for so long and to understand
Qantas maintains that we are not entitled to Starclass.
Q affirms that we are QFF passengers on Jetstar flight
Q has never maintained that JQi economy is the same as QF economy.
Q states that we are entitled to 2 meals and drinks, headphones as outlined by d15.in.oz earlier today.
Q states that we are not entitled to free DVD player hire or a pillow.
Q states that there is no fuel surcharge compensation since the surcharge is the same for both airlines.
Q states that an exit row allocation is up to Jetstar.
Q will not offer FF points compensation
Q does not apologise for any inconvenience that this all this may have caused.

My response is that we are being dudded here and that for corporation as large as Q to refuse to come to the party over a small thing like a DVD player gives an insight into a culture that is simply mean, intransigent with all its employees under strict instruction to hold the line - don't give a centimetre.

Qff failed to notify us of the change of flights with no guarantee that we would have found out about going to Tokyo until we got to the airport. That had the potential to wreck our holiday. There was no apology for that from Q. Sad company.

Hence, I go the country's airwaves next week to enlighten other QFF members as to what is in store for them should they ever get dumped onto Jetstar.

The price of a ticket on Jqi Starclass Sydney to Osaka is $1340 excluding taxes etc.
The cost of a Qantas ticket economy Sydney-Osaka is $1252.
The cost of a JQi economy ticket ranges between $370 or $1040(jetsaver)

 

[ricco]

Interesting. I just posted a reply detailing Q's response to my requests. What's happened to the post?

 

[NM]

Interesting. I just posted a reply detailing Q's response to my requests. What's happened to the post?

Its there now. Just triggered a spam filter so your thread needed moderation approval until it would show.

 

[d15.in.oz]

Q states that we are entitled to 2 meals and drinks, headphones as outlined by d15.in.oz earlier today....

Thanks, but your acknowledgement is slightly misdirected… danielribo deserves credit in post #2, and serfty later on for providing the link to the QFF website.

 

[ricco]

Thank you, I stand corrected.
Just finished having a chat with the Jetstar call centre. Asked about my booking on the flight. Yes it's there and guess where - seat 36J. Where's that I ask? Over the wing was the response. Who did that I ask. Guess who. Can you change it I ask? Sure, where would you like? ( Not having a seating plan in front of me - I said "surprise me"! He gave 52J.
I said I had information that the seat pitch varied between the front and back of the plane. He said no - it's 31" all the way through except Starclass.

I said how about exit row? He said that's done at the check in desk. Staff will assess your suitability for exit row depending on whether I can assist or hinder in an emergency. ( Once, I shared an exit row seat on Austrian with a basketballer -seven feet tall and a 20 stone guy in between us. Were we a hindrance or assistance?)

I asked if he had my wife's booking there. He wouldn't say. My wife uses her maiden name. Privacy prevented him from speaking. This was not a problem talking to qantas about my wife's booking. But it was understandable, Jetstar's approach.

Now, I wonder if someone can direct me to a seatplan of an Jetstar airbus - that would be helpful.

 

[NM]

Now, I wonder if someone can direct me to a seatplan of an Jetstar airbus - that would be helpful.

When the Qantas Web site is back available (been unavailable all day), you can find it there by following the "in The Air" link and then "Seating Plans" and then select the A330-200. The seat layout has not changed since these aircraft for Qantas domestic.

You can also have a look at Welcome to SeatGuru! Your Guide to Airplane Seats and In-flight Amenities and select Qantas and A330-200 to see the map as well as tips as to which seats are considered best.

Note that row 36 is right at the front of the wing and is likely to have a reasonable forward view. See the map on Seat Guru. Row 52 is at te rear of the wing and will have little forward view.

It is common for airlines to only allow exit row allocations at the airport when they can see that you are not physically impaired in a manner that could be a hinderence in the case of an emergency. QF will permit Platinum FF members to pre-allocate emergency exit rows but require the check-in agent to assure the system that the passenger is suitable for an exit row. QF Bronze FF members cannot pre-allocate exit row seats, but can similarly request them upon check-in at the airport.

 

[Wunala Dreaming]

Qantas.com is working perfectly fine and has been all day.

A330-200 (Seatmap on Qantas.com)

Regards

 

[ricco]

NM thank you very much for the information. Can I include this website address in the press releases I am doing at the moment - purely for any researcher to have an in-depth look at what the situation is.

I assume that Qantas staff monitor this site frequently to see what's happening out there in FF land.

It has been some time since I have had this much pleasure? writing a PR.

Some might think it unfair of me but there has been information that I have withheld from this discussion that relates to my wife's personal circumstance and the reasons for this trip - information I have provided to Qantas in this matter for their consideration.
Qantas' response here is a measure of the monumental coughry that some in Qantas are capable of - but they only do it because they are encouraged and rewarded for it.

It is no wonder that the CEO of Qantas can predict that the airline will double its profits by 2008. When you have staff speaking to you about Qantas "products" rather than "flights", presenting a "well, take it or leave it, we don't really care" attitude, then the company deserves public condemnation.

 

[DJ737]

Hi there

Just a couple of points about JQI economy service :

1...Free headsets are provided to all passengers for Mainscreen / Audio IFE

2...Bottles of water are also provided free to all passengers. Larger bottles are also available for sale from the trolley, although between services if you ask for the smaller bottle provided when you board, these are provided free. (subject to availability)

3...If you wish to purchase the full meal option on board rather than pre ordering, you can have it when you want, rather than during the meal service, just hit the call bell, pay your $15 and it will delivered to your seat in about 10 mins. I done this about 5hrs into a HNL-MEL flight and about 3 hrs before the main meal service was delivered to those who pre-paid.

Not sure if this just applies to HNL flights or all JQI long hauls

Cheers
DJ737

 

[geoffb78]

Ricco

What happened to the 6000 point rebate that QF offered you in the first 'round' of negotiations?

It seems they went backwards in the 'generosity' of their compensation offer.

Geoff.

 

[ricco]

I rejected that out of hand. See a previous post today on what that 6000 points really meant in terms of compensation in an overall spend of 144000 points.
It begs the question as why I would ever bother to fly Qantas again. Why face the prospect of being dumped again onto Jetstar at some time in the future using FF points.
For a bit of fun, go onto the QFF website and using the points calculator, see where 6000 points will get you.
Is 6000 points better than nothing? Yes, but only if you believed that what has happened to my wife and I won't be repeated.

 

[Soundguy]

- Comparing Qantas to Jetstar, NM says both have:

• Hit or Miss cabin crew

Is this a reference to the recent mile-high QF attendant vs film star escapade? If so do you imply the same service is available on Jetstar? ......for Starclass pax only?

OK, couldn't resist..... the thread mood needed lifting! (or crushing perhaps? Got to be another pun in there somewhere)

Hey Ricco, things could be worse. Jetstar cancelled an international flight I had booked (without telling me) because they no longer fly that route. They don't even want to refund my money.... Scrooge airways! Now I'm trying to reschedule my connecting QF flight with no sucess so far. Booking too far ahead can come back to bite it seems.

 

[ricco]

Soundguy, why won't they refund? Why didn't they contact you?

Booking in advance should never be a problem. The problem here in both our cases is how QF and JQ handled or mishandled the change. We all accept that airlines will change schedules but there should be equity in your compensation and making these drastic changes like cancelling flights does not absolve them of their responsibility to take care of their customers. After all, they've got your money. The problem is that they make you feel like they've done you a huge favour by doing nothing more than they are legally obliged to do.
For example, on the matter of notification of the change of flight for us - in all the converations I have had, Qantas could never give an assurance that they would not fail to contact me before we left on April 5. I asked when we would have been notified? They had no idea but they believed they would and at no point acknowledged that they had failed in their duty in the matter of notification.
Soundguy, they can't be permitted to treat customers like this.
There have been 1000 views of this thread in 3 days. It is really an issue which has touched a real nerve in this community.

You and I posted because we feel we have been treated poorly.

Finally, when I asked why Qantas had refused the change to Starclass - in addition to the "you're in Q economy, if you were in Q business, then it's Starclass for you" line, it was made clear that I was only one person; that if there were more in the same boat, then they might consider the change but since there were only two us complaining, we should, essentially, shut up and be happy with what we got from them.

I think the wider travelling public is jaded, cynical and resigned to the fact that corporations like Qantas, Telstra etc. will, on the balance of probabilities, attempt to cover up mistakes, refuse to accept responsibility to the satisfaction of the wronged customer and do just about anything short of breaching the Trade Practices Act to extract the one remaining dollar from your pocket.
You rarely hear the CEO of Qantas talking about customer service. Remember, it's a long time since a Qantas executive has travelled in economy.
But, the Australian public always has time for a good David and Goliath. We shall see.

 

[JohnK]

It begs the question as why I would ever bother to fly Qantas again. Why face the prospect of being dumped again onto Jetstar at some time in the future using FF points.

I think you will find that you are not alone. If this happened to me I would certainly never fly QF again.

 

[Evan]

I think the thing you have to understand is that QF have stopped flying the route, just have BA with a lot of BA connect flights, and instead on just offering a refund they also gave you the added option of JQ service. Its your choice !

If you book that far in advance it can happen and has happened to me.
I say just get over it ! I really think you are being rather well treated given the situation, the the real alternative option was a lot worse.
E

 

[Dave Noble]

I agree with Evan here

A flight in ECONOMY class was purchased ( albeit using points )
Between time of purchase and time of travel the airline stopped operating the route

In this case, you have the option to be rebooked onto another carrier ( in the same class of service ) or to be refunded the purchase price

This is what QF have offered; they have offered travel in the economy section of the Jetstar alternative.

If you are not happy with the alternative then take a refund and book another service

There is absolutely no reason for the airline to provide travel in a higher class of service on the alternative service

Dave

 

[TravelCheap]

"...A flight in ECONOMY class was purchased ( albeit using points )
Between time of purchase and time of travel the airline stopped operating the route..."

Ah yes, but Qantas OWN Jetstar. Imagine if overnight Qantas cancelled half its routes and switched everyone to Jetstar who suddenly took on those routes. Maybe then ppl would agree that its wrong. If ppl choose to fly on a no-frills airline that's good, but to sell (albeit with points, which have a value)(imagine if you bought a Plasma TV that comes with a free a DVD player but find the DVD player doesn't work and the retailer says 'stiff cheese') a ticket on a with-frills airline but then seat you on a no frills airline instead --- that's wrong surely??

 

[TravelCheap]

er .. um .. how do you start a new thread here? ... I can see how to post replies but not how to start a thread ....

 

[Kiwi Flyer]

go to the relevant forum page (eg QFF) and click on new thread

 

[ricco]

Dave, thank you your post.

Sydney-Osaka one way costs 36000 QFF pts economy

36000 FF pts means an economy ticket valued at $1017(Red e deal) or $1252(Supersaver) or $1595 (Flexisaver). If I could take the Sydney-Osaka flight on Q on the day after we travel (April 6) then only the Flexisaver ($1595) is available now.

If I had redeemed the 36000 on Jetstar in the first place, then I would be buying a ticket which is valued at $370 or $1040. (Starclass is $1340)

If I took a refund as you put it, and then went to Jetstar, I could buy a ticket for $370, pay say an extra $30 for the amenities and get the same level of service, the same flight and sit beside a QFF passenger bumped off a Q flight where the economy seat has a minimum value of at least $1017.


How would Q calculate the refund value? You assume that Q would offer a refund.

Now, let me respond to your other comments.
Yes, a flight in economy class was purchased. Be it money or points as consideration, a transaction occurred and a contract was entered into where there are rights and obligations for both parties.

You say we have the option of rebooking onto another carrier. That is an option that Q took away from us when they failed to inform either of us of the deletion of the Q flight to Oaska. Between us we have two mobiles, 3 email addresses, answering machine and message banks. There was nix, nada from Q. If I had not checked the booking this week, then we would have appeared at Sydney on the day, only to find out that we are headed to Tokyo which would have resulted in a financial loss for us through cancelled hotel bookings etc in Osaka and hotel costs in Tokyo. If we had been informed earlier, then the rebooking/refunds options would have been considered. And remember, Qantas advertises on its phone line that you do not have to confirm your flights.

On your point of Q offering the Jetstar alternative. That was never offered at the outset. Q were pushing for us to go to Tokyo instead. The Jetstar offer only came because I said no to the flight to Tokyo.

Put simply, there has been a material failure by Q in the performance of this contract such that it took away my ability to exercise some of my rights in this commercial arrangement. In other words, they put us between a rock and a hard place with a real potential to cause economic loss for us.

I disagree. There are some very good reasons for Q to come to the party.
I hope the above may clarify your thoughts on the matter