Citi Select (post March 2013) - ? worth $700 annual fee

[Jack_OC]

Citi is still the best card to earn KF points on, especially for overseas spend IMO.

Agree it's the best MC or Visa for earning KF points domestically and best full stop overseas, but I'm not convinced it outdoes the Altitude Black Amex/MC combo. Depends on your spending patterns though.

 

[Spizz]

Well yes from an Amex local spend POV with the WP Altitude Black $1 will equal 1.5 SQ Miles where as on the Citi Select Card $1= 1.33 SQ Miles. Guess it depends on how many places you shop at that take an Amex card without the surcharge. Also the Westpac Singapore Platinum card also have the same spend to earn ratio for SQ as the Altitude Black, with the latter giving you more flexability of Airline programs.

 

[Jack_OC]

Guess it depends on how many places you shop at that take an Amex card without the surcharge.

If you're willing to pay a high annual fee, you shouldn't necessarily write off the idea of being willing to pay Amex surcharges instead, as the annual fee is just a surcharge in disguise. For example, if you spend $70k per year with Citi Select ($700 fee), it's like paying a 1% surcharge on every transaction. And I suspect most people would spend less than that, making the effective surcharge per transaction even higher. Since my Altitude Black fee is just $150, I could pay a lot of Amex surcharges and still pay way less than $700 per year in total. And most major retailers, restaurants, hotels etc accept Amex without a surcharge.

So for me, the only time where Select is a clear winner domestically is where Amex is not accepted at all. If I didn't have Select, I'd only earn 0.625 pts per $ with the Black MC on those transactions. But the question is, is it worth paying $700 per year to double my points on a small minority of my transactions? I guess it's a matter of working out how many additional points Select gets me on those transactions, and deciding if I'm willing to pay $700 for that number of points.

 

[legroom]

What Jack commented was correct.

There are instances where Amex is not accepted at all. Full Stop.

If your spending pattern is such that the non-AMEX component could justify the fees, than it is your call to continue the Select if you remain keen on SQ.

It is expensive, no doubt!

But you have to work out your potential SQ point earn and match that with the fee and then make a decision.

I read somewhere that to 'top up' your SQ points (if you were short), it is something like $40 per 1,000 points (correct me if I am wrong here).

 

[ronicat]

I have Black for for Amex and Select for Visa. Fee is justifiable for me as I have $300,000 + pa which cannot be paid by Amex and the difference in points between Black MasterCard and Select Visa more than covers this.

 

[Spizz]

Legroom- That is correct. $40USD per 1000 points.

Guess I'm in a differents sort of situation, as I'm on a Signature card @ $199 PA for the life of the card. I do purchase a bit from overseas and the bonus points of the Citi card are to hard to pass up.

As Jack said I guess it does depend on your spending circumstances, but I always thought the local surcharge for Amex (for places here that apply one) is not 1% but more like 3%. Is that not correct? Part of the reason I didn't consider the Black Card as a supplement.

 

[Jack_OC]

I read somewhere that to 'top up' your SQ points (if you were short), it is something like $40 per 1,000 points (correct me if I am wrong here).

That's correct, so for $680 (just less than the Select annual fee) you could buy 17,000 points. You'd have to spend over $24k per year in places where Amex is not accepted for Select to generate 17,000 points more than the Altitude Black MC. And bear in mind that paying to top up KF points is one of the most expensive ways there is to generate points, so if Select is only breaking even with that .......

IMHO, it's starting to look like Select is only a good option if you spend a lot overseas.

 

[Jack_OC]

but I always thought the local surcharge for Amex (for places here that apply one) is not 1% but more like 3%. Is that not correct? Part of the reason I didn't consider the Black Card as a supplement.

It varies. In most places it's zero, but if there is a surcharge it's generally 1.5-2%. I don't think I've ever seen it as high as 3%, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Anyway, across all your Amex spend, the average surcharge will be very low.

By the way, if you want to look into Amex further check out the thread on buying gift cards in supermarkets. This not only allows you to avoid Amex surcharges, but if you use a card like the Amex Plat Edge, you get 3 FF pts per dollar on all spending at the supermarket, and by buying gift cards, that can include petrol, bunnings, myer, Dan Murphy's etc etc.

 

[Jack_OC]

I have Black for for Amex and Select for Visa. Fee is justifiable for me as I have $300,000 + pa which cannot be paid by Amex and the difference in points between Black MasterCard and Select Visa more than covers this.

Bloody hell! Yes it's pretty clear cut in your case!

 

[legroom]

Guys

The annual card 'year' in fact covers two calendar years !

It allowed me two complimentary hotel stays which effectively reduce the annual fee to about $100.00 approx.

Jack, my honorary accountant, would surely be approving of that!

 

[diningdecadence]

Guys

The annual card 'year' in fact covers two calendar years !

It allowed me two complimentary hotel stays which effectively reduce the annual fee to about $100.00 approx.

Jack, my honorary accountant, would surely be approving of that!

can you explain please?

 

[legroom]

can you explain please?

Let's say your card renewal date is in May 2013

You have one free hotel stay in 2013 and then one more before end of May 2014

 

[R36snowbound]

Ronicat,

You must have a very high personal income because they could not possibly be work / business transactions, could they.....

I hold the same cards as you and Citibank is my Amex back up card, Amex for service, Citibank for acceptance.

A few months ago, I had a telephone call from Citibank regarding the cards T&C's and my spending patterns but nothing further since then.

I hope Citibank is not a ticking time bomb.

 

[ronicat]

2 x boarding school fees get it halfway there
Got to look for the positives in sending your kids away to school

 

[cove]

Ronicat I heard a Sydney boarding school was charging more than $40,000 a year. That is a lot of points!

 

[ronicat]

Cove, that would only be the boarding part. You need to double that per child to come close. Just think what we would have done with the fourteen years (combined) of boarding fees before discovering this site. Mind you when our daughter went away in 2001 the fees were just under $30000 and now they are more than double. Yes there are cheaper schools but they often come with bills for every additional thing they do plus when you trust your twelve year old to someone you want a choice. It has helped the family to J return flights to the UK for Christmas

 

[cove]

I think I was the last person to pre-pay the school fees through to year 12 for my two sons when they were just starting school. $6000 a year seemed to be quite a bit but it was a bargain.
We are only allowed to prepay our nieces schooling by one year and that is almost finished but has been great for points.

 

[PAZ]

Looks like Citi stopped reward points for ATO payments in March or April. No notice given. Call Centre claims to know nothing about it but did say that T&C's state that points are for retail purch only, not Govt fees & charges.

No explanation on how they have been awarding points on ATO for years.

 

[Nizar]

Guys how strict are they with their income checks ?
Would it possible for me to show contracts/letters of offer/regular money coming into my account, etc instead of an income tax assessment ?

I have my own business so whilst my income is more than 120k, my taxable income is much less.

Cheers

 

[legroom]

Just put my new car on the card.

No surcharge as it was part of the deal.

Approx 1/3 of the SYD LHR return F Saver !

Off to work on the remaining 2/3 !!!!