Criminal record and obtaining a US visa

[Melburnian1]

Ash Jamez, like many I too hope that you will be granted a visa. You are going about it the correct way: well done.

 

[Isochronous]

The US wouldn't have direct access to Australian criminal records. That's why there is a disclosure box.

 

[Flashback]

It's entirely unlikely offshore records are available in USA.
Short answer; by asking and saying no and getting approval pretty much infers they don't know
AFP would hold commonwealth offences. Whether they hold all State-based convictions is a moot point

BESIDE moral turpitude means what ?

i do like this view which probably been posted before but this is a long thread
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_turpitude

some criminal offences in Australia aren't inside the US Defintion.

There used to be a nice PDF that told you, but it seems to have disappeared in the last 12 months: https://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86942.pdf

Edit: archive version available here http://web.archive.org/web/20150222201304/http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86942.pdf

The I94W / ESTA no longer directly refers to "Moral Turpitude".

Not directly on the question, but last time I checked (when they first reworded the question) if you dig deeper to get further help on what the question is actually asking it does reference MT again. The page looks to have changed again since I last viewed it and you have to enter a heap of details to get to the next page with the questions, so for me it will remain a mystery

 

[whatmeworry]

Oh the Land Of The Free And Paranoid.

I have known people who have ticked no, in relation to getting into the US and NZ. I would say unless you trigger certain things in the system, they won't bother doing a background check. Having said that, If they do find out, you probably will find it tough getting into the USA ever again.

Don't know why it takes them 6 months or more to approve Visas when it is easier to get into a communist country.

What is ‘moral turpitude’?

Our Helpline receives many calls from individuals looking for a definition of ‘moral turpitude’. By looking through the Consular guidance given to officials to help them decide whether to give someone a visa to the US or not, we have been able to identify a number of convictions that would not be classed as ‘moral turpitude’.
Crimes against property which do not fall within the definition of moral turpitude

(1) Damaging private property (where intent to damage not required);
(2) Breaking and entering (requiring no specific or implicit intent to commit a crime involving moral turpitude);
(3) Passing bad checks (where intent to defraud not required);
(4) Possessing stolen property (if guilty knowledge is not essential);
(5) Joy riding (where the intention to take permanently not required); and
(6) Juvenile delinquency
Crimes committed against governmental authority, which would not constitute moral turpitude for visa-issuance purposes

(1) Black market violations;
(2) Breach of the peace;
(3) Carrying a concealed weapon;
(4) Desertion from the Armed Forces;
(5) Disorderly conduct;
(6) Drunk or reckless driving;
(7) Drunkenness;
(8) Escape from prison;
(9) Failure to report for military induction;
(10) False statements (not amounting to perjury or involving fraud);
(11) Firearms violations;
(12) Gambling violations;
(13) Immigration violations;
(14) Liquor violations;
(15) Loan sharking;
(16) Lottery violations;
(17) Possessing burglar tools (without intent to commit burglary);
(18) Smuggling and customs violations (where intent to commit fraud is absent);
(19) Tax evasion (without intent to defraud); and
(20) Vagrancy.
Crimes committed against the person, family relationship, or sexual morality which do not involve moral turpitude

(1) Assault (simple) (i.e., any assault, which does not require an evil intent or depraved motive, although it may involve the use of a weapon, which is neither dangerous nor deadly);
(2) Illegitimacy (i.e., the offense of begetting an illegitimate child);
(3) Creating or maintaining a nuisance (where knowledge that premises were used for prostitution is not necessary);
(4) Incest (when a result of a marital status prohibited by law);
(5) Involuntary manslaughter (when killing is not the result of recklessness);
(6) Libel;
(7) Mailing an obscene letter;
(8) Mann Act violations (where coercion is not present);
(9) Riot; and
(10) Suicide (attempted).

 

[lovemehateme]

Hi!

I'm a first time flyer to the USA and I'm a young female going alone in 10 days time.

I applied for an ESTA way back in April with no issues and it's still approved.

I answered no to the question asking If i've been arrested or convicted of a crime. I said no.

Now I've recently been thinking and going made over this below scinareo.

2012 or 2013 I was working in retail and I quit because my manager was a psyscho. Had some heated words and she said if she saw me again she'd make my life hell.. that was in febuary.

I went shopping one day at the old store and no issues. This was in July. She wasn't there. About a month later I get a call from police saying I've had a complaint made against me for stealing from the shop that day I went in. He wanted me to come down to the police station when I could for a chat.

So I went down, had an interview with them which they filmed. They took my photo and fingerprints for indetification. I just said no comment for the whole thing cause I had nothing to say to be honest. I was stunned by the whole thing. He said thanks for coming in and showed me out and that was in.

About 3 months later I got a letter in the mail saying the complaint was dropped and they listed a store name which wasn't even the store i was questioned about.. it was a store in another state. So the whole thing was a joke. False complaint, letter from police with incorrect information on what store it was.

The photo/prints are destroyed after 6 months if nothing happens in Victoria. Would they still show up on US Customs when I swipe my passport??? Will any of this show up???

I ordered a police check and there was nothing on it.

I'm just freaking out!! I'm going for my birthday and did nothing wrong back then.. and now I feel like a criminal for no reason. I have no record and I've never done anything illegal in my life.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Hi lovemehateme and welcome to AFF.

'Disgruntled former boss made a false allegation' doesn't seem like it fits within grounds for the US to pick up anything. I'd not go into the whole 'psycho' boss thing... just 'disgruntled' and 'nothing eventuated' sounds less dramatic. I can't see this being a problem - were you actually arrested or charged? Doesn't sound like it.

 

[cove]

Welcome to AFF lovemehateme. Enjoy your trip....you have an ESTA and no police record.

 

[Ash Jamez]

Curious to get my police check done for "Vosa purposes", as Victoria don't comply with the spend convictions scheme and even though I have "no conviction recorded" they should still divulge the charges/ record to employers. Let's see if the also tell the US? Although a VISA is different to an ESTA. I'm purely trying to debunk this theory now

 

[lovemehateme]

Hi lovemehateme and welcome to AFF.

'Disgruntled former boss made a false allegation' doesn't seem like it fits within grounds for the US to pick up anything. I'd not go into the whole 'psycho' boss thing... just 'disgruntled' and 'nothing eventuated' sounds less dramatic. I can't see this being a problem - were you actually arrested or charged? Doesn't sound like it.

I wasn't charged with anything. Nothing came about it. The complaint was withdrawn for lack of evidence. I don't know if it was an arrest... thats the part I'm confused. I don't know what classes an arrest. I was interviewed, photographed and fingerprinted. But they called me a month after the supposed incident and asked me to come in when I can.

I spoke with a police officer I know and they said the fingerprints and photo would be destroyed and that it wouldn't show up anywhere.. neither would this incident. I was told that customs has to actually request information from AFP if they're suspicious of anything.

 

[Ash Jamez]

It doesn't matter how small or big the crime is, you still have to wait the 5 years and even if you were convicted of the crime, you can still try to apply for a visa after 5 years. Of course if you were not convicted then you do not have to wait 5 years, but any convcition, recorded or not recorded, you still need to wait the 5 year ban unless they tell you otherwise when you go for your interview (depending on the circumstances)

I know I'm resurrecting a mummified post here but this is exactly what I need answered. I was found guilty of but not convicted, obtaining property by deception X6 (I was a moronic 18 year old trying to impress "friends" who used me to get phones, working for a Telco at the time I put through phone plans under my name with the intention of not paying them).

As it was my first offence the magistrate did not record a conviction. My situation gets more complex as it then says I breached my CBO as I called in sick 3 times, (with a med cert) but my corrections officer who hated me (I'm not crying poor me, he literally hated me) didn't inform me that, calling in sick 3 times, med cert or not was grounds for a breach. So I was back before a magistrate who, along with the prosecuter said I should be given another chance and did not record a conviction and I did my CBO at a different corrections office, with better correctional officers.

So I do have some findings of guilt but no convictions. The latest court appearance (the breach) was in 2013, is it even worth applying for a VISA, now (no conviction, apply within 5 years) or, ever? I feel like my rap sheet looks so bad! I don't even think I would get approved in 10 or 20 years. Do people with more than 5 charges ever get approved? I'm in Victoria, where VICPol will disclose my findings of guilt even without conviction until 10 years have passed. So I won't have to dig up court records, though I do have them if needed.

I just travelled the UK and Europe without a problem as they aren't concerned with low ranking crimes but hearing about the US's stance on even the lowest of low crimes, I doubt I would get in. I've wanted nothing more in life than to see the USA, especially New York City. I see so many people going through on the ESTA with criminal records and I don't know how they even get on the plane, my anxiety would be through the roof!

 

[Dr Ralph]

I know I'm resurrecting a mummified post here but this is exactly what I need answered. I was found guilty of but not convicted, obtaining property by deception X6 (I was a moronic 18 year old trying to impress "friends" who used me to get phones, working for a Telco at the time I put through phone plans under my name with the intention of not paying them).

As it was my first offence the magistrate did not record a conviction. My situation gets more complex as it then says I breached my CBO as I called in sick 3 times, (with a med cert) but my corrections officer who hated me (I'm not crying poor me, he literally hated me) didn't inform me that, calling in sick 3 times, med cert or not was grounds for a breach. So I was back before a magistrate who, along with the prosecuter said I should be given another chance and did not record a conviction and I did my CBO at a different corrections office, with better correctional officers.

So I do have some findings of guilt but no convictions. The latest court appearance (the breach) was in 2013, is it even worth applying for a VISA, now (no conviction, apply within 5 years) or, ever? I feel like my rap sheet looks so bad! I don't even think I would get approved in 10 or 20 years. Do people with more than 5 charges ever get approved? I'm in Victoria, where VICPol will disclose my findings of guilt even without conviction until 10 years have passed. So I won't have to dig up court records, though I do have them if needed.

I just travelled the UK and Europe without a problem as they aren't concerned with low ranking crimes but hearing about the US's stance on even the lowest of low crimes, I doubt I would get in. I've wanted nothing more in life than to see the USA, especially New York City. I see so many people going through on the ESTA with criminal records and I don't know how they even get on the plane, my anxiety would be through the roof!

I strongly urge you to contact the US embassy and seek advice. This is the only source of valid/reliable advice for your individual circumstances. Don't rely upon anecdotal advice provided here. This is a very serious matter and there could be criminal penalties for making false declarations on your visa application.

 

[serfty]

...I'm in Victoria, where VICPol will disclose my findings of guilt even without conviction until 10 years have passed. ...

If you can't wait until 2023 then you will need to go through the US process.

YMMV, but going by anecdotes you have little chance until at 5 years are up.

Note that Vic do not have a 'spent convictions' regulation, but as you indicate, there is a policy of non disclosure after 10 years for most issues.

 

[Quickstatus]

Spent convictions does not mean it's wiped from the criminal record. Just not disclosed under "ordinary" criminal checks.

It May be relevant under certain circumstances such applying to be a law officer- lawyer or judge, security license, firearms license or if you are sentenced for another offence then the spent conviction might be relevant.

Of course foreign jurisdictions are not bound by another countries laws and regulations so good advice to visit a US embassy to sort this out. You will then know where you stand. Alternatively visit a migration lawyer. "Just do it!"

many have not declared and got in. Just as many don't declare anything to quarantine coming into OZ and don't get searched, some do get searched and get caught.

I hear your frustration but I think you are overanalysing the whole situation and sounds like you are (out of frustration) trying to find some way to come to a different conclusion??

Have you booked an interview with your local US embassy?

 

[Ash Jamez]

Spent convictions does not mean it's wiped from the criminal record. Just not disclosed under "ordinary" criminal checks.

It May be relevant under certain circumstances such applying to be a law officer- lawyer or judge, security license, firearms license or if you are sentenced for another offence then the spent conviction might be relevant.

Of course foreign jurisdictions are not bound by another countries laws and regulations so good advice to visit a US embassy to sort this out. You will then know where you stand. Alternatively visit a migration lawyer. "Just do it!"

many have not declared and got in. Just as many don't declare anything to quarantine coming into OZ and don't get searched, some do get searched and get caught.

I hear your frustration but I think you are overanalysing the whole situation and sounds like you are (out of frustration) trying to find some way to come to a different conclusion??

Have you booked an interview with your local US embassy?

I haven't booked an appointment yet as I thought it would be an automatic "no" as it hasn't yet been 5 years. Yes, I'm frustrated because let's be honest, knowing that there are people with convictions/ findings of guilt going in and out of the US on an ESTA, is annoying. I'm annoyed because it's unfair and I guess I just have more of a conscience/ fear of law enforcement but of course, a part of me wishes I had the balls to do it on the ESTA.

The idea of going to the US, is just an idea atm as we only just got back from Europe in July, when it does come time to apply, I hope I'm mentally ready for what looks like a lot of hoop jumping and even if approved, possibly being turned back by customs at the boarder.

I guess you have to be in my situation to understand. It's not a good feeling knowing that even if I tell the truth and get approved that I could still be wasting however many thousands of dollars and time. That's all.

 

[Ash Jamez]

If you can't wait until 2023 then you will need to go through the US process.

YMMV, but going by anecdotes you have little chance until at 5 years are up.

Note that Vic do not have a 'spent convictions' regulation, but as you indicate, there is a policy of non disclosure after 10 years for most issues.

Wait until 2023? Meaning, apply for an ESTA in 2023? Yes, I read the very convoluted VICPol release policy and as I'm not a sex offender/ did not do time in prison, no outcomes will be disclosed after 10 years.

What does YMMV stand for? I'm terrible with acronyms.

 

[cove]

Our staffer waited 6 months and his application has been approved now. There is no way to speed the process up that we have found.

 

[Ash Jamez]

Our staffer waited 6 months and his application has been approved now. There is no way to speed the process up that we have found.

Can I know any further details? The crime, when it happened? Etc

 

[cove]

Never asked but it was something he did at 17 or 18 and he is an excellent staff member. The thing I watch out for is sex offences as we have a duty of care in our work places. A violent assault could be the other thing.

 

[Quickstatus]

YMMV= "your mileage may vary"

yes there is is always a possibility that despite a proper visa obtained the proper way you could be turned around at the port of entry. However I would think it to be remote and tends to be revolved around questions at that time of entry or since the granting of the visa such as:

overstayed previously
not enough funds for the period of visit
new criminal convictions since granting of visa
new red flags since granting of visa - CIA puts you on a no fly list correctly or otherwise.
or they deem that you obtained the visa falsely
something wrong with your passport
you say you are on holiday but they suspect you are trying to illegally stay

 

[UP4014]

Hi!

I'm a first time flyer to the USA and I'm a young female going alone in 10 days time.

I applied for an ESTA way back in April with no issues and it's still approved.

I answered no to the question asking If i've been arrested or convicted of a crime. I said no.

Now I've recently been thinking and going made over this below scinareo.

2012 or 2013 I was working in retail and I quit because my manager was a psyscho. Had some heated words and she said if she saw me again she'd make my life hell.. that was in febuary.

I went shopping one day at the old store and no issues. This was in July. She wasn't there. About a month later I get a call from police saying I've had a complaint made against me for stealing from the shop that day I went in. He wanted me to come down to the police station when I could for a chat.

So I went down, had an interview with them which they filmed. They took my photo and fingerprints for indetification. I just said no comment for the whole thing cause I had nothing to say to be honest. I was stunned by the whole thing. He said thanks for coming in and showed me out and that was in.

About 3 months later I got a letter in the mail saying the complaint was dropped and they listed a store name which wasn't even the store i was questioned about.. it was a store in another state. So the whole thing was a joke. False complaint, letter from police with incorrect information on what store it was.

The photo/prints are destroyed after 6 months if nothing happens in Victoria. Would they still show up on US Customs when I swipe my passport??? Will any of this show up???

I ordered a police check and there was nothing on it.

I'm just freaking out!! I'm going for my birthday and did nothing wrong back then.. and now I feel like a criminal for no reason. I have no record and I've never done anything illegal in my life.

Hind sight is great, if the police ring and ask to you come down don't go. It means they aren't serious and have no evidence other than hearsay, if they did they would be around for an easy conviction. Now you have helped their cause not your own, there have been plenty of cases where prints and details not destroyed.

Don't freak out, you'll be ok just make sure you don't have sweaty hands when they do the fingerprints in the US customs hall. Nothing will show up, enjoy your vacation and post up a trip report.