Downgraded from Business Class on Qantas due to "tech crew" [pilot] Travel Requirements

[Princess Fiona]

One other consideration: what factors does QF use to determine who gets the boot from a premium cabin? I hope they don't base it on something silly like solely the fare class or whether they use points to pay for the flight/upgrade (remember points and cash are the same thing as a matter of law). In theory Qantas should have first gone by status (i.e. bronzes get the boot first) then in the case of matching status factors like fare class, enterprise relationship (i.e. flyer works for a company that has a huge contract with QF). I would be surprised if OP was somehow at the top of the boot list based on such criteria.

-RooFlyer88

It won’t be status that’s the first thing considered.
It will be fare class.
Revenue C/J esp will trump status in U.
Possible exception for CL/CIP but definitely not for WP or P1 even.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Not that I have an answer, or the solution, but its a shocking way to treat customers, for what ever reason it happened.
Imagine the shame of having a whole plane, witness the fact that Pushka and hubby had to take items out of the overhead bins, and then go back down to row 7.
I would be aghast.
But I would not scream or make a fuss, as I know, that there is a thin line where they (staff) can call AFP, as they can allege that a person is "being non co opertative".

 

[kangarooflyer88]

It won’t be status that’s the first thing considered.
It will be fare class.
Revenue C/J esp will trump status in U.
Possible exception for CL/CIP but definitely not for WP or P1 even.

That may be how QF handles this but I am arguing that is not how it should be done and that is not how other airlines handle these situations. Again, pointing back to my friend, United Airlines, they take status as the key consideration (since after all that's loyalty), then and only then if there is a tie, will they use other factors like fare class, business relationship, to break these ties (here's how they handle upgrades for instance). Qantas keeps stressing that customer loyalty is so crucial, and they love handing out trinkets to us, but these gestures can only go so far. There is a lot I enjoy about Qantas. I like the fact that my status will be recognized across the alliance for things like seating (unlike on Star Alliance). I like that Qantas has (from what I hear) a good First class lounge for its top end flyers. But there is a lot they can learn about customer service and how they treat their loyal customers when things go wrong, and if you operate an airline as big as Qantas things will go wrong.

Not that I have an answer, or the solution, but it's a shocking way to treat customers, for what ever reason it happened.
Imagine the shame of having a whole plane, witness the fact that Pushka and hubby had to take items out of the overhead bins, and then go back down to row 7.
I would be aghast.

I don't think it is fair to trivialize the matter. The fact of the matter is that happened. And sure it's just ADL to MEL, what a 25 minute flight? But imagine if this happened on SYD to LHR or SYD to JFK. Would you be happy slunking down to a middle seat in Y? Doubt it!

But I would not scream or make a fuss, as I know, that there is a thin line where they (staff) can call AFP, as they can allege that a person is "being non co opertative".

Neither would I. Generally when things go wrong when I'm travelling I don't take it out on any one. The key is to be friendly but assertive to get what you want. In my mind when I'm travelling, I have a list of things I'm expecting to extract from the airlines I fly when things go sideways, I think most frequent flyers have a similar list. For instance, a hotel and meals covered if I have to overnight due to an IRROP, extra status credits for a schedule change, etc.

 

[Pushka]

That may be how QF handles this but I am arguing that is not how it should be done and that is not how other airlines handle these situations. Again, pointing back to my friend, United Airlines, they take status as the key consideration (since after all that's loyalty), then and only then if there is a tie, will they use other factors like fare class, business relationship, to break these ties (here's how they handle upgrades for instance). Qantas keeps stressing that customer loyalty is so crucial, and they love handing out trinkets to us, but these gestures can only go so far. There is a lot I enjoy about Qantas. I like the fact that my status will be recognized across the alliance for things like seating (unlike on Star Alliance). I like that Qantas has (from what I hear) a good First class lounge for its top end flyers. But there is a lot they can learn about customer service and how they treat their loyal customers when things go wrong, and if you operate an airline as big as Qantas things will go wrong.

I don't think it is fair to trivialize the matter. The fact of the matter is that happened. And sure it's just ADL to MEL, what a 25 minute flight? But imagine if this happened on SYD to LHR or SYD to JFK. Would you be happy slunking down to a middle seat in Y? Doubt it!

Neither would I. Generally when things go wrong when I'm travelling I don't take it out on any one. The key is to be friendly but assertive to get what you want. In my mind when I'm travelling, I have a list of things I'm expecting to extract from the airlines I fly when things go sideways, I think most frequent flyers have a similar list. For instance, a hotel and meals covered if I have to overnight due to an IRROP, extra status credits for a schedule change, etc.

And what it does show is that anyone travelling on an Award ticket is vulnerable to downgrades for whatever reason, regardless of Airline status. Which makes award flying, especially for lengthy flights, a real risk.

 

[DC3]

Imagine the shame of having a whole plane, witness the fact that Pushka and hubby had to take items out of the overhead bins, and then go back down to row 7

Right again, Poochie. The Walk-of-Shame, but having done nothing wrong

 

[Pushka]

Right again, Poochie. The Walk-of-Shame, but having done nothing wrong

Gives new meaning to it! Finalised by a middle seat, when our original Y tickets were two aisle seats across from each other. And the Exec said it was a window and aisle. I asked him specifically.

 

[Princess Fiona]

That may be how QF handles this but I am arguing that is not how it should be done and that is not how other airlines handle these situations. Again, pointing back to my friend, United Airlines, they take status as the key consideration (since after all that's loyalty), then and only then if there is a tie, will they use other factors like fare class, business relationship, to break these ties (here's how they handle upgrades for instance). Qantas keeps stressing that customer loyalty is so crucial, and they love handing out trinkets to us, but these gestures can only go so far. There is a lot I enjoy about Qantas. I like the fact that my status will be recognized across the alliance for things like seating (unlike on Star Alliance). I like that Qantas has (from what I hear) a good First class lounge for its top end flyers. But there is a lot they can learn about customer service and how they treat their loyal customers when things go wrong, and if you operate an airline as big as Qantas things will go wrong.

I don't think it is fair to trivialize the matter. The fact of the matter is that happened. And sure it's just ADL to MEL, what a 25 minute flight? But imagine if this happened on SYD to LHR or SYD to JFK. Would you be happy slunking down to a middle seat in Y? Doubt it!

Neither would I. Generally when things go wrong when I'm travelling I don't take it out on any one. The key is to be friendly but assertive to get what you want. In my mind when I'm travelling, I have a list of things I'm expecting to extract from the airlines I fly when things go sideways, I think most frequent flyers have a similar list. For instance, a hotel and meals covered if I have to overnight due to an IRROP, extra status credits for a schedule change, etc.

And you are aware that QF processes upgrades the same as the United link you provided ?

For Domestic they occur at time of request if an upgrade is available. For all other upgrades including international it is based on FF status and then fare class.

 

[Mickey Mouse]

Well pilots, mechanics and other skilled workers in the profession do have terms written into their Enterprise Agreement where they need to be provided a certain class of service. This isn't an Australian thing, almost every airline in the world has such terms. And it makes sense. You don't want a pilot deadheading in to be tired when they have to operate another flight.

Probably increased in the era of the "Agreements", as one area the airline can "bargain" while screwing all other conditions. I'm sure its also increased in the modern era of entitlement. Not the case on all airlines, and certainly wasn't always the case "back in the day"!

On the subject of how it was handled ... not surprising ... royally Joyced!

 

[kangarooflyer88]

For Domestic they occur at time of request if an upgrade is available.

That has been my experience.

For all other upgrades including international it is based on FF status and then fare class.

That has not been my experience (a story for another day).

-RooFlyer88

 

[Austman]

And the Exec said it was a window and aisle. I asked him specifically.

Did you get to see your new BPs before (re)boarding?

I mean, most regular flyers on QF 737s would know that B and E seats in Y were middles.

But in the "heat" of the moment... I'd likely trust the "Exec" too.

 

[Pushka]

Did you get to see your new BPs before (re)boarding?

I mean, most regular flyers on QF 737s would know that B and E seats in Y were middles.

But in the "heat" of the moment... I'd likely trust the "Exec" too.

I think we were in a bit of shock at being taken off the plane. I trusted what he said as a direct response to my question. And when we got back to the row there was a person in one of our seats! They had to move to another seat. It was only then that I looked at the seat numbers. Bit of a cluster really.

 

[prozac]

@Pushka , what did the "exec" actually say besides you are downgraded? I am stunned he did not make an offer at the time smooth the waters and to make you feel valued still.

Maybe also the exec felt that as WP your loyalty would not come into question.
Anyway I would still want answers why the plane was delayed for 2 people who remained in the lounge after everyone else boarded. BTW could you see if they drinking alcohol? Poor form if QF staff. All grist for the mill when composing a letter.

 

[kangarooflyer88]

I mean, most regular flyers on QF 737s would know that B and E seats in Y were middles.

B and E seats on the 737 are both window and aisle seats when shadows are enforced. It seems like QF refused to enforce shadows too!

 

[Austman]

B and E seats on the 737 are both window and aisle seats when shadows are enforced.

Naaa. But I get what you are saying.

It's nothing to do with a new seat allocation after boarding was completed. B and E are still middles.

 

[DC3]

The expert commentary here is very helpful in understanding why such a thing could happen

 

[kangarooflyer88]

Breaking: Qantas on the heels of Virgin Australia's Middle Seat Lottery introduces their own program: business seat lottery. Will you stay in your business seat by the time the doors close or will some poor sod evict you?

 

[Pushka]

@Pushka , what did the "exec" actually say besides you are downgraded? I am stunned he did not make an offer at the time smooth the waters and to make you feel valued still.

Maybe also the exec felt that as WP your loyalty would not come into question.
Anyway I would still want answers why the plane was delayed for 2 people who remained in the lounge after everyone else boarded. BTW could you see if they drinking alcohol? Poor form if QF staff. All grist for the mill when composing a letter.

Too early for the bar to be open . The CSM looked embarrassed. She gave us a G&T and a bar of chocolate and said in all her 30 years of flying and with ME airlines and with Qantas she’d never seen this happen before. She said they were techies. Both said we would get points but I’m thinking that just means the upgrade points but we will see.

Post automatically merged: Aug 26, 2023

Breaking: Qantas on the heels of Virgin Australia's Middle Seat Lottery introduces their own program: business seat lottery. Will you stay in your business seat by the time the doors close or will some poor sod evict you?

As I sat down I said ‘at least Virgin offers a middle seat lottery’.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Too early for the bar to be open . The CSM looked embarrassed. She gave us a G&T and a bar of chocolate and said in all her 30 years of flying and with ME airlines and with Qantas she’d never seen this happen before. She said they were techies. Both said we would get points but I’m thinking that just means the upgrade points but we will see.

Post automatically merged: Aug 26, 2023

As I sat down I said ‘at least Virgin offers a middle seat lottery’.

So the CSM confirmed during the flight that the pax who took the J seats were tech crew ?
I don’t recall it being mentioned earlier but I might have missed it.

 

[Austman]

techies

Off topic and probably not really helpful, but I'm probably best described as a former "techie" in my profession (which involved a LOT of travel).

I was often described as "too loud".

Oh dear.

We can get a bit too animated at times.

 

[prozac]

So the CSM confirmed during the flight that the pax who took the J seats were tech crew ?
I don’t recall it being mentioned earlier but I might have missed it.

It wasn't mentioned, just speculated, which is why I asked.

@Pushka "Too early for the bar to be open " Doesn't mean they were not.