Downgraded from Business Class.

[BD1959]

I tend to doubt that Red Roo is a single person but whether they are or not I think that for the purposes of this forum they are QANTAS not a natural person. That's how I view their presence. As long as people remain within the bounds of politeness I think said Roo is fair game (pardon the pun) for Qantas aimed criticism.

Must be my day for disagreeing ...

There are times in the past when RR has posted emoticons which clearly demonstrate a lack of empathy with the message they were relaying. If you wish policy to change, you do not expect RR to effect this but to pass on the message.

There is a clear distinction between Red Roo the person(s) and QF the entity; particularly with some of the Executive Decisions which are imposed on all of the Workforce and Customers.

The "criticism" should be directed at those making such decisions and not the messenger.

Regards,

BD

 

[maninblack]

Must be my day for disagreeing ...

There are times in the past when RR has posted emoticons which clearly demonstrate a lack of empathy with the message they were relaying.

That's called PR.

Red Roo is a purely corporate animal. Must be my day for appalling puns!

 

[equus]

Provided the booking was made on a
credit card, and irrespective of whether the merchant is FC or QF, the charge back route has several advantages.

Once the charge back is processed for services not supplied, you are no longer waiting for QF or some one to get back to you, or make an offer you are happy with. If you charge back the whole transaction, they will be chasing you for payment. They are indeed entitled to fair payment for what they delivered, but as you have the money back, you need to agree what is reasonable (i.e. the net payment), hence what the "compensation" is. If you don't agree, they have to chase you - and ultimately pursue you via the courts. As soon as you have processed the charge back, advise FC or QF (or both) as appropriate, and state you are willing to pay the fair value for what was provided, but that you must reach agreement as to what is fair. Make sure you keep copies of this communication. Should agreement not be reached, this could be important to the way an outcome is eventually resolved.

Should it come to that, they will have the burden of proving what is fair (and they know it). It will also not be their interpretation that prevails, but that of a court or tribunal - which they also know.

Given that all this will cost them in lawyers and processing, and they well know that they are liable for damages, they will be much more reasonable about what they will accept - once you have the money, rather than them.

Credit card charge back is simple and powerful in these circumstances, so take advantage of it. This is one of the reasons I always pay for the airfares via CC - even when incurring the fees. This protects against non- delivery for all reasons, including insolvency of the provider, which most Travel Insurance policies won't cover.

 

[medhead]

In this case, no. It's not possible to downgrade a paying passenger to allow industry discount into the cabin. The systems are well setup to prevent this. Especially considering we are talking about LAX where there is genuine hostility shown to airline staff by the contractors.

I am addressing the suggestion that staff never ever help out other staff over pax.

Frankly, I don't need to have travelled on an ID ticket to validate what I have experienced.

 

[RAM]

I think if QF re-booked J passengers in substandard accomodation with an early check-out for a late night flight we'd more than likely have heard either here (or elsewhere in SM) about it by now.
I personally prefer a less confrontational style as you generally catch more flies with honey.

Well you did hear about it here a few months back.

Remember the cancelled Q B747 to Sydney. they kept putting the departure time back and in the end cancelled the flight that night and did not provide any hotel accomodation as they said it was too late.

Q's style all the way.

 

[BD1959]

That's called PR.

Red Roo is a purely corporate animal. Must be my day for appalling puns!

Notwithstanding RR's role is certainly PR-related, on their own admission, RR has been online way past any corporate animal's bedtime.

Regards,

BD

 

[medhead]

I definitely would have accepted the free sleep-over and J seats the next day....anything is better than cattle class for this distance...it is called "flexibility "
...a concept that some people have an issue with...unless it is a life and death issue, relax..smell the coffee and make the most of an extra days holiday....this could have been win, win.

You've never tried to get an appointment with a specialist?

 

[blaz]

You've never tried to get an appointment with a specialist?

I avoid them like the plague.....even if they arrived one day later they would probably still have to wait another 3 hours in reception, without missing their original appointment.....having said that...not a good idea to set up an appointment the day after you get back from overseas, for various reasons.(including missing your flight)

 

[medhead]

I avoid them like the plague.....even if they arrived one day later they would probably still have to wait another 3 hours in reception, without missing their original appointment.....having said that...not a good idea to set up an appointment the day after you get back from overseas, for various reasons.(including missing your flight)

Hahaha. The specialist I'm seeing this weekend is always keen to stress that I'll have to pay $190 if I miss the appointment. Slightly ironic that he has moved the appointment twice and moved the previous appointment about 4 times. Perhaps I should set a missed appointment fee

Agreed it was probably poor planning. Unfortunately, they had to play the cards that were dealt

 

[Caversham04]

Provided the booking was made on a
credit card, and irrespective of whether the merchant is FC or QF, the charge back route has several advantages.

Once the charge back is processed for services not supplied, you are no longer waiting for QF or some one to get back to you, or make an offer you are happy with. If you charge back the whole transaction, they will be chasing you for payment. They are indeed entitled to fair payment for what they delivered, but as you have the money back, you need to agree what is reasonable (i.e. the net payment), hence what the "compensation" is. If you don't agree, they have to chase you - and ultimately pursue you via the courts. As soon as you have processed the charge back, advise FC or QF (or both) as appropriate, and state you are willing to pay the fair value for what was provided, but that you must reach agreement as to what is fair. Make sure you keep copies of this communication. Should agreement not be reached, this could be important to the way an outcome is eventually resolved.

Should it come to that, they will have the burden of proving what is fair (and they know it). It will also not be their interpretation that prevails, but that of a court or tribunal - which they also know.

Given that all this will cost them in lawyers and processing, and they well know that they are liable for damages, they will be much more reasonable about what they will accept - once you have the money, rather than them.

Credit card charge back is simple and powerful in these circumstances, so take advantage of it. This is one of the reasons I always pay for the airfares via CC - even when incurring the fees. This protects against non- delivery for all reasons, including insolvency of the provider, which most Travel Insurance policies won't cover.

Good point - making it someone else's problem is rarely a bad idea in this situation as the CC company has got a lot more clout than you have!

In the (admittedly rare) event that I fly self-funded business class in future, I'll be making a dummy booking in economy immediately afterwards, and taking a screen-print of the cost to demonstrate the best available price for an economy ticket at the time of booking. If it ever gets to court in the scenario you describe, that then forms the basis for negotiation on the cost that I would pay for the economy-class service that was provided (minus compensation for inconvenience etc.). No way would I accept a refund based on the "cost of fully-flexible economy"

 

[Princess Fiona]

Well you did hear about it here a few months back.

Remember the cancelled Q B747 to Sydney. they kept putting the departure time back and in the end cancelled the flight that night and did not provide any hotel accomodation as they said it was too late.

Q's style all the way.

Completely different issue. That's an entire plane load of passengers. This is referring to accomodating premium passengers agreeing to be re-booked due to oversell.

And no that's not "Q's style" IMO.

 

[Mr_Orange]

In the (admittedly rare) event that I fly self-funded business class in future, I'll be making a dummy booking in economy immediately afterwards, and taking a screen-print of the cost to demonstrate the best available price for an economy ticket at the time of booking. If it ever gets to court in the scenario you describe, that then forms the basis for negotiation on the cost that I would pay for the economy-class service that was provided (minus compensation for inconvenience etc.). No way would I accept a refund based on the "cost of fully-flexible economy"

I have had similar thoughts and will be doing likewise. Not that I fly self-funded J that often!

 

[juddles]

....The specialist I'm seeing this weekend is always keen to stress that I'll have to pay $190 if I miss the appointment......

Given that you state the appointment is for a weekend, I will take a wild leap and suggest that the ¨specialist¨ is your clairvoyant. (No real medical specialist works weekends)

If you miss your appointment I would argue unfair play, as they can clearly foresee your inability to make said meeting.

 

[get me outta here]

This makes the Christmas QF Gift cards w' the big points bonus less valuable.

.... one of the reasons I always pay for the airfares via CC - even when incurring the fees. This protects against non- delivery for all reasons, including insolvency of the provider, which most Travel Insurance policies won't cover.

 

[JohnK]

RedRoos terrible response (even commenting on how wonderful the cabin staff are!) is a good indication of the attitude shown towards paying customers.

I think Redroo does a pretty good job considering the circumstances they are not the decision makers but rather the bearer of news.

 

[UP4014]

I tend to doubt that Red Roo is a single person but whether they are or not I think that for the purposes of this forum they are QANTAS not a natural person. That's how I view their presence. As long as people remain within the bounds of politeness I think said Roo is fair game (pardon the pun) for Qantas aimed criticism.

Agree, a forum like this can be a bit rough and tumble, don't come here if you can't take the bad along with the good.

If I just want to know how everything is rosy in the customer service department we can read it on the QF web site.

 

[equus]

This makes the Christmas QF Gift cards w' the big points bonus less valuable.

Perhaps that is why QF like the gift vouchers - encourages people to not book directly via CC, hence losing the charge back right (apart from the fact that QF get the cash flow early).

That said, I use the vouchers - but not for the points. The minimum value voucher lets me pay the rest of the fare directly without paying the CC fee, but still preserving the charge back rights (at least for all but the voucher value, and if we are talking about $50 in voucher that can't be charged back in the remote possibility I need to - which I never have - against a $30 CC fee saving) for the amount paid on the card.

 

[yohy?!]

Given that you state the appointment is for a weekend, I will take a wild leap and suggest that the ¨specialist¨ is your clairvoyant. (No real medical specialist works weekends)

If you miss your appointment I would argue unfair play, as they can clearly foresee your inability to make said meeting.

<scratch head>

 

[JohnK]

ok...agreed...although I'm not sure about timing a medical appointment so close to getting home from a flight such as this (long one)...things that can go wrong ,will go wrong.....I never assume that I will catch my flight...****e happens....but that's a lesson for another day..as for them being easy targets...this may be true...but it may not be..this is conjecture at this point.....hopefully they are happy with the compensation offered.

Not everyone can afford to come back 1 day early from 10-12 day trips just in case the airline sfuffs up. Every day that I am delayed would be unpaid leave for me.

Why am I the one to suffer if the airline decides to oversell?

And I have scheduled specialist appointments the day after I have returned from leave. No choice. If I miss that appointment then I could easily wait 4-6 weeks for another appointment.

 

[UP4014]

Must be my day for disagreeing ...

There are times in the past when RR has posted emoticons which clearly demonstrate a lack of empathy with the message they were relaying. If you wish policy to change, you do not expect RR to effect this but to pass on the message.

There is a clear distinction between Red Roo the person(s) and QF the entity; particularly with some of the Executive Decisions which are imposed on all of the Workforce and Customers.

The "criticism" should be directed at those making such decisions and not the messenger.

Regards,

BD

Yes Red Roo is a faceless entity known as QF. There is no personal touch.

Unless there is a name then an entity should leave out the emoticons and simply stick to the known facts and maybe correct erroneous ones posted.

I think it's good so many here have viewed and posted, a company like QF needs to be able witness a robust discussion over its service, it can only be good in the long run.

Matt
PS, trouble is a company sometimes use a good robust discussion as an excuse to vacate the area.