Downgraded from Business Class.

[BNEFlyer]

Hi again everyone

I have an update from EmilyP's parents... Flight Centre have submitted the refund calculation request to Qantas and they have been advised that it will be 2-3 weeks before they have any word from Qantas about a) if they will get a refund, and b) how much it will be if they are entitled to one. EmilyP's parents did ask QF directly if they could handle this and they said no, the request had to come from Flight Centre.

To inconvenience two passengers, let alone SG and J class pax and then make them do all the work to find out if they're entitled to any form of reasonable compensation and then also make them wait what will be up to 4 weeks for a result is completely unacceptable behaviour by Qantas IMO.

This information, combined with previous responses to this thread from RedRoo (who has been quite silent lately) just shows that with Qantas it's put up and shut up. What they say goes and if you want to question that, it'll be at your own peril.

 

[N860CR]

Qantas needs to at least explain the process for buying a $700 upgrade.

As for the staff defenders. I have personal experience of being told incorrect information that appeared to be designed to ensure seats remained available for staff. Technically, the seats would have been free for the staff members, but only because a paying passenger was told those seats were not available. It has happened once an it is an insult to intelligence to pretend little favours aren't done between staff. It would be unaustralian if they weren't done.

In this case, no. It's not possible to downgrade a paying passenger to allow industry discount into the cabin. The systems are well setup to prevent this. Especially considering we are talking about LAX where there is genuine hostility shown to airline staff by the contractors.

 

[TomVexille]

In this case, no. It's not possible to downgrade a paying passenger to allow industry discount into the cabin. The systems are well setup to prevent this. Especially considering we are talking about LAX where there is genuine hostility shown to airline staff by the contractors.

Agreed. I get the impression that not too many here have travelled on ID tickets.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Hi again everyone

I have an update from EmilyP's parents... Flight Centre have submitted the refund calculation request to Qantas and they have been advised that it will be 2-3 weeks before they have any word from Qantas about a) if they will get a refund, and b) how much it will be if they are entitled to one. EmilyP's parents did ask QF directly if they could handle this and they said no, the request had to come from Flight Centre.

To inconvenience two passengers, let alone SG and J class pax and then make them do all the work to find out if they're entitled to any form of reasonable compensation and then also make them wait what will be up to 4 weeks for a result is completely unacceptable behaviour by Qantas IMO.

This information, combined with previous responses to this thread from RedRoo (who has been quite silent lately) just shows that with Qantas it's put up and shut up. What they say goes and if you want to question that, it'll be at your own peril.

The refund process you describe, unfortunately, mirrors that in the link I provided in post #362 above. The passenger was referred back to travel agency, travel agency just had to go to QF anyway. Outcome was unsatisfactory, pax went to Airline Consumer Advocate, Advocate unable to get a satisfactory result and so recommended to go to Consumer Affairs.

 

[jsoprano]

Hi again everyone

I have an update from EmilyP's parents... Flight Centre have submitted the refund calculation request to Qantas and they have been advised that it will be 2-3 weeks before they have any word from Qantas about a) if they will get a refund, and b) how much it will be if they are entitled to one. EmilyP's parents did ask QF directly if they could handle this and they said no, the request had to come from Flight Centre.

To inconvenience two passengers, let alone SG and J class pax and then make them do all the work to find out if they're entitled to any form of reasonable compensation and then also make them wait what will be up to 4 weeks for a result is completely unacceptable behaviour by Qantas IMO.

This information, combined with previous responses to this thread from RedRoo (who has been quite silent lately) just shows that with Qantas it's put up and shut up. What they say goes and if you want to question that, it'll be at your own peril.

Thanks for the update BNEFlyer, I agree this behaviour is absolutely ridiculous.

OT: I had the opposite experience once from EK, after an 8hr delay on a AKL-MEL flight last year. Was going to complain to them the next day and see if I can get some compensation (i.e. points). When I opened my emails the next day, even before I was able to write to them, I already had an email in my inbox from a customer service manager at EK, apologising and explaining they will credit me and my partner 40,000 pts each (we were on an award ticket and paid 47,500 pts each for F seats IIRC). And both of us didn't even have any status with EK! We used the points to do the same trip again 2 months later.

QF: maybe take some notes here from your great partner!

 

[JohnK]

No where have I stated that I approved of the Qantas policy. It is however entirely in line with what other airlines do in these circumstances. My post was highlighting this fact by quoting from AA's refund policy.
There is no way that QF are going to change their policy to anything more generous than other comparable airlines.

So what we need is a campaign to stamp out overselling in the airline industry. Airlines shouldn't be making money from overselling. The practice of overselling is there so the airlines don't lose money for no shows but somewhere along the way they have managed to find a way to profit from the practice.

It's simply not good enough to treat people this way.

This isn't my issue but I feel the pain. This could happen to me as I don't fly business class that often and I have a few business class flights coming up. I am worried.

 

[N860CR]

I feel most sorry for the customers as I can picture the conversations with customer care and just how painful and frustrating they are. There would be no genuine remorse, simply an attitude of "how dare you question what we do. I'm doing you a favour by even speaking to you".

RedRoos terrible response (even commenting on how wonderful the cabin staff are!) is a good indication of the attitude shown towards paying customers.

 

[Baysider]

Hi again everyone

I have an update from EmilyP's parents... Flight Centre have submitted the refund calculation request to Qantas and they have been advised that it will be 2-3 weeks before they have any word from Qantas about a) if they will get a refund, and b) how much it will be if they are entitled to one. EmilyP's parents did ask QF directly if they could handle this and they said no, the request had to come from Flight Centre.

To inconvenience two passengers, let alone SG and J class pax and then make them do all the work to find out if they're entitled to any form of reasonable compensation and then also make them wait what will be up to 4 weeks for a result is completely unacceptable behaviour by Qantas IMO.

This information, combined with previous responses to this thread from RedRoo (who has been quite silent lately) just shows that with Qantas it's put up and shut up. What they say goes and if you want to question that, it'll be at your own peril.

Go with the chargeback. Let the cc provider do the run around. Make sure they stress that the only purchase they made was Business Class seats, they did not purchase Economy Class and never intended to, nor were they asked if they were prepared to change (and presumably signed nothing to accept such a change). Ensure there's no ambiguity, they purchased Business Class and did not receive the purchased service. What they did receive is immaterial to the actual transaction on the credit card.

 

[Pushka]

I can't imagine any industry other than airlines where overselling is acceptable. Well, actually there is. It's the cruise industry. The compensation payments made are quite amazing. And they ASK first, beforehand rather than waiting "at the dock".

Seems like the travel industry needs to start treating its customers - as customers. The tail has wagged the dog for too many years such that unfair terms and conditions are just accepted.

 

[OATEK]

Hi again everyone ....

This information, combined with previous responses to this thread from RedRoo (who has been quite silent lately) ...

RedRoo may have been quiet, but has been seen lurking on this thread quite often over the last couple of days. I am sure QF are very aware of everything being said.

 

[EmilyP]

How do you know that Qantas didn't ask? We have been told from third party exchanges with the crew onboard that other passengers were affected by the overbooking of this flight.

There is lots of speculation on here but very little is known about what Qantas did or didn't do at LAX other than the information provided by the daughter and friend of two of the affected passengers.

Just jumping online quickly here, but I think I have already advised that Qantas DID NOT ask.

And I don't believe I am speculating. My parents have told me first hand of their experience and I am relaying it as fact.

They are not liars, and either am I

 

[maninblack]

RedRoos terrible response (even commenting on how wonderful the cabin staff are!) is a good indication of the attitude shown towards paying customers.

QFF and QF customer care have generally had a 'go get stuffed' attitude for a long time. Why? I guess because they get to play god and it goes to their heads. QF crew and QF telephone sales are generally friendly, as they jolly well should be of course.

 

[mannej]

Just jumping online quickly here, but I think I have already advised that Qantas DID NOT ask.

And I don't believe I am speculating. My parents have told me first hand of their experience and I am relaying it as fact.

They are not liars, and either am I

I am going to stick up for PF here. In my experience, there are the two sides of the story, however the truth is somewhere in between the two sides.

In saying that, it doesn't necessarily make either side a liar.

 

[Baysider]

Just jumping online quickly here, but I think I have already advised that Qantas DID NOT ask.

And I don't believe I am speculating. My parents have told me first hand of their experience and I am relaying it as fact.

They are not liars, and either am I

Yes you have already advised us more than once. Some individuals are reading the thread selectively.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

RedRoo may have been quiet, but has been seen lurking on this thread quite often over the last couple of days. I am sure QF are very aware of everything being said.

I'm not entirely sure what the airline rep's brief is? They may have sole discretion to decide what they escalate. There have been a couple of things at a strategic level for other issues which have gone unanswered, which I am almost certain would have been actioned if they reached the right people.

Unless the refund calculation comes out to a fair and just level, I think a small claims action will probably be required here to get a fair outcome.

 

[Princess Fiona]

RedRoo may have been quiet, but has been seen lurking on this thread quite often over the last couple of days. I am sure QF are very aware of everything being said.

I agree. I also think that whilst the response provided so far has been unsatisfactory to the OP I don't think that Red Roo should take any blame for this.

As I said at the start if this is what QF offered my parents in the same circumstances I would have them avoid the stress and advise them to take it (assuming they had refused my advice to be re-booked the next day).

The issue of overbooking and compensation policies for downgrades is clearly in the airline's favour where the downgrade isn't covered by EU regulations. What Qantas are doing is what any other airline would be doing in the same circumstances. That doesn't make it right of course but it does make it incredibly difficult for the OP's parents to resolve this issue through legal challenges or charge-back IMHO.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Just jumping online quickly here, but I think I have already advised that Qantas DID NOT ask.

And I don't believe I am speculating. My parents have told me first hand of their experience and I am relaying it as fact.

They are not liars, and either am I

EmilyP my post wasn't referring to your parents at all. It was referring to the assumption by many that QF didn't ask for volunteers to be offloaded or downgraded.

Apologies for creating confusion as that's not my intention.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Yes you have already advised us more than once. Some individuals are reading the thread selectively.

Not sure who you are referring to there but if it's me then you are incorrect.

 

[Pushka]

Sorry Princess Fiona but while I understand your position and you do have empathy for the couple involved, I don't accept that you can be told at the gate that you either fly the next day or take your seat in Y and lump the $700 as settlement, on a flight that is scheduled to fly as planned and with no major unforeseen circumstance in sight. The only circumstance in sight is Qantas selling more seats than it had on the plane.

 

[amaroo]

EmilyP my post wasn't referring to your parents at all. It was referring to the assumption by many that QF didn't ask for volunteers to be offloaded or downgraded.

Apologies for creating confusion as that's not my intention.

If the parents were not asked to volunteer ... chances are no one else was either!

IMHO it all points to heavy handed bullying of two easy targets .... Pretty bloody pathetic!