Downgraded from Business Class.

[Austman]

Qantas Conditions of Carriage states their refund (and fare adjustment) policy. In 13.1 and 13.2

http://www.qantas.com.au/travel/airlines/conditions-carriage/global/en#jump13

It's not great for the passenger!

But I've had the same experience for decades and also on other airlines (SQ, CX, TG, SK come to mind). It might be unfair but it's not new and it's certainly not unique to QF.

 

[BNEFlyer]

Perhaps for clarification the OP or family can confirm the FF status. When I re-read it says Gold FF- was this definitely current & is it Qantas Gold?

Hi RB

Yes they have current QFF Gold.

BNEFlyer.

 

[MelUser]

It has just occurred to me - there is one other thing that QF does - I have a suspicion that it priorities ex USA purchased tickets. More competition, different market - it doesn't want to upset USA customers.

 

[maninblack]

It has just occurred to me - there is one other thing that QF does - I have a suspicion that it priorities ex USA purchased tickets. More competition, different market - it doesn't want to upset USA customers.

Agree. Which relates to my thought that they are also less likely to bump people with connections to other airlines or who have non QF issued tickets as they then have potential potential problems with other carriers to deal with.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

People currently may accept the downgrade thinking that their refund would be substantial ie the true difference between the J fare paid and the cheapest fare they could've bought at the time compared with what the actual amount is. If they knew how little they'd get they may well re-evaluate their plans and travel the next day in their original ticketed class.

It seems they had little choice - they needed to get back:

---

One thing the strikes me about this is the check-in. From what has been posted I would assume that no OLCI was attempted - this appears to have been the major reason for their targeting. (Only thing is, does this mean just about all business class travellers use OLCI or were connecting from points East? (For me often being in row 5 is problematic as it's a designated exit row.)

Going by the time of the original post & confirmed later in other posts, the flight the OP's parents travelled on was QF16 on Thu 16 Oct arriving Sat 18 Oct so it's not like they were cutting it fine for their medical appointment on Mon 20 Oct. They could have still travelled the next day and arrived back on Sun 19 Oct however I can fully appreciate they would just want to get home on the flight they'd booked and in their ticketed class of service - business class.

Despite being in an exit row eg row 5 on international flights if you OLCI in most cases (unless the website is having issues) you still appear as a passenger who has checked in even though staff still need to verify your eligibility for the exit row ie you won't appear on the list of passengers still to checkin.

I cannot understand why Qantas did not downgrade some points upgraders on this flight.

I would have thought a fare paying/revenue passenger trumps everybody.

Mind you can you imagine the banter on here if it had been one of us who was tapped on the shoulder on the aircraft and sent down the back. Perhaps too risky a scene to create.

Given how full all ex LAX flights were that week in all classes I doubt there would have been any points upgrades done the day prior. Who knows, there may have been a WP or WP1 who got one a few days out but even that seems unlikely. There may well have been pax booked in "U" class as a JASA or Classic award that booked 353 days in advance.

It may be be 'fairer and simpler' to downgrade one of these people as the difference is points for award travel is more clearly defined eg 96,000 points for J vs 48,000 for Y plus the meals, accommodation & the USD700.00 restitution for the inconvenience. Even still there would still be people travelling on J award tickets who wouldn't be happy with either option.

Something has just occurred to me. I think that QF 16 is the last of the LAX flights to leave in an evening.

If you are one ticket with a connecting AA flight and QF sees that the AA flight is running late they will sometimes automatically reaccomodate you on a later flight - eg on 16 and then book a connecting domestic flight to SYD/MEL or wherever you were going.

That was also suggested a while ago up thread but it's just one of the many theories floating out there.

 

[maninblack]

I doubt many people use online checkin when overseas. Whenever I do my sequence number is usually pretty low, even just 4 or 5 hours before the flight.

 

[Flying mermaid]

I doubt many people use online checkin when overseas. Whenever I do my sequence number is usually pretty low, even just 4 or 5 hours before the flight.

I never have! - however will in future.....

 

[wandering_fred]

The difficulty with online check-in (overseas) is printing the boarding pass. And when overseas I am much more likely to be "pushing" the baggage limits.

Happy wandering

Fred

EDIT: IF I'm overseas I likely will not be checking in the QF (and I save the BPs)

 

[straitman]

The difficulty with online check-in (overseas) is printing the boarding pass. And when overseas I am much more likely to be "pushing" the baggage limits.

Happy wandering

Fred

Still check in then get a boarding pass when you drop your bags.

 

[Rebekkap]

The difficulty with online check-in (overseas) is printing the boarding pass. And when overseas I am much more likely to be "pushing" the baggage limits.

Happy wandering

Fred

I always OLCI when overseas - I just don't print the boarding pass. The Qantas system has no idea if I've printed or not! I then just go to the counter and tell them I couldn't print the BP when I get to the airport - never had an issue

 

[Princess Fiona]

I always OLCI when overseas - I just don't print the boarding pass. The Qantas system has no idea if I've printed or not! I then just go to the counter and tell them I couldn't print the BP when I get to the airport - never had an issue

This is exactly the method I use.

 

[MelUser]

I;m usually checkin from NY or elsewhere in USA so well ahead of LAX checkin times anyway.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Qantas Conditions of Carriage states their refund (and fare adjustment) policy. In 13.1 and 13.2

Conditions of Carriage | Qantas

It's not great for the passenger!

But I've had the same experience for decades and also on other airlines (SQ, CX, TG, SK come to mind). It might be unfair but it's not new and it's certainly not unique to QF.

I don't know how binding those refund provisions would be. There doesn't seem to be a distinction between matters within and outside the airline's control, and some of the CoC are inconsistent with the Qantas Customer Charter (the latter which says there will be a full refund for the affected flight, compared to only a partial refund under the CoC).

Clause 4.7 (seating) also talks about downgrading, and says an appropriate refund of the fare difference will be paid:

If we need to ask you to downgrade for any reason, we will at your option:

• provide you with an appropriate refund of the difference in fares (or an appropriate credit of Qantas Points in the event that you are travelling on a Qantas Frequent Flyer Award),

So already three conflicting refund ideas being presented to passengers.

interestingly at the end of the CoC QF reproduces EU261 - but completely omits the downgrade policy! I wonder why?

 

[GalaxyNexus]

Business idea: check-in bot for J-seat protection. Will automatically check you in when it hits T-24 and get you single-digit sequence numbers, for the cost of 1$ per check-in.

 

[Archphoto]

I doubt many people use online checkin when overseas. Whenever I do my sequence number is usually pretty low, even just 4 or 5 hours before the flight.

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I've always checked-in online not matter where I am. My job means I *really* need to be where I have to be on a specific day, and jobs are crammed back-to-back-to-back. If I miss my flight, or it's delayed I need to know, so that I can inform my clients and make plans to fix the problem.

I make use of CX notiFLY and have been contacted by QF on a few occasions when we have been running late, to confirm we are on the way (traffic jams can be a big PITA!!!)

It's not so hard and gives me peace of mind that I get my preferred seat, and (hopefully) won't be bumped. I have been asked once when flying LHR-BKK on BA if I would like to forgo my seat and fly the following day.

Was offered a night at hotel and 350 quid to do so and if I hadn't needed to be in BKK, I would have happily taken them up on it. It would have been my first day off in 6 weeks, and flying out the next night would have given me a day to sleep a little later and enjoy drinking a cappuccino at a cafe, rather than on the run.

 

[Austman]

there will be a full refund for the affected flight

For me, that's always been an issue in these situations - that have affected me personally many times!

What does full refund mean, on partly used tickets? Or part refund on downgraded tickets?

If Qantas (and other airlines) could describe their calculation method so that even a passenger could work it out, at least approximately, at the time they had to make their decision - it would help - but don't hold your breath!

 

[JohnK]

I hardly ever use OLCi for international flights if I am overseas.

I think the time has come now to change that practice. At least I will know about late aircraft substitutions as well as potentially saving myself from downgrades and offloads.

 

[amaroo]

I've never used OLCI for Int flights - this thread has motivated me to start!

 

[RooFlyer]

I've never used OLCI for Int flights - this thread has motivated me to start!

Me too. (extra letters to meet minimum)

 

[Pushka]

It's easy to do on the phone. But not sure MrP would do it as he's usually on business trips when I'm not with him and it's an extra thing he really (anyone really) shouldn't have to do in order to receive the service that has been paid for.