Fair to be paying for an overweight passenger?

[Simo]

The whole thing just does my head in... I weigh 96kg and my daughter weighs about 22kg so if we travel together we could take app an extra 50kg of luggage. The aeroplane would probably run out of room so there precious freight and would actually start costing them more.

 

[harvyk]

Aaarrrrggghhh, not this again.... :evil:

The simple reason why you are charged to bring extra baggage on but I'm not charged to bring my "keg" on board is one of simple cost to the airline.

When I walk onto the airplane, I require the exact same infrastructure and support from the airline as the person whom is half my weight. It doesn't matter if I'm 70kg or 140kg, the cost to the airline in terms of personnel and equipment to get me onto and off the plane remains exactly the same.

When I hand over a normal amount of checked luggage (say 20kg) it requires a certain amount of infrastructure from the airline to get my bag on board, however if I was to hand over an oversize bag (say 40kg) it now means that the airline needs two people to move that bag safely, it may mean additional equipment is required to safely lift that bag into the cargo hold, and it increases the risk that their employees may suffer an injury in doing so.

Now there is 1 class of pax whom do incur an additional cost to the airline for getting on and off planes, that is the mobility impaired. Of course they are protected by anti-discrimination laws (and rightly so), so an airline will simply cover that cost.

In terms of fitting into the seat, if a pax can't fit into the seat, they are typically required to purchase an additional seat, or purchase more expensive J seats. The airline does not typically provide these things to larger sized pax for free.

Now before you say "but I bring on my own carry on", the reason there is a weight limit there (or at least should be) is that the overhead bins have a maximum weight which they can support.

 

[moa999]

Now before you say "but I bring on my own carry on", the reason there is a weight limit there (or at least should be) is that the overhead bins have a maximum weight which they can support.

Both weight for the bins, and for safety (something dropping out)

But also, both with carry-on and checked baggage weight is used as a proxy for volume or cubic space, which is often a greater constraint than MTOW.

Weight of pax is less relevant, as 20kg or 100kg, you take up the same space - one seat

 

[Chara David]

Re: Two reasons I can't take Virgin & Velocity seriously

Please stop trying to derail a logical point I have raised. Are tall people automatically given business class or exit rows? Nope, they have to pay. Why should overweight people be treated any differently?

I agree. that's a discrimination!

 

[JohnK]

Please stop trying to derail a logical point I have raised. Are tall people automatically given business class or exit rows? Nope, they have to pay. Why should overweight people be treated any differently?

Actually I don't quite understand your point.

If I fit into the seat I have pre-allocated then why should I have to pay extra? I don't ask nor expect any special treatment.

 

[mannej]

Actually I don't quite understand your point.

If I fit into the seat I have pre-allocated then why should I have to pay extra? I don't ask nor expect any special treatment.

It's a straw man argument. Someone asking for a free upgrade due to their height is not relevant to the OP's weight allowance suggestion.

 

[Denali]

This thread in 3 gifs.

First I was

Then I was

Now Im

 

[wandering_fred]

Obviously while I was away, there were a few topics I missed....

I really don't care how much the passenger next to me weighs. OTOH I do care if he/she can't fit into the space allocated to the seat.

In conjunction with the current thoughts on using "sizers" for carry on luggage, I would propose that a standard seat space be set up at all check in areas. A passenger (well to be consistent and not discriminate - say all) would be asked to sit there. If contact is made with the side walls of the sizer (or said person doesn't fit at all) then a second seat must be purchased (if not done in advance). That would also cover the discussion relating to the cost of "extra weight".

Just wandering

Fred

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Weighing passengers is on again with Finnair according to this report ... for the data only, of course!

 

[Quickstatus]

Would be interesting to see how much actual weight of all passengers + carry on compared with estimated.

What weight does an airline say QF use for passenger plus carry on?

 

[Quickstatus]

Would be interesting to see how much actual weight of all passengers + carry on compared with estimated.

What weight does an airline say QF use for passenger plus carry on?

 

[Deleted member 29185]

What weight does an airline say QF use for passenger plus carry on?

According to that report ...

the average European male's weight at 84.6kg, and average female passenger at 66.5kg. The average under-12 sits at 30.7kg.

 

[Quickstatus]

Do airlines separate their passenger counts according to gender?

the average per person weight of my family of 5 people over 18 = 76.6kg

We can do a little survey. AFFers, what’s the average weight in your family

 

[pauly7]

Obviously while I was away, there were a few topics I missed....

I really don't care how much the passenger next to me weighs. OTOH I do care if he/she can't fit into the space allocated to the seat.

In conjunction with the current thoughts on using "sizers" for carry on luggage, I would propose that a standard seat space be set up at all check in areas. A passenger (well to be consistent and not discriminate - say all) would be asked to sit there. If contact is made with the side walls of the sizer (or said person doesn't fit at all) then a second seat must be purchased (if not done in advance). That would also cover the discussion relating to the cost of "extra weight".

Just wandering

Fred

I think this is an interesting idea and can’t see why people would disagree - takes weight out of the equation so those overweight don’t feel put on the spot

 

[OzEire]

According to that report ...

My “under 12” is already 25kg of that 30.7kg and he is only 4 (ps. This is not including any carry-on which would easily be 7-10kg dom/int ).

Hopefully there is always a baby or two to balance out the average.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

It's really hard to pin down when you think about this. Western countries may be easier actually. In PNG though, coastal villagers tend to be lean and wiry but the highlanders tend to be shorter, but solid. I don't mean fat, I mean very solid. Centuries of evolution I guess in colder climates at higher altitudes. I'd also say there is no such thing as a fat kid in PNG (if there are, they're rare) however in the cities, there are certainly plenty of grossly overweight adults, which I'd assume is not genetic.

Apart from weighing every passenger for each flight, there will never be an accurate way of working with weight. From what I see of this study, it's simply attempting to ascertain if the "standard" weight assumptions are close to supportable for Finnair purposes.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Do airlines separate their passenger counts according to gender?

the average per person weight of my family of 5 people over 18 = 76.6kg

We can do a little survey. AFFers, what’s the average weight in your family

My family of 5 = 69.8kg rather than the 73.74kg suggested by those weights referenced above, so it works for my family.

Trouble is, I fly far more then the rest of my family and I'm 97kg ... so I blow the average when I'm travelling alone!

 

[Major]

It's really hard to pin down when you think about this. Western countries may be easier actually. In PNG though, coastal villagers tend to be lean and wiry but the highlanders tend to be shorter, but solid. I don't mean fat, I mean very solid. Centuries of evolution I guess in colder climates at higher altitudes. I'd also say there is no such thing as a fat kid in PNG (if there are, they're rare) however in the cities, there are certainly plenty of grossly overweight adults, which I'd assume is not genetic.

Apart from weighing every passenger for each flight, there will never be an accurate way of working with weight. From what I see of this study, it's simply attempting to ascertain if the "standard" weight assumptions are close to supportable for Finnair purposes.

If you weigh passengers at check in on International flights it will not be accurate. Pax simply load up with duty free grog and goods.

To be accurate passengers would need to be weighed at boarding, and that is not going to happen.

 

[JohnK]

We can do a little survey. AFFers, what’s the average weight in your family

My wife and daughter bring our family average down to below average.

 

[Lord_Lenny]

It's interesting that this is the first time I've read one of these articles where the airline in question is actually a mainline carrier flying airliners, and not a small charter operator or airline that flies smaller GA/Commuter aircraft.

As a data/ops guy I'd be quite interested to see Finnair's results, it would make sense to try and get a read on how much your internal 'average' kg/pax is out by