FAs permitting economy PAX to use PE after takeoff

[ReLoad]

Maybe some of the FA are finding it difficult to come to terms with the news that Virgin Australia is not the egalitarian critter that Virgin Blue was portrayed as.

I ate the Neil Perry Inspired slowly roasted egalitarian critter in the QF J lounge last night, it was a little chewy around the edges, but was nice enough.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

you are just explaining that they shouldn't devalue a product which is obviously of financial benefit to them as a business.

Not exactly.....the explanation was one members view of the product. There is another view.

Who says PE is a financial benefit to them? If so, why then are they discontinuing it? Personally, my view is that there are many a post on this forum where Velocity gold members are very happy with the consideration given them by the FAs by an "upgrade" (I'm not gold so I'm not one of them). Perhaps keeping gold/platinum FFers happy is a far greater "financial benefit" to DJ than the very few genuine paid for PE PAX.

Many gold members buy flexi fares, which for example, is only slightly more than 100 bucks less than PE once food is deducted on an OOL-SYD sector. Before the gold upgrade became common (a few months back), the PE seats sat largely unoccupied, so they fly with 12 seats (back then) vacant whilst holding them open for that occasional PE paid PAX. Why not offer both free and points upgrades to their valued gold (and soon to be platinum) clients, keeping them happy (and more importantly....LOYAL), rather than keeping 12 seats (or now 8) vacant for those one of two PAX who have paid $100 or so more (perhaps meaning the extra earn for DJ may be between $0 and $200)? That to me makes far more sense.

 

[notzac]

I don't think anyone is calling in to question bona fide upgrades where the boarding card indicates a premium seating allocation, but I'd be more than a little miffed as a paying whY+ pax (admittedly more not than often, but I've paid up a couple times) to have some bozo from the back of the bus re-seat themselves up the front .. or perhaps worse, have a FA allow it for no given reason.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I don't think anyone is calling in to question bona fide upgrades where the boarding card indicates a premium seating allocation, but I'd be more than a little miffed as a paying whY+ pax (admittedly more not than often, but I've paid up a couple times) to have some bozo from the back of the bus re-seat themselves up the front .. or perhaps worse, have a FA allow it for no given reason.

Agree totally. No one should be permitted to re-seat themselves.

I think you'll find there is a call in some of these posts previous, to allow only paid PE PAX to occupy PE seats. ie, no gold upgrades.

 

[Noob]

I didn't word that very well did I?
I meant a product that could be of financial benefit to them. And I agree with your post.

This will all be largely changed in a bit over 6 months when almost the entire 737-800 fleet has been reconfigured with the new interiors.
I assume business class will be exclusive to business class passengers, and the new row three will be where Golds will be upgraded.

As from the seat plan seen in the TT alliance document, this looks like it may be the case:

 

[Justchecking]

Agree totally. No one should be permitted to re-seat themselves.I think you'll find there is a call in some of these posts previous, to allow only paid PE PAX to occupy PE seats. ie, no gold upgrades.

Actually I have no objection to points and loyalty upgrades, I file those under the category of paid PE, since you have paid for it with your copious amounts of spending with the airline. My point about it being used as garden variety Y seats is that it creates the expectation that those seats are just like the rest of the aircraft and hence why anyone thinks they can simply reseat themselves there. How often do Y pax on a QF aircraft take their baby into the J cabin and treat it as a creche? Hardly ever....why? Because people know that it's not a free for all. You simply can't be seated in J on QF unless you are holding a valid J ticket (through cash or loyalty).

 

[oz_mark]

How often do Y pax on a QF aircraft take their baby into the J cabin and treat it as a creche? Hardly ever....why? Because people know that it's not a free for all. You simply can't be seated in J on QF unless you are holding a valid J ticket (through cash or loyalty).

Actually, it is because QF actively stop people doing it. If it wasn't policed, it would become a free for all.

 

[serfty]

...

I think you'll find there is a call in some of these posts previous, to allow only paid PE PAX to occupy PE seats. ie, no gold upgrades.

Going by firefox's post(s), it appears that is the case.

IMHO, that's a good thing ("Paid" being either points or $$).

 

[Justchecking]

Actually, it is because QF actively stop people doing it. If it wasn't policed, it would become a free for all.

Also agreed. I believe DJ does also need to be more vigilant in this area too.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

I assume business class will be exclusive to business class passengers, and the new row three will be where Golds will be upgraded.

And if you are correct, it makes this whole discussion pointless. DJ will know they have to prevent the seat migration during flight to keep the much prized business clients in their overpriced J seat happy, and gold/plats will know they can score a comfy J seat with a points upgrade (if they have the points ). Win/win. Everyone happy.

But.....is this actually going to be the case?????

 

[firefox]

I also like the optin like airnz where u get 2 free upgrades a year for gold elites. And paid etc.Either loyalty points or paid, just not a free for all would be good as it protects the product.As for the toilet q, I can't tell u how many times people have stepped on my shoe whilst waiting for the toilet when I am sitting in 1a or 1c... The rope or similar I think would be perfect.But without the cabin crew actually enforcing this the product won't move forward.

 

[Justchecking]

Well if the experience this morning of Y pax being actively encouraged to sit in business is anything to go by, DJ have some training to do. Frankly that sounded appalling. I know J isn't being sold yet but would anyone witnessing that actually purchase J in the future?

 

[Justinf]

I am flying PE MEL-PER and back this weekend and if anyone from Y decides to keep me company without being asked will be told to go back to where they came from. No need to get FAs involved.

 

[DJ 1D]

I haven't noticed it as much lately, though clearly it's still happening. Used to happen heaps. Unfortunately I think that some passengers will always be rude and feel entitled.

That being said, PE is still hit or miss. It always depends on the flight crew, with the tone usually set by the CS. Last night had a decent flight but the CS really didn't care at all about the PE passengers (of which I was one). Last week had a great flight with a very polite and almost doting CS who made me feel it was money well spent.

One of these days VA will put in place some uniform training across the boards to get the standards where they want them. Until then it's just the luck of the draw sadly.

 

[jaspon]

Ha ha brad on flight dj957 just broke the new rule on a plane. Wow the new policy of FA protecting PE just gone thrown out the door. JB and VA there's your problem.

At this stage, cabin crew have NOT been issued with any directive or been advised of any changes to the policy of seat upgrade inflight.

As has been the case for a while now, they can move status pax into rows 1 or 2, IF THERE ARE NO PAYING PE GUESTS IN THOSE ROWS

This is done on a flight by flight basis as a courtesy and is not a hard and fast rule, and is done to provide high status pax some inflight recognition plus somewhere a bit more comfortable etc

At the moment the cabin crew do not have many tools available to them recognise status pax inflight sand this is one way of showing it.

Currently, over the next 3 months, all cabin crew are undergoing the 2nd stage of training in regards to new onboard product and service

 

[Jurahn]

Am following this thread with interest as we will be flying PE towards the end of the year (as paying PE pax) so will be interested to see how DJ crew handle any "seat jumpers" by then!

 

[concorde71]

At this stage, cabin crew have NOT been issued with any directive or been advised of any changes to the policy of seat upgrade inflight.

As has been the case for a while now, they can move status pax into rows 1 or 2, IF THERE ARE NO PAYING PE GUESTS IN THOSE ROWS

This is done on a flight by flight basis as a courtesy and is not a hard and fast rule, and is done to provide high status pax some inflight recognition plus somewhere a bit more comfortable etc

At the moment the cabin crew do not have many tools available to them recognise status pax inflight sand this is one way of showing it.

Currently, over the next 3 months, all cabin crew are undergoing the 2nd stage of training in regards to new onboard product and service

We do appreciate the upgrades if we get them, thats nice, however, the big Beef is with the inconsitancies in the whole system. We have been getting this new system new airline cough for so long its actually an old and tired excuse.
Please dont get me wrong, I can see the direction Virgin is trying to head, and its a positive, but there seems to be a massive headwind slowing them. I feel that there appears to be some leadership, and discipline issues that need to be addressed if Virgin wish to be truly competitive in a business airline environment... I mean seriously, If Im on a flight and have paid top $$$$ for an already mediocre PE seat, with the sole reason for the expense being that I can get a final bit of work done in a quiet environment (ie: Productive use of my time, that I have chosen to pay extra for). Then little miss and junior ........ come down, jump all over the place squeel and make it impossible to do anything, Im going to be a bit ...... ... [annoyed], and probably unwilling to fork out more $$$$ next time to achieve nothing. Now I dont fly PE that often, as a business owner, I am effectively paying my own way, but there are times, when I need that time to be productive and be able to complete some tasks, hence, I am happy to pay the extra, so I have the right environment so I can at least be spend the time constructively, be that finishing a report, or in fact reading one. But this current situation really hits a nerve, and once they bring in true J class across the fleet, with relevent fare increases, they will really need to get their .... [stuff] together, or Qantas will gain (Retain) the strong business edge they have, and TBH, anyone that has tried Virgin and been shafted will NEVER go back again.
Again, I like Virgin, and would love to see them get their act together, but it really is all very ordinary at this stage, when they cant even get some of their cabin crew to tow the line.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

... I do get mildly annoyed by over the top generalisations. To some members of this forum, Y stands for bogan and that's the end of their somewhat taited way of thinking. Truth be known, many who carry on like God, most likely sit right beside me in Y. I personally see Y as a well priced product that serves the vast MAJORITY of flyers. I don't discriminate or generalise against those who choose more expensive seats and I can't see the neccessity for them to carry on like a two bob watch when they fail to get what they think their status symbol should deliver. Well PE is nothing more than Y+ and on domestic sectors really means very little. I've stated previously I've tried the Y+ product and I don't see the value in it. Some do however and that's fine by me as well, but please don't carry on like you're infinitely more special............

 

[concorde71]

As I have stated elsewhere, I also only choose Y+ / J if I HAVE TO, most of the time, Im in the back as well, However, if I need the quiet or the tranquility of a smaller cabin, and PAY GOOD MONEY for that and it is destroyed, I am annoyed, I had my post, and plenty agreed with it, and a problem has been discovered, and VA are now very much aware of it, and reacting to it.. Do I get thanks for having the balls for bringing it up, and speaking my mind, nah, I get someone preaching to me about moral high ground and language. I wont comment in this thread again, and I will now curb my colourful language, and just lurk in the background, and not contribute anything further. Thats a public school educashun for youse!!!

 

[N860CR]

I didn't see anything wrong with the comments and actually appreciated the colourful approach! I think it did more just to show your frustration with the situation than any sort of attack against certain elements of the community.

I've done a few PE flights of late and on all but one I was the only "J" pax and nobody tried to upgrade themselves. I've found the crews to be great too (the two best flights were PQQ-SYD and SYD-PQQ so def SYD based CC). One one flight the entire plane was packed and the only thing that annoyed me was of the two PE pax (myself and an older guy), we were oddly split with him in row 1 (right side) and me in row 2 (left side). As a result of which, the two pax seated next to us were "upgraded" to actual PE while the pax in row 1 (left side) and row 2 (right side) were given the normal "saver" fare treatment. Didn't have any negative effect on me, just seemed a bit odd. The crew were fine on this flight too, just busy so less attentive (it was a TSV-BNE).

I've been travelling only on flexi-fares of late and alway book the PE upgrade as I see it as excellent value (even though I already have lounge access & I have no use for checked luggage). I don't think I'd book a $400 PE fare over a $200 flexi-fare though.