General Coronavirus chit chat thread - non-travel specific

[tgh]

You did read the warnings about doses though I hope!

Indeed.. thanks for caring…..the side effects and the toxicity are well described in most of the literature.
The bark is a challenge because it's a natural product and the quantity of active ingredient is moot.
As Sean Connery once said.. you gotta die of sumthin'

 

[Cruiser Elite]

I personally listened to entire Press Conference from Premier Daniel Andrews on Tuesday morning - apart from apparently not listening properly (gotta love unsolicited advice from total strangers) IMHO his message was clear and instructive - there will be a 3rd stage of restrictions - not necessarily Victoria on it’s own but hopefully Aust wide - I don’t think one needs to be a rocket scientist to follow the logic here.

 

[Pushka]

You did read the warnings about doses though I hope!

Indeed.. thanks for caring…..the side effects and the toxicity are well described in most of the literature.
The bark is a challenge because it's a natural product and the quantity of active ingredient is moot.
As Sean Connery once said.. you gotta die of sumthin'

Just take it very sloooow if that's what you are thinking. I did buy Bickfords Tonic water - the only brand left the other day - because it specifically states it has traditional chinchona extract. ! That bitterness of the tonic must be the active ingredient but concentrated in hydroxychloroquine which is incredibly bitter.

 

[Flying mermaid]

The difference in death rates is staggering. I'm thinking the US is artificially high because they just don't test properly.

I think testing is poor, but you need to look at deaths per million. USA is still quite low while Italy and Spain are high. USA is 3 per million vs Italy 124. Deaths seem to take awhile so USA could grow.

 

[Max Samuels]

I don’t know about being the only one, but I’m over people who just keep blaming politicians.

By all means, run next time and show us how it should be done, while being publicly excoriated each and every day and blamed for everything that goes wrong.

Will you be my running mate?

Hindsight is always 20/20, of course, but when I look back at the amount of public service announcements, discussion, debate about things like gay marriage, transexual bathroom rights, what-to-do-in-case-a-co-worker-looks-at-you-inappropriately... when I look at the billions of dollars wasted on that rubbish, yet when the thing that is actually destroying all of our lives as I type this - the thing that every scientist on the earth knew was gonna happen eventually - that we had absolute zero preparedness. And I finds that completely unacceptable. And yes, it is the politicians in charge who could have done something about that. Had a little foresight for just some basic info taught in schools... about what might happen in the event of a pandemic.

So yes - it is their fault we are so unprepared. Fair statement?

 

[drron]

It all depends on what you measure.
In cases per 100000 population Italy is still a long way in front of the USA.
Death rates are reported differently around the world so unlikely to be a good measure.
Asymptomatic infections-well there are several studies now suggesting the false positive rates are quite high.

So just pick the statistic that re affirms what you believe.

As for me I am getting heartily sick of our media's over coverage of this virus and journalists and personalities being trotted out as experts.
I am also tired of people complaining about the confused messaging.If you really believe this is the most serious thing to have ever happened why aren't you part of the drive to give a consistent message.

 

[tgh]

I did buy Bickfords Tonic water

You already have a "base load" with the Plaquenil.. why more ?

 

[CaptJCool]

Correct, see post #478

I looked up the ATO Website provided above and

lodgments. The ATO will deliver the payment as a credit to your business upon lodgment of your activity statements.

Where this places the business in a refund position, the ATO WILL deliver the refund within 14 days.

 

[Pushka]

I did buy Bickfords Tonic water
You already have a "base load" with the Plaquenil.. why more ?

My hubby doesn't though! I usually drink wine.

 

[Max Samuels]

So I have a question.... and of course it is just conjecture (as is 100% of everything else written on this subject).... if we get to the end of this, and we say capped corona deaths at 10k in Australia.... but have an economy in ruin, millions without a job, and 1000s dead of suicide (apparently that does happen during economic depression), are we calling that a win? What is the appropriate ratio of lives-saved-by-corona-measures:lives-lost-because-of-those measures.

Interested to see where people think the appropriate balance is

 

[CaptJCool]

This post is about data points...

While the absolute numbers perhaps keep growing, because you switch to an ever higher baseline, you start to see the curve push flat.... i think this best highlights it....

 

[Pushka]

So I have a question.... and of course it is just conjecture (as is 100% of everything else written on this subject).... if we get to the end of this, and we say capped corona deaths at 10k in Australia.... but have an economy in ruin, millions without a job, and 1000s dead of suicide (apparently that does happen during economic depression), are we calling that a win? What is the appropriate ratio of lives-saved-by-corona-measures:lives-lost-because-of-those measures.

Interested to see where people think the appropriate balance is

There will be no winners just survivors. I don't have an answer.

 

[amaroo]

I looked up the ATO Website provided above and

lodgments. The ATO will deliver the payment as a credit to your business upon lodgment of your activity statements.

Where this places the business in a refund position, the ATO WILL deliver the refund within 14 days.

Good stuff. I Haven't bothered looking at that as our obligations exceed the the top $ benefit provided for all our entities.

 

[Pushka]

Bloody tourists

No Cookies | The Advertiser

No Cookies

www.adelaidenow.com.au

Americans from the Barossa Valley
“The action of the individuals was irresponsible. However, given they are no longer in the country, no further action will be taken.”

Sources say that after some of the tourists in the party fell ill and had COVID-19 tests, the couple left despite having not received their results. They were not under guard and are said to have travelled interstate before boarding a flight to their undisclosed home base.

 

[drron]

Deaths in economic crises are probably over dramatised.In the USA during the Depression suicide rates went up 10% initially then drifted back to baseline.
By contrast deaths from Cirrhosis of the Liver gradually increased being 30% above baseline after 6 years.
Total death rates though declined slightly.Basically because most of us would be a bit healthier if we ate less.

 

[CaptJCool]

Deaths in economic crises are probably over dramatised.In the USA during the Depression suicide rates went up 10% initially then drifted back to baseline.
By contrast deaths from Cirrhosis of the Liver gradually increased being 30% above baseline after 6 years.
Total death rates though declined slightly.Basically because most of us would be a bit healthier if we ate less.

Phew, for a moment I thought the punchline was gonna be beer & wine, not the waistline .....

 

[drron]

The beer and wine is related to the cirrhosis though so don't breathe easier.

 

[drron]

Also interesting from twitter-how Australia coped with the flu in 1919.
.

 

[ja1]

So I have a question.... and of course it is just conjecture (as is 100% of everything else written on this subject).... if we get to the end of this, and we say capped corona deaths at 10k in Australia.... but have an economy in ruin, millions without a job, and 1000s dead of suicide (apparently that does happen during economic depression), are we calling that a win? What is the appropriate ratio of lives-saved-by-corona-measures:lives-lost-because-of-those measures.

Interested to see where people think the appropriate balance is

It's not quite the right question as that seems to suggest there are other scenarios you can compare against. And there aren't really. This isn't 9/11 or localized in some way or any other partial scenario - it's a global pandemic.

Lets rephrase it another way:

When we get to some point that we call 'the end point' - which might be defined as when a vaccine is available and being deployed and by the time we got to that point we had 10k deaths in Australia.

Then yes, that's absolutely the best possible outcome (I can't call it a win) given the modelling is currently suggesting 15k possible deaths just in NSW if this wasn't being managed (which it is so far, but we'll only really know in about 2-4 weeks).

If the economy is in ruins then we'll have to rebuild it. If you have the people still there and haven't caused other problems in the mean time (other health issues, civil war etc) then you can rebuild economies.

It's a mistake to think we couldn't rebuild it or that we wouldn't rebuild it. It's also a mistake to think that people do things just for themselves or their own generation. It's entirely possible a generation might have to sacrifice things for some period of time as part of rebuilding. And they would.

 

[ja1]

Had a little foresight for just some basic info taught in schools... about what might happen in the event of a pandemic.

So yes - it is their fault we are so unprepared. Fair statement?

Not really no because you are using hindsight. There are warnings about meteors or comets that could hit the planet and wipe out life and politicians don't do a lot about those either. And I can guarantee we'll complain about that when it comes up as well.

It should be less about going after them for the events of the past - which we all end up sharing the blame because we put that politician in power in the first place and more about measuring them on what they did during and post crisis.

It is incredibly easy to blame every single Australian's PM going back to 1919 to say that you knew about the Spanish flu and yet you did nothing to prepare for it in the future (as measured by what happened in 6 weeks in 2020 so far). It's not particularly constructive is it.. as it says that for a hundred years the Australian population didn't care enough about this issue to elect leadership to deal with it.

It's what the current leadership does right now and what the opposition says and does right now that we should be looking at in terms of thinking about fault.

To reiterate, it is entirely OUR fault as citizens that we are so un-prepared. We do not care enough or are active enough in the political process that it is reasonable to blame people we elect at a broad level statement like yours.