General Discussion/Q&A on Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Flashback]

But that then goes back to the fractured nature of the Federation and how really Australia has no national philosophy. I never realised how much the States can run their own state!

When I was trying to explain how Australia 'works' to someone here, they simply said 'Oh, like the USA?'.

 

[Flashback]

Latest stats in the UK, as you can see the deaths are fairly low and static now.

 

[p--and--t]

Latest stats in the UK, as you can see the deaths are fairly low and static now.
View attachment 227211

Given the wildly different way deaths are counted in various jurisdictions, its hard to compare apples with apples.

I've seen reports stating (not sure of accuracy) at least at one stage that the UK only counted those who died from the disease in hospital. i.e. what if you died at home, in nursing home etc, and what if you were infected but died of a heart attack and the death certificate says heart failure.

In Victoria, not 100% sure about other states, it has been reported anyone who dies anywhere in the state where covid (before or after death) was detected regardless of cause of death is counted as a covid death.

 

[Pushka]

Given the wildly different way deaths are counted in various jurisdictions, its hard to compare apples with apples.

I've seen reports stating (not sure of accuracy) at least at one stage that the UK only counted those who died from the disease in hospital. i.e. what if you died at home, in nursing home etc, and what if you were infected but died of a heart attack and the death certificate says heart failure.

In Victoria, not 100% sure about other states, it has been reported anyone who dies anywhere in the state where covid (before or after death) was detected regardless of cause of death is counted as a covid death.

Agree. It was discussed in another Covid thread that if you had tested positive for Covid but died from something else, even completely unrelated, the death was treated as a Covid death in Australia. For some reason we feel the need to make it look worse than it needs to be in Australia.

 

[HappyFlyerFamily]

Agree. It was discussed in another Covid thread that if you had tested positive for Covid but died from something else, even completely unrelated, the death was treated as a Covid death in Australia. For some reason we feel the need to make ot look worse than it needs to be in Australia.

I just read that the coroner is reviewing the death of a person in their 20s. The person had Covid, but may have died of a drug overdose. Not sure which State/Territory, just assumed Vic.

Edit found the reference - today’s News.com.au Covid blog, about 2 hours ago..

Youngest virus victim may have died of other causes

A man in his 20s, thought to be the youngest Australian to die of COVID-19, was suspected by senior health officials to have died of another cause, possibly a drug overdose.
The Age reports that Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews was not aware of the possible involvement of drugs or another cause of death before he gave he announced the man's passing.
But, people familiar with the case told the publication that officials in the Health Department had discussed the circumstances of the man's death indicating an overdose.
The man was infected with COVID-19 when he died, but in recent days the State Coroner has requested a coronial investigation into the man's cause of death.

 

[Pushka]

I just read that the coroner is reviewing the death of a person in their 20s. The person had Covid, but may have died of a drug overdose. Not sure which State/Territory, just assumed Vic.

I just saw that and posted this on the Australian thread. Victoria.
Youngest virus victim may have died of other causes

Natalie Brown
A man in his 20s, thought to be the youngest Australian to die of COVID-19, was suspected by senior health officials to have died of another cause, possibly a drug overdose.
The Age reports that Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews was not aware of the possible involvement of drugs or another cause of death before he gave he announced the man's passing.
But, people familiar with the case told the publication that officials in the Health Department had discussed the circumstances of the man's death indicating an overdose.
The man was infected with COVID-19 when he died, but in recent days the State Coroner has requested a coronial investigation into the man's cause of death.

 

[Flashback]

Given the wildly different way deaths are counted in various jurisdictions, its hard to compare apples with apples.

I've seen reports stating (not sure of accuracy) at least at one stage that the UK only counted those who died from the disease in hospital. i.e. what if you died at home, in nursing home etc, and what if you were infected but died of a heart attack and the death certificate says heart failure.

In Victoria, not 100% sure about other states, it has been reported anyone who dies anywhere in the state where covid (before or after death) was detected regardless of cause of death is counted as a covid death.

As with most countries that did similar before they got into a roll, UK sorted that out very early on. Initially it was a problem where each country interpreted their data and displayed differently but I think that is largely gone now and saved for some countries who we will all choose not to name... They know who they are

 

[Lynda2475]

From today's SMH.com.au (So you think you can talk COVID? An A-Z glossary for understanding the pandemic) a glossary of all the terms (serious and not) you need to know to talk Cornona virus:

Aerosols: COVID-19 spreads when people are close together, like the flu, mostly via water droplets – tiny balls of mucus, salt and virus that can shoot out for at least a metre from the nose and mouth when a patient coughs or sneezes. Sometimes, they contaminate surfaces although they’re too heavy to survive long in the air. But the virus can also aerosolise in finer particles released just by breathing, talking or – in the case of at least one unfortunate choir – singing. As with cigarette smoke, the virus will break apart in the air outdoors but, as with smoke, it can also build up in enclosed areas without ventilation. How much you would need to inhale to get sick is still a live question (see viral load, below). But the WHO and other health authorities now agree aerosols play a bigger role in transmission than first thought.

Antibodies: Successfully fighting off a virus generally leaves our body armed with proteins called antibodies ready for a potential round two. This tends to give us at least a period of immunity, if not always a lifelong shield – common coronaviruses (see below) that cause colds, for example, go away for about a year before we become susceptible again. While immunity to COVID-19 itself is so far looking short-lived,scientists say that doesn’t torpedo hopes for a vaccine (see below). Read more about COVID immunity, including the strange case of a man reinfected by a different strain of the virus, here.

Asymptomatic: Someone infected with COVID-19 who displays no outward symptoms as opposed to a presymptomatic patient who is yet to develop symptoms. People are thought to “shed” more virus when they have symptoms but those without still contribute significantly to the spread of COVID-19, making the virus especially difficult to contain.

Bonk ban: Intimacy has suddenly become excruciatingly relevant to authorities as they grapple with a virus that spreads through close contact. During Australia’s first shutdown in March, Victorians were first advised not to visit their romantic partner if they didn’t live together – a decree that was quickly dubbed a bonk ban online and then swiftly reversed by Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton (see CHOttie, below).

Bubble buddy: To combat the loneliness epidemic under lockdowns in countries such as Australia and New Zealand, those living alone can nominate one person to visit.

CHOttie: An affectionate term for Victoria’s Chief Health Officer, Brett Sutton. The CHO has extensive experience in disease control and has earned praise for his handling of the pandemic, but his near-daily media briefings have also attracted a somewhat amorous fan base, sometimes called "Suttonettes", and even inspired a line of handmade merchandise.

Close contact: When someone shares an enclosed space with an infected person for a significant period (about two hours, according to authorities) or comes close enough to fall in range of their bodily fluids such as droplets (considered at least 15 minutes of face-to-face conversation). All such “close contacts” of a case must also self-isolate away from others for 14 days.

CMO: The Chief Medical Officer (or Chief Health Officer) of a state, territory or country presides over a panel of other medical experts to give formal advice to governments. Under emergency laws rolled out in each Australian jurisdiction, the CMO has the power to make enforceable public health directions such as bans on public gatherings or stay-at-home orders. Australia's acting CMO is epidemiologist (see below) Paul Kelly.

Community transmission: Authorities are always nervous when the virus is spreading locally (as opposed to being imported from overseas travellers arriving already infected). But community transmission refers to the “mystery cases” in an area where health officials can’t find a clear source. This suggests a virus is spreading unchecked. Victoria’s second wave of COVID-19 has become much bigger than its first, for example, as the virus took hold locally and community transmission climbed.

Comorbidity: When a patient suffers from one or more illnesses on top of a primary condition. COVID-19 patients with heart disease, for example, are at greater risk from the infection as it puts pressure on their heart.

Contact tracing: For every case of COVID-19, “disease detectives” are retracing the infected person's steps to track down and isolate close contacts. The first deadly coronavirus to emerge in the modern era, SARS, was stamped out through aggressive case detection and isolation in just nine months but it was also less infectious than COVID, spreading to less than 30 countries. Contact tracing helped stop outbreaks spawned all over Australia by the release of infected passengers from the Ruby Princess cruise ship in NSW, for example, but teams can be overwhelmed quickly once a virus begins spreading fast locally, as has been seen overseas in the US, Europe and, to some extent, Melbourne.

Coronavirus: Coronaviruses are a family of viruses causing respiratory illness mostly found in animals (so named for their crown shape, not the beer). Only six have previously been found in humans – four mild strains that cause the common cold and two dangerous ones known as SARS and MERS, which have jumped into humans more recently. This new kind of “rona”, known officially as SARS-CoV-2 (or SARS 2 among scientists), brings that tally to seven, after it jumped across to humans from an animal in Wuhan, China in late 2019 (see zoonotic, below). The illness it causes is called COVID-19 – less deadly but much more contagious than SARS or MERS.

Coronarecession: The economic slump caused by the pandemic.

Coronaspeck: All that weight you’ve gained during lockdown? The Germans have a word for it. It comes from the word “kummerspeck”, which translates to “grief bacon” and refers to the excess fat one piles on due to overeating, in times of sorrow. Sometimes also called The COVID 19 (kilos).

Coronials: If there's a baby boom from all our time spent at home during the pandemic, there's already a popular name for the new cohort. (And the teenagers they'll become? Quaranteens.)

Covidiot: When a person behaves in a way that contravenes the current health and safety guidelines, such as refusing to wash their hands, wear a mask or maintain social distancing, they now have their very own insult, a combination of COVID-19 and “idiot”.

Covid toes: A strange symptom of COVID-19 in which a small number of patients report red, swollen toes, almost like chilblains, possibly caused by blood vessel damage and small blood clots from the infection.

Cytokine storm: Faced with a new pathogen, the body’s immune system will sometimes overreact. As proteins known as cytokines call in more and more immune cells to attack the virus, the lungs can become collateral damage, filling with fluid and cellular debris.Read more about what COVID does to the body here.

Decanting: More often done to wine, decanting is used by health officials to describe moving aged care residents who test positive for COVID-19 into hospital. In NSW in particular, an initial reluctance by providers and authorities to hospitalise residents helped fuel deadly outbreaks in homes.

Deep cleaning: There’s clean and there’s COVID clean. As well as scrubbing down workplaces and public spaces more often, the new coronavirus rules mean the scenes of outbreaks need to be properly decontaminated. A “deep clean” can involve fogging, steaming or a two-step wipe down with detergent and disinfectant. Read more here.

Doomscrolling: The inability to tear your eyes away from your phone or your computer, as you scroll through the latest social media and news posts to catch up on COVID news.

Donning and doffing: The surprisingly complex art of putting on and removing PPE safely, including disposing of used, contaminated items.

Elbow bumping: Instead of shaking our germy, plague-carrying hands, experts suggest we “bump elbows” or tap feet to greet people. Some people are just opting for a solemn nod, other for a manic wave.

Elimination: Bringing in the toughest social distancing measures early and keeping them in force until there are zero new infections caught locally. This “go hard, go early” approach worked during SARS and has mostly kept China free of local spread of COVID-19 since its unprecedented lockdowns in early 2020. NZ also eliminated local transmission for more than 100 days before the virus slipped back through in August. Eliminating COVID on the home front means internal economies can reopen faster and for longer, proponents say, avoiding the stop-start yo-yoing of a less strict but likely longer suppression strategy (below). But, as NZ learnt, it doesn't mean the virus is gone for good. Australia has eliminated measles right now but, because it still pops up so often overseas, it is not yet near eradication (global extinction). A disease as contagious as COVID-19 is unlikely to disappear, even with a vaccine. Former NZ prime minister Helen Clark, who now heads an international inquiry into COVID-19, notes the strategy really means "zero tolerance … not zero virus". But critics say the costs of elimination are too high when success is so difficult to maintain and could lead to a false sense of security. The Victorian government's case number targets to ease restrictions are strict but it says they are still in the suppression playbook, not elimination. Read more about elimination here.

Epidemiology: The study of diseases, their trends and how to control them.

Essential worker: Businesses and employees in industries deemed necessary to keep society functioning under shutdown or lockdown, such as healthcare and emergency workers or supermarket staff.

Flattening the curve: Slowing the rate of new cases with interventions to stop the healthcare system being overwhelmed all at once. On a graph, an outbreak looks like a curve (or a cresting wave). Case numbers climb to a peak as the virus spreads before falling away when rules kick in or enough of the population becomes immune. The the flatter the curve, the slower the spread, the less stress on health services and the more lives will be saved. A suppression strategy seeks to flatten the curve. Elimination looks to crush it.

Genomic sequencing: If contact tracers are the detectives of disease control then genomic sequencing is the forensics – tracking tiny changes (see mutation) in the virus’s genetic code to follow its spread. The virus captured in a test swab is converted into DNA so its viral family tree can be read and compared to others taken from patients. Each is time-stamped to when (and where) they were collected – like a genetic passport. This technique revealed that Victoria’s second wave of infections all came from one source — and was distinct from its first wave in March. Read more here.

Hamsteren: Truncated from the Dutch word “de hamsterweken” meaning to stuff food into your cheeks, like a hamster and often used to describe hoarding. During the pandemic it's been used to shame those who stockpiled supplies while supermarkets were grappling with disrupted supply chains.

Hand hygiene: Don’t touch your face – and if you do, you better pray your hands are clean. Washing hands regularly with soap and water or disinfectant is a key way to avoid COVID-19.

Herd immunity: How much of a population is immune to a virus. The magic number is 60 per cent – generally, more than half of a population needs to be exposed to a pathogen before transmission slows. The term "herd immunity" went viral in March as some European nations delayed imposing shutdowns as part of a bold plan to "let the virus rip" and so build up immunity in the population more quickly. In the modern era, community resistance to a virus is commonly achieved through a vaccine. The US and Europe are still not at 60 per cent immunity even after months of raging outbreaks.

Incubation period: The window agreed by doctors in which symptoms of the virus typically emerge – in this case, within two-14 days of infection (hence the 14-day isolation orders).

Lockdown: An enforced version of a social distancing shutdown in which the government orders people to stay home except for key permitted reasons such as essential work or medical care. Melbourne has been under one of the world’s longest lockdowns (though not the longest) but in nations such as the Philippines, China and Spain measures to keep people apart were even tougher.

Post automatically merged: Sep 11, 2020

Mutation: Once the virus is inside someone, it starts to spread by making copies of itself. Sometimes it makes mistakes, tiny variations known as mutations. Most don’t affect how the virus behaves. Unlike the wildly unpredictable genetic code of influenza, the new coronavirus is mutating at a fairly stable rate, scientists say. Over time it is likely to become milder (though more contagious).

N95 respirator: A disposable mask rated to block not just droplets but 95 per cent of airborne aerosols as well. While three-ply reusable masks or disposable surgical masks are recommended for the public, N95s are generally intended for medical staff.

Pandemic: Commonly describing an epidemic that has spread over several countries or continents. In the wake of criticism it had “cried wolf” in declaring swine flu a pandemic in 2009, the WHO dropped the term from its emergency response. Declaring a pandemic no longer triggers any formal action but the word still guides how seriously countries take the threat and the agency copped criticism for not using the “P” word earlier this time.

Patient zero: The patient identified as the first case in an outbreak. The pandemic has a patient zero (whoever the virus first jumped into in late 2019) but he or she may never be definitively found. Individual outbreaks also have their own patient zeroes, typically highly sought by contact tracers to help understand and contain a particular cluster.

PCR test: To find the virus you have to catch it in the act – either by swabbing a sample directly or looking for the body’s immune response to the infection in a blood (serology) test. The swab or PCR (polymerase chain reaction) test is considered the “gold standard” in diagnosis. Swabs are taken from where the germ is known to live — the back of the nose, the throat and sometimes from phlegm coughed up from the lungs – and then its genetic code is analysed back in a lab.

PPE: Personal Protective Equipment such as masks, gloves, gowns and face shields. A key barrier to help keep healthcare and other essential workers safe from infection on the frontline of the COVID-19 fight, but shortages have raised exposure fears throughout the pandemic.

reprint: A scientific paper or study that has yet to be put through rigorous peer review and fact checking. Scores of preprints are gaining early attention during COVID as the virus moves faster than the usual speed of science. But all preprints should be interpreted with caution as errors may yet emerge.

Proning: Medical teams will sometimes position COVID patients on their stomachs in a “swimmer’s pose” to help get more oxygen into their lungs.

Quarantine: First devised in 15th-century Venice when ships were isolated for 40 days to stop them bringing in the Black Death, quarantine (or "quazzie" in 2020) means isolating those with or at risk of having a disease, to stop its spread. Today quarantine refers to keeping those at risk (such as close contacts or newly arrived travellers) in mandatory isolation. And “isolation” (or "iso") refers to keeping those already diagnosed with COVID separate from other patients or members of their household. In Australia, if you are served with an isolation order by health authorities, you must stay home and away from others until told otherwise. And people are also asked to “self-isolate” if awaiting test results or feeling unwell.

R-0 or reproduction rate: The average number of people infected by each confirmed case. If the virus had its way and no rules were in place, each COVID patient would infect about three others, spreading exponentially. But with interventions such as isolation and social distancing, authorities hope to drive that number to below one — so the virus begins to die out and the tentacles of its transmission can be hacked off, one case at a time.

Post automatically merged: Sep 11, 2020

Ringfencing: Imposing localised lockdowns on a specific area undergoing an outbreak to stop its spread further out. In Tasmania, “ringfencing” helped cut off a major outbreak in the state’s north, but in Melbourne the country’s first "hard lockdown" left the residents of nine public housing towers abruptly stuck in their homes, at times without adequate supplies, and copped widespread criticism.

Second wave: Outbreaks tend to play out in waves, both globally and at a local level. An initial surge of cases might peter out, only to peak months later, and sometimes in third or fourth waves, whenever the virus finds a fresh foothold. Much of what we understand about pandemics comes from the waves of the 1918 flu but all of the influenza pandemics since have seen a resurgence about six months in. Australia is now in its second wave, after a March surge receded and then returned in Victoria, but the world is still in its first wave as cases continue to accelerate. Read about how the pandemic might pan out here.

Social distancing: Sometimes swapped for the more friendly “physical distancing”, this means keeping your distance from others — at least out of droplet range (1.5 metres) — and staying home as much as possible to stem the spread of the virus. To that end, countries across the world have shut down certain industries and public spaces and enforced stay-at-home orders.

Superspreader: Someone who, for unknown reasons, infects an unusually large number of people, often spawning particularly big clusters. Superspreaders have been linked to SARS, MERS and now COVID-19.

Suppression: Australia’s official strategy for the pandemic. It means bringing in social distancing interventions until new cases have fallen to “acceptable levels” (at the very least, within the capacity of the healthcare system). Restrictions are phased in as cases climb and then eased off when they fall. Australia’s deputy chief health officer Nick Coatsworth has also coined the term “aggressive suppression” for the kind that’s tough enough to lead to elimination by happy accident. While the public health response in Australia so far has not always been perfect, this approach has already seen elimination (more or less) achieved in many states and territories, with long weeks passing without locally-caught cases.

Vaccine: Designed to artificially stimulate the body’s immune response to the virus, so creating a protective shield against it, at least for a time. Many COVID vaccine candidates have already reached their end-stage human trials. But experts predict we’re probably still at least a year away from a vaccine roll-out. Read more about how a vaccine is made from scratch here.

Ventilator: A machine used to keep a patient breathing when their lungs are failing — now worth their weight in gold to hospitals overrun with COVID patients.

Viral load: How much virus you are infected with, say, by inhaling a droplet. The bigger the viral load, the higher chance you have of the virus taking hold in your body and infecting you. Airborne aerosols (see aerosols, above) have less viral load than droplets and so you have to breathe in more to reach an infectious dose. The exact amount for COVID is not yet known but, in general, experts say a higher dose (say, for a healthcare worker or family member over a sustained period of contact with a patient) can be more dangerous.

 

[Lynda2475]

Wet market: Live animals are trucked into “wet markets” across Asia and beyond where they are killed on site as part of a cultural preference for fresh meat over frozen. Some are wildlife, sold both legally and as part of a thriving underground trade in "wild tastes" and products. Scientists think the new virus jumped from wild animals into humans in late 2019, possibly in a wet market known to sell wildlife in Wuhan, China, where many of the first cases of COVID-19 emerged. Such wet markets are notorious breeding grounds for disease as stressed animals from all corners of the world are caged close together, trading unfamiliar diseases, and then handled by humans. It happened that way with SARS in Guangdong, China, and then again with MERS, this time along camel trade routes and slaughterhouses in the Middle East. Australia is among a group of nations now calling for a ban on wildlife markets globally. Read more here.

WFH: Working from home.

WHO: The World Health Organisation, a specialised arm of the UN tasked with co-ordinating the world’s response to outbreaks. Read more about the agency (and why it’s come under fire) here.

Zoonotic: A disease that has jumped from animals into humans. More than 70 per cent of all new pathogens emerging in people are thought to be zoonotic (think HIV, Ebola, SARS) and more are now making the leap across species lines as humans push further into the wild.

Zoombombing: When an unwanted person crashes a video chat, by hacking in to a video conference platform, such as Zoom. The "photobombing" of the pandemic age, it started as a harmless joke but it can also involve people projecting more sinister images, including coughography, on to screens.

Any to add??

 

[tgh]

302 570

New World record yesterday daily tested Covid positives

 

[lovetravellingoz]

302 570

New World record yesterday daily tested Covid positives

Yes sad news.

Also while many of us would love to travel, the reality is that in some parts of the world that CV19 is accelerating.

 

[TheRealTMA]

Interesting. The variolation concept used for smallpox was an interesting medical debelopment.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2026913

 

[Flashback]

302 570

New World record yesterday daily tested Covid positives

From what I understand the Guinness World Book of records requires some kind of payment to include your record? Will they be hitting up the WHO for that?

 

[p--and--t]

Dr Andrew Nash from CSL (the company tasked to make 80M covid vaccine doses for the gov) was interviewed on ABC The Business

He was asked about the government agreement and projected delivery of a vaccine to Australians. They are not ready to produce and need to ramp up and prepare.

His views

Oxford Vaccine : novel technology not been used before

• Very optimistically - the best case scenario early next year
• From his experience, best guess, if an effective one is actually developed and approved - maybe mid next year

Queensland Vaccine : a tried and trued methodology for other vaccines

• Very optimistically - the best case scenario early next year
• From his experience, best guess, if an effective one is actually developed and approved - maybe October next year

 

[Flashback]

Is this a side effect of measures being too generous? I say that slightly tongue in cheek, I do recognise a lot of people are losing / have lost jobs; I was one of them (albeit not in Australia) as a result of the pandemic.

WA youth on JobSeeker are urged to 'get a job' by concerned minister

Young people on JobSeeker payments have been urged to 'get a job' as there are many positions in bars, restaurants and holiday parks in Western Australia.

www.dailymail.co.uk

As with anything, if people can get paid to sit on their todd then why wouldn't they. Reminds me of the stories you used to hear about the beach/surf bums who just go out surfing all day while pulling in government cash.

 

[serfty]

Reminds me of the stories you used to hear about the beach/surf bums who just go out surfing all day while pulling in government cash.

Yes, in places like Bali where AU$200 a week was a small fortune.

 

[tgh]

That didn't last long..

310678 on 09/011…. .. Sorta prophetic maybe

Is Guinness the only arbiter of world absolutes?

 

[p--and--t]

Is this a side effect of measures being too generous? I say that slightly tongue in cheek, I do recognise a lot of people are losing / have lost jobs; I was one of them (albeit not in Australia) as a result of the pandemic.

WA youth on JobSeeker are urged to 'get a job' by concerned minister

Young people on JobSeeker payments have been urged to 'get a job' as there are many positions in bars, restaurants and holiday parks in Western Australia.

www.dailymail.co.uk

As with anything, if people can get paid to sit on their todd then why wouldn't they. Reminds me of the stories you used to hear about the beach/surf bums who just go out surfing all day while pulling in government cash.

There was a report a few days ago (ABC??) where they interviewed tourist operators in WA turning away bookings because they couldn't get staff.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

. Reminds me of the stories you used to hear about the beach/surf bums who just go out surfing all day while pulling in government cash.

I think Centrelink and Ausstudy allowances etc now stop if you go overseas.

 

[Hvr]

I think Centrelink and Ausstudy allowances etc now stop if you go overseas.

Six weeks is the grace period for Commonwealth government payments.
Age pensions may have a slightly different time frame.