General Medical issues thread

[Pushka]

Oh come on Dr Ron?

Naive John makes a statement and automatically everyone doubts John's version of events. If I say I was in ICU and I saw and heard what doctors and nurses were saying then don't doubt me. I have zero to gain accusing anyone.

My bed was literally a few metres away from the Triage area. Doctor went to see a patient and when they came back they were telling jokes and socialising and discussing personal lives. Then they'd go out and back again. This went on and on through every shift. In the mean time patients are waiting and building up outside.

I know what I saw. I know what I heard. Its not allegations. Its not accusations. Its fact. Sorry for those that refuse to accept me relating facts and instead accuse me of lying and distorting truth. Up to you but it's the same with every issue society faces today. Ignore the truth because it's not convenient nor what we want to hear.

If you tell me it's a tough job and they need to socialise then there's something wrong with them. They should look to move to a quiet country town practice where they see 1-2 patients a day. If I am not mistaken the ER should be go, go, go and they need to be dealing with patients not their social lives.

So that's confusing. Your dad in ICU and your comment about staff in ICU are two different events?

 

[RooFlyer]

Simply appalling.

 

[drron]

I know what I saw. I know what I heard. Its not allegations. Its not accusations. Its fact. Sorry for those that refuse to accept me relating facts and instead accuse me of lying and distorting truth. Up to you but it's the same with every issue society faces today. Ignore the truth because it's not convenient nor what we want to hear.

If you tell me it's a tough job and they need to socialise then there's something wrong with them. They should look to move to a quiet country town practice where they see 1-2 patients a day. If I am not mistaken the ER should be go, go, go and they need to be dealing with patients not their social lives.

So you saw a few minutes of the doctor's and nurse's day so you assume that is the regular routine. i can assure you it's not.
Do you know if they had sleep the night before. Were they up most of the night trying to resuscitate a person but despite their efforts died? They are human and we all have to have moments when we can switch off for a while. Yes we are human and need to socialise.

And then saying they should move to a country town where they would see 1 or 2 patients a day shows that you really have no idea what you are talking about. Country GPs are some of the hardest working doctors in Australia with very long hours at times for little remuneration.
I used to do what they call MSOAP visits when I had my private practice on the Sunshine Coast. I visited the towns of the North Burnett region.

One was Eidsvold. It is a small town which in 2006 when I last visited had a population of 459. The sort of place you would think the doctor had an easy time I suppose John. One day I arrived at the GP's surgery and he looked terrible. I asked what was wrong, He had been up all night because of a high speed head on crash north of town. 4 casualties. He inserted a chest drain in one who had a tension pneumothorax, performed an old neurosurcical proceedure on another to relive press due to bleeding outside the brain essentially saving his life and reducing subsequent morbidity - both survived long term. On top of that the other 2 had broken limbs and one a spleen injury. They had to be stabilised before being sent to Bundaberg hospital.
Then of course he had to do his morning surgery of 20+ patients. And this doctor was in his mid 70s. He stayed on because he could not find another doctor to take over the hospital. he finally retired when in his 80s which meant their hospital closed as such It is now a multipurpose health centre with no permanent doctor.

Eidsvold Multipurpose Health Service

Information for patients and visitors to Eidsvold Multipurpose Health Service on how to get here, visiting hours, health services and contact details.

www.widebay.health.qld.gov.au

So John I don't care what you saw and what you believe. You have never been in those doctor's and nurses position. Your conclusions from "your facts" are totally erroneous.

 

[Gladstone Tim]

My 85 year old dad is very ill. I asked for an update. I was ignored. I should commend them for job well done right?

P.S. I spent some time in ICU. Doctors and nurses are not busy all of the time. More than half the time is taken by socialising.

So John, were you medicated at the time? Experiencing pain? Sleep deprived? Having a distorted view of reality?

You talk about ICU being near a triage area- ICUs don’t have triage areas. A patient is transferred there after being triaged and given usually life+saving treatment at ER, scheduled from major surgery/theatre or medivaccecd in.

Were the staff who were socialising actually working their meal break because of being short-staffed on a 12-hour shift? Was a colleague checking -in on them because of a previous traumatizing outcome…that shift or earlier? Were they helping to maintain a healthy collegial culture rather than exist in a toxic workplace?

Regarding not getting a callback regarding your father….yes, disappointing but I would see that as more the role of the ward clerk. I’d far rather a highly-trained nursing professional focus on patient care than relaying condition updates to a relative who has chosen not to be physically present. Hospitals have well-publicized complaints processes. If you are so troubled by what you perceive has occurred, engage with them rather than pointlessly complaining on here and further displaying your ill informed perception.

Yours kindly,

The father of a hard-working, highly trained, dedicated ICU nurse. In short, an angel.

 

[Cossie]

So John, were you medicated at the time? Experiencing pain? Sleep deprived? Having a distorted view of reality?

You talk about ICU being near a triage area- ICUs don’t have triage areas. A patient is transferred there after being triaged and given usually life+saving treatment at ER, scheduled from major surgery/theatre or medivaccecd in.

Were the staff who were socialising actually working their meal break because of being short-staffed on a 12-hour shift? Was a colleague checking -in on them because of a previous traumatizing outcome…that shift or earlier? Were they helping to maintain a healthy collegial culture rather than exist in a toxic workplace?

Regarding not getting a callback regarding your father….yes, disappointing but I would see that as more the role of the ward clerk. I’d far rather a highly-trained nursing professional focus on patient care than relaying condition updates to a relative who has chosen not to be physically present. Hospitals have well-publicized complaints processes. If you are so troubled by what you perceive has occurred, engage with them rather than pointlessly complaining on here and further displaying your ill informed perception.

Yours kindly,

The father of a hard-working, highly trained, dedicated ICU nurse. In short, an angel.

Very well said, wish I could have been as eloquent as this, instead of allowing his comments to get under my skin and make me angry.

I thought about the triage comment later as well, I’m sure all the medicos on here will agree that it is very unlikely to have a triage section in critical care area.

 

[Gladstone Tim]

Thank you Cossie. I found your post quite apt. I had to remain professional compared to what I was thinking otherwise the language I used may have had me banned from the forum.

 

[JohnK]

So that's confusing. Your dad in ICU and your comment about staff in ICU are two different events?

No they're not. I'm not afraid of calling a spade a spade.

@drron I wasn't a few minutes in ICU. I was there for 36 hours before being moved to the ward. I know what I saw as clear as day. I don't care how you put it. This is not professional behaviour.

I once waited in waiting room of ER from 10:00pm until 6:00am and went home untreated. I can't really say whether they were busy or just couldn't be bothered.

My dad had a heart operation in 2005. He was treated very poorly by the nurses at Royal Prince Alfred. I have vowed never to donate to RPA donation drive. My brother and mum have forgiven them but not me.

A few years ago my dad spent about 6 months in 2 hospitals. He could not walk. He was in a lot of pain. The original issue was caused by the pain management clinic giving him too much morphine. In Concord hospital the doctors experimented with my dad giving him Gabapentin. I told them not to but they ignored me anyway. Dad suffered from delirium. He was aggressive so they strapped him. He had bruising everywhere. Wonderful treatment of an 81 year old man. Wow.

Please don't ever think that all doctors and nurses are angels.

 

[RooFlyer]

Ya gotta wonder how soooooooo much medical, banking, internet, communication, hospital, work, personal and other trouble seems to happen to one person and over so many years.

 

[Pushka]

Please just stop JohnK. I regard Nurses as the Angels on Earth. Superheroes. The stuff they have to deal with, the insults and assaults that come their way that simply don't get reported likely internally because of all the paperwork, and rarely in the media. Then there's the minutiae of their work. The tasks they have to do just because that's part of caring for people, then there's the absolute care and skill they show to their patients. And dealing with patients who show them no respect and who are the kinds of people we would not want to know in our life. They have no choice

I think you'd last two minutes.

 

[drron]

Sorry again John you have no experience of being in the shoes of a doctor or nurse. 36 hours in an ICU is a minuscule amount of the work hours of doctors and nurses just around Sydney and certainly not enough to come to a conclusion that many of them are useless, bad, unprofessional or whatever your current beef is.

And for your information gabapentin is a recommended treatment to prevent pain and can be very effective. As with all medications some people will have side effects. Your saying that the doctor was experimenting with your father is wrong and defamatory.

 

[tgh]

I am unsure why y'all are bothering to engage with the OP… goodness knows how many of us have tried to reason over the years and failed...

 

[Cossie]

Ya gotta wonder how soooooooo much medical, banking, internet, communication, hospital, work, personal and other trouble seems to happen to one person and over so many years.

Not forgetting the travel dramas and religious issues over the years.

I’d be seeking counselling, perhaps it’s all happening in his alternate reality.

Again, I have never heard of a triage in an ICU, but hey, what do I know about intensive care units as I have never been a patient in one.

However, best not say anymore because I really don't want to get banned….

 

[cove]

I had one stint in ICU and the care I received was first class 29 years ago.
My in-laws had the same experiences in this decade so no complaints from our family.

 

[MARTINE]

I can only agree with my medical colleagues (as a resident working extended shifts in ICU was brutal and the collegiate supportive culture of one’s peers vital to survive.Respite for staff were taken when a few mins arose to debrief/eat - not stopping during CPR or patient care for idle chat/gossip as it was ‘break’ time. Often did not happen at all and, hence, any chance to communicate about non-work matters occured (always respectfully and appropriately)

AFF posters have made similar observations

In my own experience (where I had to make the decision to turn off life support measures for a family member many years ago) I will never forget the hours of kindness, support and care I received from the drs/nurses that helped me in the period before death. I still remember it to this day. It helped
Yes @Pushka - angels indeed

 

[mrsterryn]

My ICU involvement has been as a family member on quite a few occasions with ailing parents and subsequently ailing husband. Most traumatic was my husband for his partial brain tumour removal. I really don't remember much as within 14 days we went from a healthy husband to one who had had golf ball size brain tumour partial removal with all the ongoing issues.
However what I do remember is....being comforted , feeling my husband was in good hands all round , that he would be ok . I don't remember any "nitty gritty" type stuff at all when he was in ICU and he was there quite a few days.
Feeling certain I cried a lot and the staff were there for me

 

[MARTINE]

Not forgetting the travel dramas and religious issues over the years.

I’d be seeking counselling, perhaps it’s all happening in his alternate reality.

Again, I have never heard of a triage in an ICU, but hey, what do I know about intensive care units as I have never been a patient in one.

However, best not say anymore because I really don't want to get banned….

Not sure its you who should be banned…

 

[Bundy Bear]

This can be a most interesting thread stuff to look forward to as I get older.

About 2 weeks before I was due to leave for the US I ended up with a chest infection, Dr Google 7-10 days recovery. Sort of started to feel better the day I left and was able to run ok during the race. I did take a codral cold and flu tablet before the race and ran with a Ventolin spray which I have never had race with before, but I thought better to be over prepared than under, the previous night 4 Nov I had been coughing so not a preparation before a marathon.

Felt that I had recovered for my flight home the following Friday but arrived Sunday feeling tired and by Monday it was another round of cold symptoms.
Now Sunday 19 November feeling the worst I have felt in 4 weeks it will probably be a trip to the doctor on Monday.
I remember the hotel I stayed in LA had the temperature set to 63 so about 17c I only turned it off and should have heated up the room first before turning it off and going to sleep.
Interesting the Kenyan marathon runners always over dress to keep their body temperature up to decrease chances of colds and other infections, and also completing a marathon does wear you out somewhat.

Let’s hope its nothing too major and I feel 100% better tomorrow,

 

[Quickstatus]

@JohnK, remember that a lot of carers of ill and disabled people are their family members. These people are the most selfless people you could ever meet. Often they give up their careers, comfortable lives and even their own health to care for their loved ones. I invite you to experience being a carer

There are great hospitals drs and nurses. There are also bad hospitals drs and nurses. The vast majority are somewhere in the middle. We don't socialise in the standard sense but we are a collegiate and social people who recognise each other as a valued team member. The time taken to "socialise" is a time of respite. We connect with one another at a professional and a social level because we have to. Healthcare is depressing because we can't cure the incurable. Is sad because we lose patients. Is thankless because many get better and are just passing through. Who supports the hospital drs and nurses?.

We don't socialise to waste time. There is no time to waste. We also cannot speed up time. We can't make treatments go twice as fast in order to treat twice as many patients. We wait for the patients and we often wait a long time. Time is the best healer even with advanced medicine but we have to wait for Time. We can only treat so many at the same time and we wait for those patients while they are under our care. Have a deep think about what I mean by waiting for the patients.

I'm sorry you have such a negative view of hospitals/nurses/drs and I would say from reading your many posts, the entire world. It seems to me that you are angry with the world and your interactions with the people in it are coloured by this. Unfortunately the world can't be replaced but perhaps if your outlook is a bit different, you may see a different world and the people in it?.

 

[JohnK]

And for your information gabapentin is a recommended treatment to prevent pain and can be very effective. As with all medications some people will have side effects. Your saying that the doctor was experimenting with your father is wrong and defamatory.

Oh please. The doctors told me they were experimenting. I'm not delusional. I knew what they were doing and I can see that dad was suffering from delirium (and they saw that too) and told them to stop but they continued the treatment until it got worse. It was totally unprofessional and you can think what you want.

Why the attacks from all sides I do not understand? Just shut up right because my experiences are different? Not all doctors and nurses are angels. Next you'll tell me we don't have issues in nursing homes right?

 

[Quickstatus]

The doctors told me they were experimenting

Gabapentin is not an experimental medicine. It is used often with chronic, and also neuropathic pain.
Like all medicines, its a matter of "suck it and see". In other words :"don't know if it will work but lets try".
All treatments are in a way "experimental". We don't know if it will work, but its worth a try because there is evidence to support its use, and it's use is common for pain conditions,