Lack of curtains separating Business and Economy on 737

[FrustratedQP]

Actually you can't be prosecuted for trespassing, but you can be sued for damages. Trespass is a civil wrong, not a crime, despite what all those wrongly-worded signs say.

I’m not sure about other states, but I would draw your attention to the NSW ‘Enclosed Lands and Protection Act No. 33 of 1901.’

 

[JohnK]

Of course JohnK would say the CSM spontaneously ‘invites’ him to the front in recognition of his Qantas royalty status. Funny how that never happens to the rest of us!

I've already said I rarely use the front toilet except in case of emergency and that is very rare. Like hardly ever. Once in a blue moon scenario.

I did go to the back toilet once and was stuck there 15m-20m as both carts were out and I didn't want to interrupt the meal service. Have you seen what they do when someone in rows 4 back is stuck behind the carts and "actually" wants to sit back in their seat again? Both carts move into the business section until the person is able to be seated which would mean business class service is also interrupted.

And also I sit in row 4 quite a lot. I've witnessed with my own eyes people in economy invited to use front toilet. More than once. Happens quite a lot for me to notice.

 

[UP4014]

And also I sit in row 4 quite a lot. I've witnessed with my own eyes people in economy invited to use front toilet. More than once. Happens quite a lot for me to notice.

Invited, JohnK isn't that outrageous. haha
.

 

[durbrain]

Have you seen what they do when someone in rows 4 back is stuck behind the carts and "actually" wants to sit back in their seat again?

No, I have not experienced that because, unlike some, I am able to control my bodily functions for the 30 mins the cart is out.

Over half the drivers in Sydney commute for > 30 mins. One wonders how they manage to survive such a daily ordeal if Y passengers are a representative cross section of the population??

And also I sit in row 4 quite a lot. I've witnessed with my own eyes people in economy invited to use front toilet. More than once. Happens quite a lot for me to notice.

I also sit in row 4 a lot and have never seen an CSM approaching a passenger unsolicited stating "Would kind sir care to freshen up in the forward cabin powder room?". I wonder if sjk could confirm this common practice that I am obviously not privy to. Clearly such treatment is only bestowed upon special passengers such as yourself!

 

[JohnK]

Why wait until the carts come out before you decide you need to go?

I usually go to the toilet when I need to go. There are other factors that could be involved such as running late or having infant daughter with me.

And as we've discussed over and over it does not bother me who uses the toilet. When I do fly premium cabins on other airlines I don't make a mental note of who is entitled to use the toilets and keep a track of toilet use. In fact I couldn't care less.

 

[durbrain]

I usually go to the toilet when I need to go. There are other factors that could be involved such as running late or having infant daughter with me.

If your infant daughter needs to go urgently, nobody has an issue with that. But that is not the typical demographic of those who breech the J cabin from Y.

And not even making an effort to time your bathroom breaks, knowing that failing to do so may inconvenience the J cabin is selfishness pure and simple. When you're in a car, do you just piss on the seat because "I usually go when I need to go"?

And as we've discussed over and over it does not bother me who uses the toilet. When I do fly premium cabins on other airlines I don't make a mental note of who is entitled to use the toilets and keep a track of toilet use. In fact I couldn't care less.

And this is the point that you and your fellow J-toilet brigade don't understand. Just because when you fly J you don't care, doesn't mean other J flyers aren't entitled to feel aggrieved when the behaviour of feral Y passengers affects their (much more expensive) experience. Show some respect to your fellow passengers.

 

[Boca68]

I also sit in row 4 a lot and have never seen an CSM approaching a passenger unsolicited stating "Would kind sir care to freshen up in the forward cabin powder room?". I wonder if sjk could confirm this common practice that I am obviously not privy to. Clearly such treatment is only bestowed upon special passengers such as yourself!

I have seen it many times from J and from Y, "oh holier than thou" durbrain. In respect, that person or persons want to use the facilties, they arise from y , cart blocks the way to Y toilets. In my world, and in most FA's world, its just common courtesy. But if you feel that infringes on your god given right to have sole use of J toilets. Don't care.

I've seen FAs block passengers physically, I've seen them wave them through, I've seen them just ignore it and I've never seen anyone in J (passengers) complain about it. Why don't you next time.

Seriously, if this is your lifes' biggest problem, you are doing very well. Get over it my friend.

 

[serfty]

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[Anna]

I’m not sure about other states, but I would draw your attention to the NSW ‘Enclosed Lands and Protection Act No. 33 of 1901.’

I would draw your attention to the fact that the Inclosed (correct spelling) Lands and Protection Act 1901 (NSW) does not make trespass a crime. That Act creates various offences, none of which are called ‘trespass’. That is because trespass is a civil wrong, not a crime.

Yes, that Act does create an offence of unlawful entry on certain land. Which is legally a different thing from trespass.

 

[FrustratedQP]

I would draw your attention to the fact that the Inclosed (correct spelling) Lands and Protection Act 1901 (NSW) does not make trespass a crime. That Act creates various offences, none of which are called ‘trespass’. That is because trespass is a civil wrong, not a crime.

Yes, that Act does create an offence of unlawful entry on certain land. Which is legally a different thing from trespass.

Yes sorry, my bad re spelling.

You don’t have to go very far into the Act to find this, ‘An Act to consolidate the enactments relating to the protection of inclosed lands from intrusion and trespass.’ (My bold)

Anyway, this is off topic.

 

[JohnK]

I also sit in row 4 a lot and have never seen an CSM approaching a passenger unsolicited stating "Would kind sir care to freshen up in the forward cabin powder room?". I wonder if sjk could confirm this common practice that I am obviously not privy to. Clearly such treatment is only bestowed upon special passengers such as yourself!

Unsolicited? I thought I said invited. e.g. cart is at around row 8-10 and person in row 4 gets up to go to the toilet. The CSM has invited them to use the front toilet if the business class cabin is not busy.

On a number of occassions I've stalked the carts down to the back to use toilet. The FAs are not usually comfortable with me slowly making my way down the back. And if there are 1-2 people waiting to use the toilets the carts go out to collect rubbish and I'm stuck until they finish. That's not desirable.

And not even making an effort to time your bathroom breaks, knowing that failing to do so may inconvenience the J cabin is selfishness pure and simple. When you're in a car, do you just piss on the seat because "I usually go when I need to go"?

Please do not be offended if the inconvenience of the business class cabin is the furthest thing from my mind. In fact it's not something I think about outside of this thread.

 

[Daver6]

No, I have not experienced that because, unlike some, I am able to control my bodily functions for the 30 mins the cart is out.

Unfortunately it isn't as simple as that on an aircraft. Sitting in a window seat, you get the urge to go. You might even consider hanging on till you really need to go in order to minimise disruption to the pax in the middle and aisle seat. You get up to go and realise the meal service is just starting. At this point you really need to go. So it isn't just a matter of holding on for 30 minutes. You might have been holding on already for two hours.

You're working on the assumption (I presume) that the individual has just evacuated their bladder immediately before the carts come out, so should be able to wait 30 minutes.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

You're working on the assumption (I presume) that the individual has just evacuated their bladder immediately before the carts come out, so should be able to wait 30 minutes.

No. It’s the same principle parents use before you go on a road trip. You ask the kids to make sure they’ve been to the toilet first.

Adult frequent flyers, who know the carts will come out 10 minutes into the flight, are the same as kids... go to the toilet in minutes 1-10, or hold on until minutes 20-50. All times when the aisles are free from carts.

We know adults are good at this... they drive to work, or take public transport. They don’t have to get off two stops after they leave home every morning to find a WC.

But when it comes to using the nice toilet in the higher cabin, with better amenities in it, and no queue... the mentality seem to be that you wait until the carts come out so you can go use the nicer WC?

 

[Vic]

Well, I have had a CSM say I was welcome to use the front coughper a small number of times. This was a prospective invitation, as in if I needed to go then I could use the front, not an offer made when I was getting up to go. I certainly never took that invitation as a crew direction, as a crew instruction that I must use the front. It seems silly that anyone could think that it was an direction that must be obeyed. I prefer the exercise in walking to the back.
I have twice got up to go and had the CSM tell me to use the front. I have multiple times been sitting in business cabin waiting to go, only to have a constant stream of economy pax pushing in front. Funny our people on the cheap fares aren't respectful of other people.

 

[UP4014]

Funny our people on the cheap fares aren't respectful of other people.

This post is heading the same as some others, slagging off Y passengers.

 

[dk4]

LMAO at this thread...

Qantas policy on forward toilet use on single aisle aircraft is simple - anyone can use it so long as a queue doesn't form. (It has already been alluded to way back by a previous insider's post.) Same goes for domestic priority ground services from check-in to boarding, Qantas staff are instructed to serve who ever turns up, where ever! (Of course Qantas puts signs up and makes announcements about all these things, but never enforces them = company policy!)

The reality on board B737s is that Qantas makes significantly more money (over the course of the financial year) from the "types" who can select row 4 seats, than the "types" who can only select row 3 seats! Talk to your CSM about it next time you are on a longer flight and your CSM has a spare minute. (I did!)

The only domestic airline which "protects' forward toilet access on single aisle aircraft (and indeed other ground services from priority check in through to boarding) is Virgin! It is part of their performance guidelines for staff.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The reality on board B737s is that Qantas makes significantly more money (over the course of the financial year) from the "types" who can select row 4 seats, than the "types" who can only select row 3 seats! Talk to your CSM about it next time you are on a longer flight and your CSM has a spare minute. (I did!)

Well yes. But they make even more money off the types who can select rows 1 and 2 than those who can select 4!

 

[dk4]

...they make even more money off the types who can select rows 1 and 2 than those who can select 4!

And those "types" generally don't turn around to see if someone is coming from row 3 or row 4! Their main concern is easy access to the loo without a queue. Hence why CSMs police the queue rather than access! I can certainly see the business logic in it, and also the competitive positioning business logic behind the way Virgin does it.

 

[durbrain]

(Of course Qantas puts signs up and makes announcements about all these things, but never enforces them = company policy!)

This is the stupidest statement to come out of this thread and there certainly hasn’t been lack of competition!

For all International Y passengers, let’s all go line up at the F check in because ‘insider dk4’ says it’s ok - company policy!! Or maybe try that move at the F lounge? Let us know how it goes!

 

[dk4]

For all International Y passengers, let’s all go line up at the F check in because ‘insider dk4’ says it’s ok - company policy!! Or maybe try that move at the F lounge?

Please re-read my post, rather than selectively quote me. I refer only to domestic priority services. International is a very different airline! I am not the insider, look back many pages to see the insider's post.

May I suggest, that if you don't like Qantas domestic policy; write to them, or fly their competitor!