Malaysian Airlines MH17 Crashes in Ukraine

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MH is only strictly liable for compensation up to the stated threshold, which is payable irrespective of negligence.

Per IATA it's a two tier strict liability. Part 1 is the threshold. Part 2 unless they can prove no negligence.

ii. For Passengers
 Under MC99 claims are subject to a much more generous compensation in the case
of death or injury. MC99 abolished the arbitrary limits that existed under the Warsaw
Convention system and established a two-tier strict liability regime. Claims in excess
of the MC99 liability limits may succeed unless the carrier can show that it was not
guilty of negligence in causing death or injury. Thus, the possibility of uncompensated
losses in a major aircraft accident case is significantly reduced.
 MC99 also includes a number of other consumer friendly provisions such as advance
compensation payments and a wider choice of jurisdictions in which to bring claims.
 Liability limits are reviewed by ICAO every five (5) years, ensuring MC99 remains
modern and relevant.
Full discussion paper from IATA: http://www.iata.org/policy/Documents/Position Paper mc99.pdf
 
It is time I unsubscribed from this thread. It has run its course for me as far as I can see.

It's getting to that point, although I wish we heard a lot more news about what is happening to the repatriation of the bodies and cross-examination of the crash site.

It's interesting that MH370 had news going on for days on end with no real certainty (as it turned out) whereas MH17 seems to have fizzled rather quickly - yes, there's still a daily story, but that's about it. Maybe it's because we at least know what happened, but you'd think with that certainty comes the want for more knowledge on the process. Maybe it's because two other air accidents have now happened in the mean time, or there is a larger crisis of death in the world (i.e. between Israel and Gaza). Maybe it's because it's "MH again" and that doesn't make good reporting. In any case, I hope clear answers are forthcoming for the sake of those who hold dear the lost passengers on MH17.
 
Well here's updates:
1) Multi-national force to be deployed, led by the Dutch to secure the crash site
2) Black-boxes have been sent to the UK for examination
3) Further large sections (and unfortunately bodies) have been recovered - these don't appear to have been interfered with
4) Russia continuing to blame it all on anyone but themselves.
 
There is ongoing news.The Red cross got to the crash site yesterday but only 4 of them,someone has gone through the belongings of the pilots in the last 24 hours,at least 1 MH investigator there now and another large piece of wreckage found.all in this CNN reporters twitter feed-

https://twitter.com/ErinELyall

Then in another on scene reporter this-

One Australian expert has arrived to inspect the #MH17 crash site. With 3 Malaysians, that makes 4 - out of dozens elsewhere in Ukraine

An interesting report from the AI pilots who were close to MH17-
Air India flight was 90 seconds away when missile struck Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 - The Times of India

Meanwhile both sides in the Ukrainian troubles distinguish themselves-
Dispatches: Mass Grave Found in Eastern Ukraine | Human Rights Watch
Ukraine: Unguided Rockets Killing Civilians | Human Rights Watch

Reporters face real dangers-
Journalists covering the Ukraine crisis suffer intimidation | Media | theguardian.com

And the Ukrainian government looks anything but stable-
http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/ukrainian-government-abruptly-resigns-en-masse
 
I also heard a radio report this morning that Australian investigators had managed to map some of the site.
 
Some poignant journalism.

A Column of 40 Hearses Meets the Victims of the Malaysia Airlines Crash, The New York Times, 24 July, page A6

Eindhoven Air Base, the Netherlands . . . At 3.48pm on Wednesday, a military cargo plane belonging to the Australian Air Force [sic] touched down at the Eindhoven Air Base, home to the Royal Netherlands Air Force, in the southern Netherlands. On board were 24 coffins. Soon afterward, a second, smaller plane landed, its thundering propellers piercing the silence. It was carrying 18 coffins.

Along the tarmac, flags representing the 17 nationalities of the 298 victims of the crash stood at half-staff, their lines clinging to the flagpoles in the warm summer-wind.

. . .

After the propeller plane switched off its engines, a heavy silence filled the air. Columns of military representatives appeared from the western side of the airfield, marching in formation toward the planes. Forty black, identical hearses followed them.

There were no speeches or obvious tears, but a lone solider played the "Last Post" on his trumpet . . .

One minute of silence followed, on the airfield and in the rest of the Netherlands. A public television station, NOS, reported that church bells had rung across the country right after the planes landed. Truckers, many of whom had tied black ribbons to their vehicles, stopped on the sides of highways. In shops and coffee-houses, music was stopped.

. . .

After all 40 countries had been loaded in, the cars left in a column towards Hilversum, an hour and a half north. One of the Netherlands' main highways, the A2, was partly closed off. Along the highway and on overpasses, people, some crying, threw flowers. Car driving in the other lane stopped as the hearses passed.
 
Any point in mentioning the conspiracy theories about this? Could be very poor taste?
 
I think there is enough poor taste about the whole episode.
We now have some b#tch on instagram bragging about using cosmetics from a crash victim, we have credit cards being cancelled that had been looted from bodies, and mobile phones from victims also being cancelled due to usage in the area.
I'm probably a little emotional about it all, but all I hope is that karma comes to the scum who caused, and participated in this whole disaster.
There are also some absolutely terrible photos on twitter of peoples loved ones.
 
As to the credit cards they are cancelled if the bank knows the person is deceased so the part that they are being cancelled is wrong.A lot of disinformation out there in social media.
Now for another side to the story.This may end up behind the WSJ pay wall,If so just google the title.gives the stories from the local villages.Warning,very graphic descriptions-
After Flight 17 Crash, Agony, Debris and Heartbreak in Ukraine Villages - WSJ

So others have also suffered from the downing of MH17.
And praise should go to the Malaysian PM-
http://www.newsweek.com/how-malaysia-brokered-deal-rebels-crash-site-access-260397

Especially after the criticism the Malaysians got after MH370.
 
I was thinking more conspiracy rather than that other stuff done by disgusting people.

All passports are brand new. A truck full if brand new passports was found in Ukraine.
Aircraft serial numbers are wrong for that particular aircraft. This information was 'gathered' when only the rebels had access to the site.
Conspiracy being to discredit Russian as the BRIC nations had just set up a competitor to the IMF and France and Germany were planning to join it.

Of course, it fails to explain what happened to the real MH17.

But I was interested in the serial number thing. Is that even realistic?
 
The serial number came from a photo of MH17 at the gate in AMS.The plane had a different serial number to the one shot down.But the picture turned out to be from a different day.
Was somewhere on Pprune.
 
The serial number came from a photo of MH17 at the gate in AMS.The plane had a different serial number to the one shot down.But the picture turned out to be from a different day.
Was somewhere on Pprune.

Sounds like it was actually the registration. I'll have a look. ta

EDIT: prune was a look down the rabbit hole that I had to quickly terminate.
 
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As to the credit cards they are cancelled if the bank knows the person is deceased so the part that they are being cancelled is wrong.A lot of disinformation out there in social media.....
I have posted this up thread - a credit card being cancelled does not stop someone trying to use it, or its number. There would be records of such attempts.
 
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