My QF flying days are numbered - due to poor QF CS

[Kangol]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

In terms of downgrade priority it is always P, U and Y fare class offloaded first in decreasing order of status. WP in P class will still be offloaded before a NB in F or A class.

I presume the same is true in terms of who QF reaccomodates.

I have been informed by many QF staff that it is status and not fare bucket that is considered before any other factors in a downgrade. Clearly this is another "consistently inconsistent" features of Qantas.

 

[JohnK]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

Unless compensation was negotiated at the coalface ..... it's just a punt.

I read it being a cancelled flight ... not a downgrade.

Understood but one of the options offered was a downgrade.

Let's say you order and pay for a Testarossa Ferrari. When you go to pick up the Ferrari the shipment was cancelled but you are offered a Toyota Vios instead which you accept. Should the dealer get to keep the $370,000 difference?

Only in the airline industry they try to keep your money when offered a lower cost product.

 

[amaroo]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

Understood but one of the options offered was a downgrade.

Let's say you order and pay for a Testarossa Ferrari. When you go to pick up the Ferrari the shipment was cancelled but you are offered a Toyota Vios instead which you accept. Should the dealer get to keep the $370,000 difference?

Only in the airline industry they try to keep your money when offered a lower cost product.

All academic if the passenger accepted the alternative offer. Until the OP updates the thread - it's all speculation.

Ferrari has around 9,000 customers a year.

Qantas has around 47.5 million customers a year.

Drawing a connection between the two is pointless.

FTR - I hope the OP gets his points back.

 

[openseat]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

Accepting an alternative offer doesn't mean forgoing all your rights, despite what airlines say. It is unfair not to refund the difference, especially when the consumer, as in this case, has no opportunity to negotiate. https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/contracts-agreements/unfair-contract-terms

 

[kpc]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

First up, I did not start this thread; I mentioned the issue in passing in another thread and was asked to expand why I was pi$$ed off with QF and my reply is in the 3rd post of this thread. A moderator spun off this into its own thread, perhaps hoping it might help my case. Essentially, I was also flying with my +1 on a separate revenue ticket (but had linked the PNRs), YYR-DFW-SYD on AA in J and QF in J, upgraded with 50K QF points to F from DFW-SYD. We found out QF 8 was cancelled (later found out due to a lightning strike so the inbound QF 7 never made it to DFW) when I checked Expert Flyer enroute from YYZ-DFW on AA. We both were automatically rebooked on the flights mentioned above DFW-LAX on AA in Y, and NZ in J LAX-AKL-SYD. We weren't really given any alternative options and I didn't push the issue hard as I noted from EF that QF F was full on the following day's flight (may be a mistake in retrospect; we were anxious to get home for work reasons but could have stayed a night in DFW)...(I won't mention that QF took hours to actually ticket the above flights so we could check in and the fact that our bags went missing for hours in DFW).

We were proactively contacted by QF customer care on our return to SYD, and after I complained about the issues mentioned above, were each given 10K QF pts as a goodwill gesture which I said was not satisfactory. After a few emails back and forth, I myself was refunded 50K for the (non eventuating) upgrade from paid J to F, and eventually received original route credit for the QF flight from DFW to SYD. However, my request for a refund of 56K QF points for my +1, being the difference between a F and J award between DFW and SYD (booked using my QF points) seems to have fallen on deaf ears by both QF Customer Care and the Frequent Flyer Center where the case was referred onto...

The issue(s) above in itself is not the only reason as to why I will proactively try and direct my future travel to other airlines as oppose to blindly directing everything to QF which I have done for the last 10+ years....if it suits me, and it is the best option, i will still fly QF but won't push all my flights their way in the future, which previously has resulted in me reaching QF Plat level for the last 8+ years. I already have pre existing flights booked with QF that will mean I will qualify Plat again for the next year.

As an aside, I have just returned from NY and flew CX J between HKG and EWR which was fantastic, and flew OZ F A380 between JFK and ICN; both blow the equivalent QF products out of the water!

 

[trippin_the_rift]

So you were on full rev biz class with a confirmed points upgrade, and the +1 was on a F award ticket?

 

[kpc]

So you were on full rev biz class with a confirmed points upgrade, and the +1 was on a F award ticket?

yes.........

 

[trippin_the_rift]

yes.........

Do I understand it correctly?

- Qantas cancels flight
- Qantas fails to inform TWO first class passengers on separate PNRs about the cancellation
- You AND +1 were downgraded DFW-LAX from First Class to Economy
- You AND +1 were downgraded from First Class to Business Class and rebooked on another airline which also added an extra connection and layover
- Qantas offers 10K each as total compensation

Breaking down these events, I see a number of consideration points which should be addressed in the form of compensation by Qantas.
- Your +50K points upgrade J->F (worth 50K points)
- +1 F->J/Y downgrade (worth >50K points)
- Consideration for 2 extra layovers ( ???)
- Reimbursement of Qantas "Fees & Charges" which were not incurred as you never took a QF#
- Compensation for the experience, and for having to bring it all up.

I'm so surprised that airlines which have been around for 90 years, experience with 10000's of delays, cancellations and probably millions of displaced passengers over nearly a century; that there is somehow not enough corporate knowledge to know how to get the passenger disruption experience right.

 

[kpc]

Do I understand it correctly?

- Qantas cancels flight
- Qantas fails to inform TWO first class passengers on separate PNRs about the cancellation
- You AND +1 were downgraded DFW-LAX from First Class to Economy
- You AND +1 were downgraded from First Class to Business Class and rebooked on another airline which also added an extra connection and layover
- Qantas offers 10K each as total compensation

Correct.

Breaking down these events, I see a number of consideration points which should be addressed in the form of compensation by Qantas.
- Your +50K points upgrade J->F (worth 50K points).

I have been refunded this.

- +1 F->J/Y downgrade (worth >50K points)
- Consideration for 2 extra layovers ( ???)
- Reimbursement of Qantas "Fees & Charges" which were not incurred as you never took a QF#
- Compensation for the experience, and for having to bring it all up.

I'm so surprised that airlines which have been around for 90 years, experience with 10000's of delays, cancellations and probably millions of displaced passengers over nearly a century; that there is somehow not enough corporate knowledge to know how to get the passenger disruption experience right.

Interesting points...

 

[Flying mermaid]

I'm so surprised that airlines which have been around for 90 years, experience with 10000's of delays, cancellations and probably millions of displaced passengers over nearly a century; that there is somehow not enough corporate knowledge to know how to get the passenger disruption experience right.

we had a similar experience two years ago when on an Aone4 - paid with money not points! There was a problem with the A380 which meant some days had to go to a 747. Now a fairly major disruption on multiple days, but no contact from Qantas - found out when checking my next flight in Rome that we had been downgraded to business for our flight home from LAX. Initially told when I phoned, that there was no other option as F was fully booked out of LAX for days. We were flying SFO to LAX so I suggested they change that to SFO to DFW and we fly from DFW - there was heaps of F availability out of DFW, but no one had thought of that option.

on return I received a really nice apology and flowers and it almost swung me back to Qantas, but in the end I decided to adopt the OPs strategy of flying the airline that makes sense, rather than sticking to Qantas. As a consequence we have gone from 2,500 sc to less than 100 this year.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

on return I received a really nice apology and flowers and it almost swung me back to Qantas, but in the end I decided to adopt the OPs strategy of flying the airline that makes sense, rather than sticking to Qantas. As a consequence we have gone from 2,500 sc to less than 100 this year.

I wonder if there's a correlation between downgrades/insufficient compensation, and reduced brand loyalty?

With Cathay, there is a strong link between social media negative sentiment and reduced loyalty: https://www.traveldatadaily.com/cathay-pacific-marco-polo-loyalty/

 

[ermen]

FWIW,

In late 2015 I booked HKG - NRT on CX F on a Qantas partner award.

On the day itself, F plane was cancelled (leaving me with only a J seat). I opted for Y instead.

Emailed QFF with the boarding passes and explanation - and got the difference in redemption F points and Y points promptly refunded. No hassles at all.

I am surprised that the OP is having so much trouble for what should be a straightforward issue.

Maybe QF is making money now and getting arrogant

 

[JohnK]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

All academic if the passenger accepted the alternative offer. Until the OP updates the thread - it's all speculation.

Ferrari has around 9,000 customers a year.

Qantas has around 47.5 million customers a year.

Drawing a connection between the two is pointless.

FTR - I hope the OP gets his points back.

How many first class customers does Qantas have in a year? Reading further update from kpc and it looks much worse for Qantas.

A simple refund of points will normally be enough to avoid any requests for compensation. Airlines have it way too easy. It's like they're a protected species. In my opinion they are poorly run businesses and only remotely successful because people feel they need to fly more and more.

 

[boomy]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

The issue(s) above in itself is not the only reason as to why I will proactively try and direct my future travel to other airlines as oppose to blindly directing everything to QF which I have done for the last 10+ years....if it suits me, and it is the best option, i will still fly QF but won't push all my flights their way in the future, which previously has resulted in me reaching QF Plat level for the last 8+ years. I already have pre existing flights booked with QF that will mean I will qualify Plat again for the next year.

At least you got something positive out of this unfortunate event. Directing all flights blindly to one airline is not a good idea. Something I learnt myself after years of blind loyalty to QF. In fact AFF was a major contributor to open my eyes and see that (outside Australia) there are much better options.

If I'm not mistaken most, if not all, your Int travel is at the pointy end, therefore QF Plat won't benefit you that much apart from getting some extra award seats and some Flounge entries when flying J. IMO those benefits don't worth giving up the freedom of choice.

 

[amaroo]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

How many first class customers does Qantas have in a year?

Now that Flying mermaid has left the cabin - probably no real ones If you count the point chases like us ... I dunno, around 70,000

 

[RichardMEL]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

At least the PNR linking for kpc and +1 worked to the extent that they were both booked on the same flights to get home together.

hey just finding a small positive. I mean imagine that had been ignored and one went home via NZ and the other (say kpc in revenue J) was put on QF LAX-SYD or something.

just a minor thing.

There's little to defend in this scenario though and I wouldn't even try (the above is not a defence, just an observation). Let's not forget that QF had a bunch of J pax to reroute on short notice as well as the F ones... a nightmare of logistics no doubt - and very costly.

It seems a no brainer to just refund what is being asked for which isn't unreasonable or anything. The mind does boggle.

As with ALL of these situations - both at QF and many other airlines who get themselves into CS SNAFUs (*cough* United *cough*) it's the service recovery that often is the key. Stuff Happens.. how you respond, and follow up, is key. They failed here.

Sadly they're not alone.

 

[ozmille]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

any update on this one?

 

[Cult of one]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

Bless Qantas, I am unsure why they are not playing the long game. The OP is not asking for a bag of cash to be mailed to them just the difference of the points that they used. I feel that this is not unreasonable at all.
I have found in my career that if you fix a problem very quickly you maintain a client, mess them about and they can walk.
Qantas wins the battle and looses the war.

 

[fiscal]

Re: My QF flying days are numbered - poor QF CS

Time to send a picture of a lemon meringue pie to AJ.

 

[Champo]

Incomprehensible that a qantas customer service officer receiving such a request could ignore it and run the risk of this most damaging exposure What is it about qantas that they are so miserable in awarding compensation in genuine cases I have personally experienced this attitude on a couple of occasions which is infuriating when you consider the extremely small cost to qantas to not just remedy the situation but also go beyond their basic responsibility and award a sizeable reward as goodwill. The culture within the qff area really needs a giant overhaul