New TRS rules? Goods no longer included in cap?

[BJReplay]

A family includes a person and his or her de facto partner (including same-sex couples) and any of their children under 18 years of age; or a husband and wife, and any of their children.

(Edit: Actually, weird thing there is that unless you are married children over 18 don't count as part of the family group. I wonder how that is defined in the legislation or if it's just sloppy wording on the part of the ABF...)

Actually adult children travelling with husband and wife do count as a family group - and can extend it.

When I (54) travelled with my wife and my parents (79, 88), and we (myself and my mum) put in two separate claims on the way out, the person at the desk said "you could have just put in one claim and come back in as one family group".

I said "yeah, but when we come back in, firstly, I'm coming back in with my stuff, not mums, and secondly, we're not hanging around waiting for them after 24 hours of flying and five week's overseas - we're hot-footing it to go home while they faff around - we'll have seen enough of them by then".

 

[MattA]

Actually adult children travelling with husband and wife do count as a family group - and can extend it.

When I (54) travelled with my wife and my parents (79, 88), and we (myself and my mum) put in two separate claims on the way out, the person at the desk said "you could have just put in one claim and come back in as one family group".

I said "yeah, but when we come back in, firstly, I'm coming back in with my stuff, not mums, and secondly, we're not hanging around waiting for them after 24 hours of flying and five week's overseas - we're hot-footing it to go home while they faff around - we'll have seen enough of them by then".

Yep. I was curious and it's Friday afternoon so I've just looked it up.

Australian Border Force Website

Our mission is to protect Australia’s border and enable legitimate travel and trade.

www.abf.gov.au

Schedule 1700571 covers Accompanied personal effects and contains the following definition:

family means:
2 people who are married, and any of their children; or
a person and his or her de facto partner (within the meaning of the Acts Interpretation Act 1901), and any of their children;

There is a separate schedule 1700581 that covers Unaccompanied personal effects

family means:
2 people who are married, and any of their children who are under the age of 18 years; or
a person and his or her de facto partner (within the meaning of the Acts Interpretation Act 1901), and any of their children who are under the age of 18 years

I have no idea why adult children are excluded in the case of unaccompanied effects but not for accompanied personal effects, but anyway the general advice on the ABF website here Australian Border Force Website that suggests adult children and excluded from a family group duty free allowance if the parents are not married is clearly incorrect. Not the first time the general advice on the ABF website has been incorrect!

 

[SOPOOR]

I don't think anyone really knows for certain. The ABF page -- Australian Border Force Website


(Edit: Actually, weird thing there is that unless you are married children over 18 don't count as part of the family group. I wonder how that is defined in the legislation or if it's just sloppy wording on the part of the ABF...)

The image of those people who are poligamous with 7 wives came into my head. That would be very handy

 

[makeurownway]

So are Border searching bags if you are flagged on the return and if they don’t find the TRS claimed items in your bag are they asking where they are and who has them? We aren’t bringing back what we claimed, but it’s not really fair if we have to be justifying where the items are and handing over our friends details etc. just to be able to get GST back.

 

[There'sOnlyOneJimmy]

So are Border searching bags if you are flagged on the return and if they don’t find the TRS claimed items in your bag are they asking where they are and who has them? We aren’t bringing back what we claimed, but it’s not really fair if we have to be justifying where the items are and handing over our friends details etc. just to be able to get GST back.

My gut response is along the lines of: “The underlying reason why I was entitled to a refund of GST on my original departure from Aus is because I was exporting the items. I am not re-importing the items (as you can see from my luggage), so that’s the end of it.”

 

[Daver6]

Has anyone yet been pulled aside and questioned? I don't recall hearing about it and I feel a big deal would have been made about it if it had happened.

 

[BJReplay]

Has anyone yet been pulled aside and questioned? I don't recall hearing about it and I feel a big deal would have been made about it if it had happened.

Yeah, more than a decade ago. I declared a (roughly) $3,500 to $4,000 recommended retail Seiko Astron GPS watch (I can't recall exactly as it was that long ago) that I picked up new (uncompleted lay-by) for about $2,200 on the way out the country for a 10-day trip. I was warned on the way out.

I'd lusted after these watches for a long time, but couldn't really justify them, but Thomas's jewellers in Melbourne would have twice yearly clearances of typically hard to move gear as well as items that had been put on lay-by where the original buyer hadn't completed the lay-by. I could rationalise the roughly $1,200 discount.

I'd bought the watch already when I was asked to go overseas by my employer, and at that point I quickly did some research on what that specific model was selling for 2nd hand. Since it was a lay-by, it was already on the 2nd hand market as real watch nerds were upgrading - for under the magic threshold. Armed with some printouts of ebay ads, just in case, I claimed the GST on the way out - got warned it was over the threshold to bring it back in without declaring it and left on my work trip.

On the way back in, I didn't declare that I had goods over the limit, annoyingly couldn't get the auto-gates to work so had to go through a manual passport gate, got asked at the manual gate about the watch, said, yes, I'm bringing it back in, but it's only worth $750 now, the guy laughed and said "I've heard that one before" and I laughed and said "I'm sure you have, but here are some ads on ebay for the exact model number of the watch in question". He wrote a couple of letters on my passenger declaration and sent me on my way.

I'm not sure that anything would have happened if I had used an automated gate (or maybe that's why the gate didn't work), because I know that they don't have a screen when they review the incoming passenger declarations.

I probably shouldn't have bought it new if I'd thought about it - it turns out there's a good second-hand market for these, but I did get it with a five-year warranty.

 

[theblank]

So if you were bringing < $900 of TRS-claimed goods then surely the answer to question 3 is still "No", despite what the ABF advice says ("the goods must be declared"). It's a little less clear in your case as the incoming passenger card doesn't mention the pooled family allowance at all.

I think the ABF advice can be ignored. When are returning, we sign the declaration thats printed on the card, there are penalities for making a false declaration.

Its not our fault the declaration card hasnt been updated with the appropriate question - or the ABF site is wrong.

 

[k_sheep]

Update: Claimed TRS on a $2500 laptop, person doing the claim told me to make sure to declare it but they'd wipe 20% off the value immediately and should only have to pay the difference (contrary to my understanding so take that with a grain of salt). Came back through, ticked yes for over 900. Gentleman asked what I had, said a 2500 laptop and he just waved me through with my friend. Phew! Didn't even have to convince him she was my sister or something - he hadn't even realised my husband behind was with us!

 

[Zinger]

Update: Claimed TRS on a $2500 laptop, person doing the claim told me to make sure to declare it but they'd wipe 20% off the value immediately and should only have to pay the difference (contrary to my understanding so take that with a grain of salt). Came back through, ticked yes for over 900. Gentleman asked what I had, said a 2500 laptop and he just waved me through with my friend. Phew! Didn't even have to convince him she was my sister or something - he hadn't even realised my husband behind was with us!

I had a similar experience. I made a claim as I was taking a new MacBook out of the country and was told to declare it on arrival back in Oz.

I declared it on arrival with the paperwork ready and customs just waved me on and told me to have a good day. And I did.

 

[theblank]

I declared it on arrival with the paperwork ready and customs just waved me on and told me to have a good day. And I did.

The same thing has happened to me so many times, yet on the one time, customs guy doesnt ask anything, he just points to another guy in a cashier type window and says go see him to find out what you have to pay. buggar.

 

[Jennifer999]

I just came back from overseas and was clearly flagged for my (attempted) high value claim. Officers approached me to ask if I’d made an TRS claim. It was after the smart gates but before I got to baggage claims.

I found it odd as TRS had already rejected my claim since I’d accidentally brought the wrong shopping bag with me to the airport so I didn’t have the goods.

 

[kpro]

I just came back from overseas and was clearly flagged for my (attempted) high value claim.

How high value are we talking about? In the five figures?

I found it odd as TRS had already rejected my claim since I’d accidentally brought the wrong shopping bag with me to the airport so I didn’t have the goods.

Given it seems to require someone to explicitly put a flag on your passport number, it's odd that they would bother if the claim wasn't processed.

 

[Jennifer999]

How high value are we talking about? In the five figures?


Given it seems to require someone to explicitly put a flag on your passport number, it's odd that they would bother if the claim wasn't processed.

Yep, a piece of jewelry. Still kicking myself for the mistake. Grabbed the wrong bag in the rush for the Uber More annoyingly, it was for my mum and I won’t be heading over to see her again for another 6-12 months.

 

[NM]

Yep, a piece of jewelry. Still kicking myself for the mistake. Grabbed the wrong bag in the rush for the Uber More annoyingly, it was for my mum and I won’t be heading over to see her again for another 6-12 months.

I wonder if the retailer might consider processing a refund and resale in, say, 5-11 months time? And it sounds like you have no intention of bringing the item back in Australia once gifted to your mother, so would have been a legitimate claim.

 

[hwy]

what goes on in the mind of a customs officer? it is completely random.

 

[cwd]

I know someone who was recently told TRS wasn't available for Australians (and hence the Tourist in TRS). Required getting the supervisor over to have the person processing the claim told that was wrong (pretty unbelievable, and says a lot about ABF that they could have been sitting there doing that job and thought that was the case).

That reminds me, I need to email ABF to find out what the deal is with claiming WET. Last time I did it they refused to use the WET value on the invoice, and would only give a nominal value based on assuming the wholesale was half the retail price.

So yes, I don't think we should listen to what ABF officers tell us. Penalties for false declarations only apply to us poor travellers.

 

[colt75]

I just came back from overseas and was clearly flagged for my (attempted) high value claim. Officers approached me to ask if I’d made an TRS claim. It was after the smart gates but before I got to baggage claims.

I found it odd as TRS had already rejected my claim since I’d accidentally brought the wrong shopping bag with me to the airport so I didn’t have the goods.

Wow that is wild, that they went out of their way to find you.

normally they pull you aside as you hand your ticket in to leave, after you collect your luggage.

 

[Yearlylonghaul]

A little off topic, but, I was pulled aside after collecting a hard rifle case from oversized baggage and not having declared anything. Customs officer approached me and questioned what I had in the case (before I got to the exit of the baggage hall) . I responded that I had my dirty underwear in it. Nevertheless I was sent to the inspection area and was asked to open the case. He was very shocked to be confronted with about 3 weeks of dirty underwear.

 

[Tiki]

I claimed TRS for an $800 camera on the way out and ticked the under $900 box on the return (truthfully as I hadn't bought much, just a couple handmade crafts and t-shirts). I also declared plant based goods just in case one of the crafts qualified. I showed the item, it was fine and no mention made of my TRS claim a few weeks earlier.