NOT re: Army coup Turkey

[marki]

Re: Army coup Turkey

What is wrong - besides the lack of any evidence to support that opinion?
The theatre isn't on fire.

What is this "closed threat" that you see coming. Personally I have uttermost faith in the Australian security agencies to protect us from any threat.



Actually, I have seen that. Brigitte Gabriel is clearly clearly has extreme views. I found the answer to be more of the same fear and hatred that leads to problems. that's my opinion, hopefully you can respect it.

Great your opinion, Mine ......Majority was irrelevant, the 20% were responsible and the theatre is on fire or have you not seen all those beheadings sticks shoved into them or the playing ball with them. No obviously not, ...... thats not proof is it? Absurd, you may have fear and hatred, I have reality.

 

[NSWP]

Re: Army coup Turkey

I don't believe she is speaking any truth whatsoever.
Should stick to celebrity stories

Not forgetting Sonia is Blonde. Pass the popcorn somebody, what a lively thread.

 

[medhead]

Re: Army coup Turkey

Great your opinion, Mine ......Majority was irrelevant, the 20% were responsible and the theatre is on fire or have you not seen all those beheadings sticks shoved into them or the playing ball with them. No obviously not thats not proof is it? Absurd, you may have fear and hatred, I have reality.

wow. very emotive. Lots of people die everyday day of a whole range of things. do you know how many people are killed by gun violence in the USA every year? Do you know how many Australian's are kill by domestic violence every year? This is not to say that certain groups in the middle east aren't animals who have caused a tragic loss of life. But lets get real here, there are so many vastly more pressing issues facing Australia. It is certainly false to think that every muslim in Australia wants to behead me (with sticks shoved in - whatever that means).

A candle floating in a pot of water is not a reason to shout fire.
In my opinion - for other's benefit.

 

[JohnK]

And we have found India to be very racist. And classist o).

Malaysian Chinese don't like Indians and Sri Lankans. Koreans feel they are superior. This goes on all over Asia. Most tourists choose to ignore it.

This thing with free speech. Seems so open to interpretation. With the Charlie Hebdo shootings, it was a result of that newspaper's satire of Islam. Of course the murders were atrocious but massive rallies resulted in order to protect Free Speech.

Sonia made remarks about Islam, her free speech, and she is attacked as racist by others and her free speech is seemingly denied.

How does this work?

There is no such thing as free speech. Political correctness has gone way too far. The people need to have their say back again. There will be revolutions all over.

And a fact most choose to ignore. Multi culturalism does not work if certain groups refuse to assimilate. I for the life of me cannot understand why anyone would choose to come to this country and refuse to adopt the culture as their own.

If you don't agree with the culture and way of life then this is not the right place for you to live.

 

[marki]

Re: Army coup Turkey

wow. very emotive. Lots of people die everyday day of a whole range of things. do you know how many people are killed by gun violence in the USA every year? Do you know how many Australian's are kill by domestic violence every year? This is not to say that certain groups in the middle east aren't animals who have causes a tragic loss of life. But lets get real here, there are so many vastly more pressing issues facing Australia.

A candle floating in a pot of water is not a reason to shout fire.
In my opinion - for other's benefit.

EEERRRR ok do you remember 9/11 ?

nothing to worry about of course keep going that way.....I have a lot of reservations regarding our Australian security forces they are clueless.

 

[medhead]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

And a fact most choose to ignore. Multi culturalism does not work if certain groups refuse to assimilate. I for the life of me cannot understand why anyone would choose to come to this country and refuse to adopt the culture as their own.

If you don't agree with the culture and way of life then this is not the right place for you to live.

Seriously? what like how the greeks, italians, spanish, scots, irish, vietnamese assimilated (to name only a few examples of many). Why is it that lasagne, pizza, and spaghetti are normal household meals these days, if groups assimilated when they came here? Since all other culture fully assimilated why aren't we all eating meat and 3 vege for dinner every night? Here is another one, since Afghan people have been in Australia for 150 years or so, why didn't the post war migrants assimilate to the existing Afghan culture?

Great to have your free speech, but lets not ignore history.

 

[marki]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Seriously? what like how the greeks, italians, spanish, scots, irish, vietnamese assimilated (to name only a few examples of many). Why is it that lasagne, pizza, and spaghetti are normal household meals these days, if groups assimilated when they came here? Since all other culture fully assimilated why aren't we all eating meat and 3 vege for dinner every night? Here is another one, since Afghan people have been in Australia for 150 years or so, why didn't the post war migrants assimilate to the existing Afghan culture?

Great to have your free speech, but lets not ignore history.

interesting that these cultures you mention and others are culinary........love it. But do you assimilate in Saudi Arabia? do you go there begging asylum ? The Syrians are not accepted they all went to Germany. I am not ignoring history just remember there are those amongst us who refuse to believe in the holocaust.

 

[medhead]

Re: Army coup Turkey

EEERRRR ok do you remember 9/11 ?

nothing to worry about of course keep going that way.....I have a lot of reservations regarding our Australian security forces they are clueless.

Seriously stop misrepresenting my position. I've certainly not said what you're trying to imply.
I also don't have time to run through the geopolitical history of the early 21st century. The more important question is whether you remember 9/11 and the chain of events that followed? we've now come full circle to a simplistic view of these events that is making us less safe. There is nothing more to say.

BTW I know members of our security forces, your characterisation of them is highly offensive.

interesting that these cultures you mention and others are culinary........love it.

Food is an important manifestation of all cultures.

 

[marki]

Re: Army coup Turkey

Seriously stop misrepresenting my position. I've certainly not said what you're trying to imply.
I also don't have time to run through the geopolitical history of the early 21st century. The more important question is whether you remember 9/11 and the chain of events that followed? we've now come full circle to a simplistic view of these events that is making us less safe. There is nothing more to say.

BTW I know members of our security forces, your characterisation of them is highly offensive.

Offensive? Medhead your getting a little heated not sure I agree about misrepresentation more than you. Knowing members and how they work are two different things, I want the best for Australia and a safe Australia, and knowing a few individuals are not going to change that. So don't be silly I highly suggest to you that my opinion about security forces is the least of their problems or a problem at all.

 

[medhead]

Re: Army coup Turkey

I can think of a good old traditional Ozzie Value - The fair go! I wonder why there is this desire to view all people from a certainly group as terrorists and to not afford them a fair go. Can we demand assimilation into the collective when we don't even uphold our own values?

 

[juddles]

Re: Army coup Turkey

"Free speech"?? In my world that is about as valid as impala wishing for a world where they were free to cavort through the African plains without lion eating them. Beautiful idea. But just an idea.

 

[straitman]

Re: Army coup Turkey

Which bit?
I have outlined the points that Sonia is wrong about with facts. I didn't comment about her entire set of expressed views.
some bits might be opinion, based on history.
Happy to be given any example where hatred and fear against one group have made life safer. Happy to see any example where alienating people has lead to integration. I haven't checked the election records, but I'm pretty certain that the national socialists were elected by a majority of voters. I've pretty certain the holocaust happened, is that opinion to accept that without seeing it for myself?



You did seem to express an opinion that anyone criticising Sonia is attacking her right to free speech.

All I was saying is that 'Sonia is wrong' in your opinion and probably the opinion of many others.

At the same time in her opinion and also probably the opinion of many others, she is right.

You are both entitled to the opinions you express and many will agree and disagree with you both.

 

[JohnK]

Re: The totally off-topic thread

Seriously? what like how the greeks, italians, spanish, scots, irish, vietnamese assimilated (to name only a few examples of many). Why is it that lasagne, pizza, and spaghetti are normal household meals these days, if groups assimilated when they came here? Since all other culture fully assimilated why aren't we all eating meat and 3 vege for dinner every night? Here is another one, since Afghan people have been in Australia for 150 years or so, why didn't the post war migrants assimilate to the existing Afghan culture?

Great to have your free speech, but lets not ignore history.

Your idea of assimilation and mine are obviously 2 different things.

These days you can't tell a Greek from an Italian from a Spaniard from a German from a Pole from a Yugoslav out in public. Most I see speak English and have friends from other races.

And then there are a certain group of migrants whose kids are now 2nd and 3rd generation who refuse to speak English even at school. These are 16 and 17 year olds. They do not hangout with anyone other than their own race/religion. They spit on Australian culture. They spit on Australian society. Very sad.

You can close your eyes to what is going on around you. And you can also choose to ignore this is going on around you if that makes you feel better. I can't ignore it. I don't feel safe walking the streets around my house at night. This fear is not imaginary. This fear is quite real. But luckily I live in an area in Sydney that's not as bad as some of the other areas.

 

[marki]

I can think of a good old traditional Ozzie Value - The fair go! I wonder why there is this desire to view all people from a certainly group as terrorists and to not afford them a fair go. Can we demand assimilation into the collective when we don't even uphold our own values?

Your idea of assimilation and mine are obviously 2 different things.

These days you can't tell a Greek from an Italian from a Spaniard from a German from a Pole from a Yugoslav out in public. Most I see speak English and have friends from other races.

And then there are a certain group of migrants whose kids are now 2nd and 3rd generation who refuse to speak English even at school. These are 16 and 17 year olds. They do not hangout with anyone other than their own race/religion. They spit on Australian culture. They spit on Australian society. Very sad.

You can close your eyes to what is going on around you. And you can also choose to ignore this is going on around you if that makes you feel better. I can't ignore it. I don't feel safe walking the streets around my house at night. This fear is not imaginary. This fear is quite real. But luckily I live in an area in Sydney that's not as bad as some of the other areas.

Medhead will give those that spit on us or Australian culture a fair go( sic!)

See how quickly you will assimilate in Saudi. It's not the Borg collective( Star Trek).

 

[TomVexille]

Re: Army coup Turkey

I'll just leave this here.

[video=youtube;6JbGC1Ine6M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JbGC1Ine6M[/video]

Only a minute long so worth the watch

 

[anat0l]

If this thread is going to deepen the racial etc. subthread further then I hope the mods will split it off with equal haste and zeal as they have with other, less emotional / passionate subjects.

 

[Conrad_S]

If this thread is going to deepen the racial etc. subthread further then I hope the mods will split it off with equal haste and zeal as they have with other, less emotional / passionate subjects.

Can I suggest the thread title could be "the cost of free speech"

 

[medhead]

All I was saying is that 'Sonia is wrong' in your opinion and probably the opinion of many others.

At the same time in her opinion and also probably the opinion of many others, she is right.

You are both entitled to the opinions you express and many will agree and disagree with you both.

Probably worthwhile reviewing my exact words. I didn't claim she was 100% wrong in her opinion. I limited my comment to specific points which are demonstrably wrong. One of those was highlighted earlier.

Problem is you praised her for speaking the truth not for having an opinion. Her opinion is demonstrably wrong (i.e. not the truth) on a number of points. People who who stir up hatred and fear by saying things that are wrong actually make us less safe. This has got nothing to do with PC. You simply do not get people to "integrate" by alienating them.
As for the WW2 reference, it simply doesn't work. The majority before WW2 were the people vilifying people based on race and religion. They were the bad people. If the analogy is even going to be used, it doesn't favour Sonia.

Sonia was certainly wrong when she claimed that Japan is racially homogeneous.

Specifically on this point according to wikipedia Japan is not as ethically homogeneous as the statistics would suggest:

Though it is said that Ethnic Japanese make up 98.5% of the total population and that the rest are Koreans 0.5%, Chinese 0.4%, other 0.6%,[SUP][1][/SUP] in fact these numbers are not known. The Ministry of Justice in Japan conflates nationality with ethnicity, and they have no official data on the actual ethnic breakdown of people in Japan.

Sure dismiss wikipedia. but Sonia taking the official numbers actually ignores the real story.

Even if we accept the 98% figure, within that group there is a mix of racial types.

Within Japan, a distinction between "Polynesian-type" (that is, those with darker skin and rounder eyes) Jomon and "continental-type" (lighter skin and narrower eyes) Yayoi is sometimes observed, although the popular shorthand does not reflect the observed 90% Yayoi / 10% Jomon haploid-group frequency of modern Japanese DNA.

We can call this an opinion but there is pretty strong evidence to dismiss the claim made by Sonia that japan is racially homogeneous. The Tokyo subway gassing also makes it had to support her opinion that there are not terrorist events in Japan because of the racial mix.

 

[medhead]

Your idea of assimilation and mine are obviously 2 different things.

These days you can't tell a Greek from an Italian from a Spaniard from a German from a Pole from a Yugoslav out in public. Most I see speak English and have friends from other races.

And then there are a certain group of migrants whose kids are now 2nd and 3rd generation who refuse to speak English even at school. These are 16 and 17 year olds. They do not hangout with anyone other than their own race/religion. They spit on Australian culture. They spit on Australian society. Very sad.

You can close your eyes to what is going on around you. And you can also choose to ignore this is going on around you if that makes you feel better. I can't ignore it. I don't feel safe walking the streets around my house at night. This fear is not imaginary. This fear is quite real. But luckily I live in an area in Sydney that's not as bad as some of the other areas.

Once again you're completely missing the point. All cultures bring their stuff and add it to the melting pot. You're generalisation about "a certain group of migrants" has nothing fact based to support it. All of those migrants? Really?! Sounds like nonsense to me. Besides 2nd and 3rd generation? - so that would be Lebanese migrants from the 1980s then - not syrians/afghans/iraqis from the last 10 years. And not all muslims in Australia - just some of them. They sure don't spit on me.

I'm actually the one with my eyes open spotting the people that are the problem, rather than tarring them all with the same brush.

 

[marki]

Re: totally off topic

I'll just leave this here.

[video=youtube;6JbGC1Ine6M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JbGC1Ine6M[/video]

Only a minute long so worth the watch

Look it's not pigment ..... Painting such broad strokes is simplistic it's beliefs too,!

Ohh a few posts have been trimmed here and there and that's censorship is alive and well on AFF ....... Just because a few get upset. We are not allowed to have different opinions? Have to tow the party-line good grief