Oneworld Classic Flight Reward Discussion - The Definitive Thread

[adelee]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Interesting.

I have a 280k coming up with two separate sub 24 hour transits in HKG.

One is CX-QF, no problems. The other is CX-CX.

The itin has been ticketed for months now - should I be concerned about the CX-CX transit?

I don't think so. I believe you can transit through HKG using a multi segment CX. I currently have a ticketed CX AMS-HKG-MEL that is transit only (I'm just trying to get rid of the stopover the other way). I have also had Qantas call centre staff confirm the availability of a couple of CX multi segment transit ticket options today. As far as I know, if CX isn't going to allow something, their computers will kick it out immediately - there shouldn't be any problems once ticketed.

 

[vetrade]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Interesting points made. Judging by your comments snabbu and adelee, I'm now thinking it may be that CX allows multi segment transits through HKG if one of the cities either side of HKG is a "lower level" destination where demand for award seats is not very competitive. In adelee's case AMS could fit that category. I'd be interested in the details of your CX connecting flight segments snabbu to test my theory further.

Admittedly, the CX transits via HKG I've tried to book in the past have been from/to prominent cities (LHR, JFK, LAX, YVR, JNB, NRT etc) and into/out of SYD, BNE or MEL combined with info about non-availability through HKG directly from QF staff. Unfortunately, as others have mentioned, QF staff regularly provide inaccurate or misleading info - which is why thrashing out the specifics on forums like this is so informative.

FWIW I was told that even if you do happen to be able to book a transit through HKG (via a call to QF), CX will block it within 2-3 days maximum; in which case if the connecting flights have been ticketed for some time there should be very little risk of losing those bookings.

 

[snabbu]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

My CX-CX is MEL-HKG (CX104) then HKG-SIN (CX659).

As the 659 is intra-asia maybe it doesn't fit your theory of being a prominent city... perhaps prominent isn't the right word but more like a "major international destination" like LHR/JFK/ORD/etc as you describe above.

In saying that, my previous 280k award involved ORD-HKG-PER where both segments were on CX and was a transit, back then I had no problems.

Could it be that this "no transit through HKG on CX is allowed" idea is more about YMMV and a HUACA is the way to get around the perceived issue?

 

[Danger]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

I have had some experience with the alleged married segment requirements of CX. See here.

My experience suggests to me that the problem may very well be with QF's system. In my situation the QF booking engine gave me the flight options I wanted and even priced them. It was only at the point of entering payment details did it all fail.

QF agent after QF agent told me it was a CX restriction. But it wasn't.

I'm aware that CX insists on married segments and also transits, but my feeling after the above experience is a more a conspiracy one, that QF imposes the restrictions in order to force passengers to book on a stop (and therefore at a higher cost), or take QF's preferred option for them which is to fly QF, JQ or EK.

 

[vetrade]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Could it be that this "no transit through HKG on CX is allowed" idea is more about YMMV and a HUACA is the way to get around the perceived issue?

I don't think so, snabbu. The idiosyncrasy is that you can book award seats on individual segments without any problems but combining them is blocked. I think it's fair to say that it's a CX imposed block and not just a matter of whether you score a compliant operator or not. I've tested the HUACA theory a few times (buy only between major international destinations) and the operators have consistently said "can't do".

As far as "major international destinations" go, PER probably doesn't stack up against our eastern seaboard cities and SIN probably gets through because CX has so many flights daily on the HKG - SIN route.

 

[gbetox]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Has anybody had any luck booking a JAL flight? They simply don't show up on the Qantas booking system...

I need to get from Japan (anywhere) to HKG, so I can take my CX flight to Boston, but CX blocks the Japan-HKG flight, unless I make a stopover... Booking a JAL flight would eliminate the need for a stopover.

 

[sergeyvzn]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Has anybody had any luck booking a JAL flight? They simply don't show up on the Qantas booking system...

I need to get from Japan (anywhere) to HKG, so I can take my CX flight to Boston, but CX blocks the Japan-HKG flight, unless I make a stopover... Booking a JAL flight would eliminate the need for a stopover.

gbetox, you can look up JAL flights and seats availability on the British Airways website. You need to join their Executive Club FF program (it's free) and then you'll be able to see all One World airlines. When joining Executive Club you need to provide a UK address as the program blocks memberships for Australians - you can submit a fake UK address, it'll do

 

[gbetox]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

gbetox, you can look up JAL flights and seats availability on the British Airways website. You need to join their Executive Club FF program (it's free) and then you'll be able to see all One World airlines. When joining Executive Club you need to provide a UK address as the program blocks memberships for Australians - you can submit a fake UK address, it'll do

Thanks for the tip, sergeyvzn. Now I can see them!

 

[sergeyvzn]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Thanks for the tip, sergeyvzn. However, only CX flights show up on BA, even 330 days from now...

What dates are you looking at? JAL flights are only visible 330 days from now, that will be March 08

 

[gbetox]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Thanks, I am able to see JAL flights now

 

[adelee]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Is anyone able to clarify if award flight availability for third party carriers between BA exec club and Qantas should be the same? I ask this because I've recently come across several CX award flights showing up as available on BA being confirmed as not available to Qantas when I ring up to try and book them. So it would seem that CX are offering more award flights to BA for some reason.

 

[sergeyvzn]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Is anyone able to clarify if award flight availability for third party carriers between BA exec club and Qantas should be the same? I ask this because I've recently come across several CX award flights showing up as available on BA being confirmed as not available to Qantas when I ring up to try and book them. So it would seem that CX are offering more award flights to BA for some reason.

BA is known for showing "phantom" CX availability. The best thing is to cross check with JAL Mileage bank - if it doesn't show there it does not exist and QF won't be able to book it

 

[AndyGoodyear]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Hi everyone

So after reading this thread for some time, I'm looking at possible booking a 140K award. However, as it is an instant book, Qantas can only give me a ball-park figure of the taxes as they don't seem to want to go through the hassle of looking at the flights unless I'm booking there and then.

I've also priced up my own paid flights (mostly not one world) and would like to get opinions as to if it is good value with the 140K award.

Flights would be as follows:

1) Sydney - Berlin
2) Rome - Malaga
3) Malaga - London
4) London - New York
5) New York - San Francisco

Aside from the 140K and the booking fee, Qantas have said this would be roughly $1400 in taxes.

Pricing up separate flights (with various different airlines), would cost me a total of $3600, plus earn 13,500 in qantas points.

What does everyone think? Is it worth it? From what I've calculated on value of a point, it doesn't seem to be the average value of points that I have seen people posting about before.

I'd be leaving in July and travelling for three months and from what I can see there are classic awards available on the dates I'm looking for.

Any input would be fantastic.

Thanks

 

[adelee]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

At a brief glance, and without knowing who you are travelling with, if you are prepared to be flexible with shuffling around some of your departure points and select carriers who impose no or low fuel fines (try to avoid BA where possible), you should be able to save yourself significant $

One example would be shifting your London to New York departure point to either Madrid (with Iberia) or Berlin (with Air Berlin). This will not only save you the dreaded London departure tax, but also high BA fuel surcharges (case in point - Iberia is costing me approx. $85 to do this trip later in the year, vs BA $440. Air Berlin was about $30).

And who are you travelling SYD - Berlin with? If Air Berlin, that's a good move. Otherwise, try Cathay, who also have really low fuel fines (though not sure if they fly direct to Berlin - you may need to fly in to Dusseldorf or Frankfurt).

You can review the fees and taxes associated with each ticket by searching for fares here: matrix.itasoftware.com/

 

[snabbu]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Has anybody had any luck booking a JAL flight? They simply don't show up on the Qantas booking system...

I need to get from Japan (anywhere) to HKG, so I can take my CX flight to Boston, but CX blocks the Japan-HKG flight, unless I make a stopover... Booking a JAL flight would eliminate the need for a stopover.

IIRC you can't book JL on the QF booking system for these awards, you need to call them up. Once you find the seats you want just relay this info to the booking agent and they should be able to add them to your itin.

 

[AndyGoodyear]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

At a brief glance, and without knowing who you are travelling with, if you are prepared to be flexible with shuffling around some of your departure points and select carriers who impose no or low fuel fines (try to avoid BA where possible), you should be able to save yourself significant $

One example would be shifting your London to New York departure point to either Madrid (with Iberia) or Berlin (with Air Berlin). This will not only save you the dreaded London departure tax, but also high BA fuel surcharges (case in point - Iberia is costing me approx. $85 to do this trip later in the year, vs BA $440. Air Berlin was about $30).

And who are you travelling SYD - Berlin with? If Air Berlin, that's a good move. Otherwise, try Cathay, who also have really low fuel fines (though not sure if they fly direct to Berlin - you may need to fly in to Dusseldorf or Frankfurt).

You can review the fees and taxes associated with each ticket by searching for fares here: matrix.itasoftware.com/

Hey thanks for your great reply. When you asked who am I flying with - I presume you mean on the 140K ticket? Or do you mean with the cash far I calculated? With the cash fare, its multiple carriers - mostly not Oneworld. With the 140K award, Qantas want to book it with you straight away, so wont go through an itinerary of carriers with me.

For the 140K award, I could be flexible with departure points, although I need to be in London - so going from Madrid to New York will still mean getting a separate flight from London to Madrid first.
Although from what you are saying, it looks like I may save a few hundred dollars on the taxes doing it this way.

Using that link, would I just search all oneworld carriers (ensuring I use the minimum carriers stipulated by the rules) and then just calculate the taxes? This is going to be a huge help

 

[prozac]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Does departing from say Manchester avoid the environmental levy?

 

[knasty]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Does departing from say Manchester avoid the environmental levy?

Nope. It's a UK duty, albeit there are concessional rates for departures ex northern Ireland.

 

[sergeyvzn]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

Just my 2cents in - booking an economy award is NEVER a good value regardless whether it's one way or return or round the world.

in your case you can get a Star Alliance (Lufthansa) RTW ticket for about $2500 all in all including taxes and this will take you to the same places you want to go but will give you more flexibility and you will get some points (credit all your flights to Avianca Lifemiles, buy some more LM points when they are on sale and you'll have a first class ticket SYD-BKK as a result as a bonus).

if you're particularly attached to OneWorld you can start your trip in South Africa and this will save you quite a bit $$$ as well

I would personally never use 140K for a RTW ticket unless I'm desperate to use the points

 

[AndyGoodyear]

re: "oneworld" award (140K/280K/420K) Planning - The Definitive Thread

You can review the fees and taxes associated with each ticket by searching for fares here: matrix.itasoftware.com/

So I did some research via that site - fantastic resource. You're right about Air Berlin - for the most part they have super low taxes. If I'm using the site correctly, I just took the total flight cost and then deducted the base rate. What was left over is what I think I would pay in taxes. So it seems the Qantas rep was way out on the taxes anyway. The way I was going to fly (which did include BA from London - New York) costs as follows:

13/7 SYD - TXL (Air Berlin) $100 AUD tax
13/8 FCO - AGP (BA) $40 AUD tax
17/8 AGP - LON (BA) $40 AUD tax
15/9 LON - NYC (BA) $440 AUD tax
4/10 SFO - SYD (Qantas) $530 AUD tax

This works out to $1150, not the original $1500 ish that Qantas estimated.

I then looked at doing the new york flight from either Berlin (using Air Berlin) or Madrid (using Iberia). Iberia was the cheapest at $275 (how did you get $85?). Pricing a separate Iberia flight to madrid was another $50 tax - so $325 for the NYC journey in total. So if I do that via Madrid it would save another $120.

What are your thoughts?