Oneworld Classic Flight Reward Discussion - The Definitive Thread

[djkelly69]

Your fights do not include any QF flights

This is fine, as long as there at least 2 other OW airlines.

 

[Lynda2475]

Are all your transits under 24 hours (if too long would be counted as a stop-over). I suspect it's distance as adding in the mid west / west coast USA will exceed miles.

 

[kenjicult]

Don't have a reason why it's not pricing correctly when trying to add flights - but I recreated your itinerary (using dummy dates) in the multi-city tool and it's correctly capping at 318k. You may need to try the call centre again and hope for a better outcome!

this has given me hope, thanks for running it through!
I'll play the call centre lottery and see if someone can help reprice correctly

 

[kenjicult]

Are all your transits under 24 hours (if too long would be counted as a stop-over). I suspect it's distance as adding in the mid west / west coast USA will exceed miles.

Yes all transits under 24 hours

Interestingly, I have gotten 2 responses from different call centre agents who have priced the additional sector separately and said that the existing booking doesn't qualify as a RTW (perhaps they thought i was referring to the one world RTW, rather than the one world classic flight reward)

The third agent I got a hold of didn't dispute that the current booking met the rules but when trying to add in the sector, still repriced it at above the 318k cap.

On escalating to her supervisor, allegedly the booking doesnt "count" as a one world classic flight reward booking unless you meet (or exceed) the 318k points cap when you first make the booking.
ie. allegedly because my initial booking totaled 310k, its not a one world classic flight reward, but rather just 3 award flights.

I've not heard of this before, and I've asked to escalate + show me where this is stated on their website. They could only offer me a callback and no further escalation until the supervisor is available. I'm not hopeful they'll get back to me but wondering whether anyone has heard of this particular rule?

 

[JohnM]

Yes all transits under 24 hours

Interestingly, I have gotten 2 responses from different call centre agents who have priced the additional sector separately and said that the existing booking doesn't qualify as a RTW (perhaps they thought i was referring to the one world RTW, rather than the one world classic flight reward)

The third agent I got a hold of didn't dispute that the current booking met the rules but when trying to add in the sector, still repriced it at above the 318k cap.

On escalating to her supervisor, allegedly the booking doesnt "count" as a one world classic flight reward booking unless you meet (or exceed) the 318k points cap when you first make the booking.
ie. allegedly because my initial booking totaled 310k, its not a one world classic flight reward, but rather just 3 award flights.

I've not heard of this before, and I've asked to escalate + show me where this is stated on their website. They could only offer me a callback and no further escalation until the supervisor is available. I'm not hopeful they'll get back to me but wondering whether anyone has heard of this particular rule?

Any mention of 'RTW' in a OWA is a recipe for confusion, if not disaster, IMO.

 

[There'sOnlyOneJimmy]

On escalating to her supervisor, allegedly the booking doesnt "count" as a one world classic flight reward booking unless you meet (or exceed) the 318k points cap when you first make the booking.
ie. allegedly because my initial booking totaled 310k, its not a one world classic flight reward, but rather just 3 award flights.

That hasn’t been true in the past.
A quick look through the current T&Cs doesn’t reveal any wording to support their assertion.
And… it is completely inconsistent with the OWCA Points Table below.

 

[Lynda2475]

Usually I dont mention OWA, just call and say I want to add flights to an existing itinerary, and the cap has always kicked in when it should.

I think the agents you have been dealing with are doing something wrong, I suspect perhaps adding a classic plus seat on one or more legs, instead of a classic reward.

Last year I booked a classic reward SYD- DFW + LAX - SYD for 234.9K points. A month later I added more classic reward legs DFW-LHR + LHR-DUB + DUB-JFK + JFK-IND and saw the points cost cap out at 318k (plus the change fee of 5k).

For J rewards there should be no telephone assistance fee but you do have to pay the change fee for every change you make after ticketing.

 

[muppet]

I had an issue recently where adding a single sector well within the limits and rules added 200,000 points per person. Once I found an agent who agreed that made no sense, and actually investigated, it appeared a previous re-ticketed was done incorrectly and so the system thought I hadn’t yet paid those extra points. Once they reviewed and could see the full 318K had been taken, they were able to add comments and send off to ticketing.

Perhaps volunteer that you’ve already paid 310k points and what is system suggesting the new total should be?

 

[DC3]

On escalating to her supervisor, allegedly the booking doesnt "count" as a one world classic flight reward booking unless you meet (or exceed) the 318k points cap when you first make the booking.
ie. allegedly because my initial booking totaled 310k, its not a one world classic flight reward, but rather just 3 award flights.

Definitely a case of HUACA, fast. Unfortunately, talking to the wrong people. Basically, time-wasters.

 

[Jacques Vert]

Yes all transits under 24 hours

Interestingly, I have gotten 2 responses from different call centre agents who have priced the additional sector separately and said that the existing booking doesn't qualify as a RTW (perhaps they thought i was referring to the one world RTW, rather than the one world classic flight reward)

The third agent I got a hold of didn't dispute that the current booking met the rules but when trying to add in the sector, still repriced it at above the 318k cap.

On escalating to her supervisor, allegedly the booking doesnt "count" as a one world classic flight reward booking unless you meet (or exceed) the 318k points cap when you first make the booking.
ie. allegedly because my initial booking totaled 310k, its not a one world classic flight reward, but rather just 3 award flights.

I've not heard of this before, and I've asked to escalate + show me where this is stated on their website. They could only offer me a callback and no further escalation until the supervisor is available. I'm not hopeful they'll get back to me but wondering whether anyone has heard of this particular rule?

As others have said, that response is rubbish. Do you know which call centre you have got through to? I'm not sure what status you have, if any, but if you are talking to anywhere other than Hobart or Auckland, you are likely to get agents who have no idea how to do these bookings. Not all the time, but most of the time. Do you know someone who is WP that you can get to ring on your behalf and then hand the phone over? (Assuming they get through to Hobart.)

 

[kenjicult]

As others have said, that response is rubbish. Do you know which call centre you have got through to? I'm not sure what status you have, if any, but if you are talking to anywhere other than Hobart or Auckland, you are likely to get agents who have no idea how to do these bookings. Not all the time, but most of the time. Do you know someone who is WP that you can get to ring on your behalf and then hand the phone over? (Assuming they get through to Hobart.)

Not sure which call centre the first two times. The third time was Fiji with someone actually very helpful. Despite the supervisor being on another planet, the operator eventually called back, asked me to ignore everything she had told me up to that point. Then apologised that there had been so much confusion.

A second supervisor had by this point allegedly looked into the case and determined that the initial ticket was ticketed incorrectly (much like someone else's scenario above). They were going to now escalate to the team in order to get the itinerary properly priced; thereafter allowing sector additions within the one world pricing rules. Promised a call back again.

Interestingly she also asked me to guide them to the page which "states that the maximum points charge will be 318k per person". So after some faffing about and verbally helping her navigate to the terms and conditions page on Qantas' own website.. eventually made some progress on explaining the case.

Even if this works out, already dreading adding the last sector

Unfortunately only silver so no not getting much love with the call centre routing. Don't have any contacts in high status places either.. but.. hopefully have some updates soon.

Appreciate the help!

 

[Jacques Vert]

As MF once said, "Life wasn't meant to be easy".

 

[DC3]

… she also asked me to guide them to the page which "states that the maximum points charge will be 318k per person". So after some faffing about and verbally helping her navigate to the terms and conditions page on Qantas' own website …

Sad, sad, sad.

 

[Jacques Vert]

Sad, sad, sad.

I agree however there is also something to be said for an agent who is totally honest. If an agent were to say something like "I'm new here and I've never done one of these bookings before, can you help me by ....", I can live with that. It's the ones who are totally out of their depth and insist on giving false answers or refuse to listen that are the real problems IMHO.

 

[kenjicult]

Quick update while I'm on hold (now with the supervisor at the Fiji call centre).

The latest 2 issues they "identified" with my booking that makes it "not a one world award" is that

1. I start and end the current itinerary in a different city - I immediately told them they must be looking at the wrong rules since 14.4.3 states it's allowed

Frequent Flyer Terms and Conditions | Qantas

These Terms and Conditions form the basis of Qantas Frequent Flyer, to protect both Members and the Qantas Group.

www.qantas.com

Then after 2 hours they called back saying it's actually a different reason:

2. I have more than one stop over in a city since I come into JFK and leave from EWR. I must admit I lost my cool a little at this point. I forced them to define which city JFK and EWR belong to and brought them to 14.4.4. Its 1 stop over in New York City.

At this point she saw what I meant and told me for some reason the itinerary was still repricing at 100k points above the 636k total.

@Thomas088 had helpfully sent that screenshot of a separate multi-city booking with the exact same flights capping at 318k pp. so I know that these 4 segments are valid under the one world classic flight rewards rules as a zone 10 itinerary.

Now it's just become less about the flights and more about proving them wrong. On hold still..

 

[DC3]

Quick update while I'm on hold (now with the supervisor at the Fiji call centre).

The latest 2 issues they "identified" with my booking that makes it "not a one world award" is that

1. I start and end the current itinerary in a different city …
2. I have more than one stop over in a city since I come into JFK and leave from EWR …

Words fail me

 

[kenjicult]

Words fail me

It's gotten somewhat worse..
After another 90 minute hold, the supervisor has gotten back to me stating she has received advice. The advice puts my jaw on the floor and I ask to speak to her supervisor (not really sure how else to escalate at this point).

So according to their interpretation of 14.4.3 (...itineraries finishing in a port other than the port of origin must include the distance to return directly to the port of origin when calculating the number of Qantas Points required to redeem the Flight Reward and the maximum distance for the Itinerary), the alleged issue with my current booking is that the last leg of my journey isnt.. get this.. the maximum distance of the itinerary - i.e. 35000 miles.

At this point it really dawned on me that they had no idea what they were doing. I asked them to tell me what flight will take me that distance given I could go around the world more than once with that distance.

As an aside, disappointingly, she said that when she recreates my current itinerary in a new booking, it doesn't price it at 318k pp but as separate flights. I am sure she would have gone wrong at some step, but she was adamant they were the exact same flights in the itinerary.

Obviously after the 35000 mile final leg comment, I asked to escalate further.
I am now at the most senior supervisor of the Fiji call centre who can also not tell me in what manner the booking fails to meet the oneworld classic flight rewards criteria; just that the system is recognising them as separate classic flight rewards and my itinerary doesn't have the unique "tag" that says its a OWA. I have now requested further escalation which will be to the Hobart call centre - although she still cannot get someone from Hobart to talk to me directly. The only assurance I have that I don't have to have all these conversations again are the notes on my file (which I cant see) and the call logs (which I can't hear).

I have been tempted to HUACA constantly but if I keep getting entry level agents and it really is a "system" problem at the initial ticketing phase, I am not hopeful I'll get any further than I have thus far.

I have confirmed that my existing ticketed bookings will not be altered and she will take the segment I want to add off the inventory. Scheduled in a time for a callback tomorrow where apparently from now on I will only speak to a manager since it's been escalated by a manager - watch this space.

I think I might put in a complaint so I can also attach the recreated itinerary showing 318k max. I think my call log is at least 8 hours across 4 calls including hold time to (not yet) add this one segment. For my peace of mind, I asked her to guarantee that none of the existing ticketed bookings will be cancelled or changed whilst this all goes on.

 

[Kerrodt]

Quick update while I'm on hold (now with the supervisor at the Fiji call centre).

The latest 2 issues they "identified" with my booking that makes it "not a one world award" is that

1. I start and end the current itinerary in a different city - I immediately told them they must be looking at the wrong rules since 14.4.3 states it's allowed

Frequent Flyer Terms and Conditions | Qantas

These Terms and Conditions form the basis of Qantas Frequent Flyer, to protect both Members and the Qantas Group.

www.qantas.com

Then after 2 hours they called back saying it's actually a different reason:

2. I have more than one stop over in a city since I come into JFK and leave from EWR. I must admit I lost my cool a little at this point. I forced them to define which city JFK and EWR belong to and brought them to 14.4.4. Its 1 stop over in New York City.

At this point she saw what I meant and told me for some reason the itinerary was still repricing at 100k points above the 636k total.

@Thomas088 had helpfully sent that screenshot of a separate multi-city booking with the exact same flights capping at 318k pp. so I know that these 4 segments are valid under the one world classic flight rewards rules as a zone 10 itinerary.

Now it's just become less about the flights and more about proving them wrong. On hold still..

I thought that the system automatically capped out at 318k points and did not require operator intervention to cap the points.

If this is correct then there must be something wrong in the existing booking that is throwing it out on the OWA parameters.

 

[Kerrodt]

After your last chapter, I think you should be sending an email off to the rewards escalation email address. It seems to resolve these complex issues quite promptly and puts the case in the hands on skilled and knowledgeable operators on these reward bookings.

[email protected]

 

[Mwenenzi]

2. I have more than one stop over in a city since I come into JFK and leave from EWR. I must admit I lost my cool a little at this point. I forced them to define which city JFK and EWR belong to and brought them to 14.4.4. Its 1 stop over in New York City.

JFK is in New York (city & state)
EWR is over the river in the State of New Jersey. Not in New York city

EWR) is a major international airport serving the New York metropolitan area. The airport straddles the boundary between the cities of Newark in Essex County and Elizabeth in Union County, in the U.S. state of New Jersey

Was a time airlines recognised "co terminals", but far less now. The introduction on e-tickets did change some things.

QF need a dedicated team with deep knowledge of the Oneworld Classic award and the Oneworld cash paid *ONE* detailed rules, and knowledge of airports around world, for these more complex tickets. Not some random unskilled phone operator who happens to answer a call. The amount of rework on these more complex tickets will be increasing Qantas costs.

Hope you get it fixed.