Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

[erkpod]

Where's Medhead gone I miss his totally unbiased impartial comments

He was part of the AFF SIN lounge recon team this weekend.

 

[Skyring]

It seems that the KR supporters are getting more strident every day as the polls seem to go against them. And in trying to turn the tide, don't realise it won't happen by being unrelentlessly negative, or calling people names.

The government has to win seats just to stay even, with two Independents and Craig Thomson leaving. And a disastrous few years in office to get over.

That's why Rudd chose "A New Way" as his slogan.

But, goddammit, there's been precious little that's new and inspiring about the Labor message. The one thing - the only thing - that was both has now been quietly dumped. Kevin Rudd is no longer making any noise about marriage equality.

 

[Skyring]

Then why was Prince Harry chastised in dressing in a naz_ costume?

There are always people who are going to be outraged by something. If we had had Julie Bishop as PM, then there wouldn't be just one or two larrikins waving signs. There would be dozens, all waving the same sign and wearing t-shirts. Led by Opposition Leader Rudd.

No, of course there was nothing sinister about a class display on leaders of WW2. I made the point precisely to highlight the similarity to the other incident that so deeply and stridently offended Julia Gillard. Nobody imagines that singling out Hitler from a school project display of Roosevelt, Churchill, Macarthur, Monty and Rommel means that Rudd is a naz_.

Though now I think on it...

 

[amaroo]

It's kinda fun to see old bedfellows fighting Labor threatens action over Adam Bandt's 'false' claims

Joined at the hip for best part of three years - 2 months spitting at each other - join up again to continue the love-in.

 

[ozbeachbabe]

The following email is doing the rounds so I'll post for the benefit of those who may not have seen it.

From a retired ex RAAF Wing Commander

KRUDD & the first shiela's trip to Afghanistan via a RAAF KC30-A.A330Tanker was specifically tasked for just him, wife & media visit to Afghanistan . The trip went via Perth and was a very quick over & back task.

What a complete waste of taxpayer funds for a photo op with the troops, when we have a massive cutback in defence spending.

This trip will not have come out of No 34 VIP Squadrons funding for Prime Ministerial travel. The KC30-A Tanker belongs & fundingexpenditure is allocated by No 33 Squadron at Amberley.

In effect he is stealing funding from defence operations for his own political purposes. Is there no end to this prick's selfishness, self aggrandisement, waste and contempt to the Armed Services and the Australian Tax Payer?

And this while most of my retired military friends are living impoverished lives on their Labor Party deliberately reduced (DefenceForces Retirement Benefit Fund) superannuation indexation. In mycaseit is minus $550 a fortnight since I retired and I was a WingCommander. Most of the retired guys were Warrant Officers or lesser ranks and really struggling after serving their country all their working lives.

It's a bloody disgrace! About $560 million would repay it all backwhich is about a week's worth of illegal immigrants under Rudd!

P.S. Please pass this on to all your friends, they all need to know before 7 September!

 

[medhead]

The following email is doing the rounds so I'll post for the benefit of those who may not have seen it.



View attachment 18392

I have to call shenanigans on his pension based on the name quoted. Specifically the use of the work indexation suggests that the indexation of the benefits has been reduced. So his benefit has NOT be reduced just the rate of indexation each year.

 

[Pushka]

I have to call shenanigans on his pension based on the name quoted. Specifically the use of the work indexation suggests that the indexation of the benefits has been reduced. So his benefit has NOT be reduced just the rate of indexation each year.

Their pension doesnt seem all that pleasant.

According to the latest June 2011 figures, the average weekly Military Retirement superannuation pension was LESS than the Henderson Poverty Line:
Average ADF DFRB/DFRDB superannuation pension (weekly for a couple) was $448.25 ($23,309 pa)
Henderson Poverty Line June 2011 (weekly for a couple) was $512.80 ($26,665 pa)
Age Pension September 2011 (weekly for a couple) $519.40 ($27,008 pa - excludes pension supplement if eligible of + $1,555 pa)

 

[medhead]

Their pension doesnt seem all that pleasant.

According to the latest June 2011 figures, the average weekly Military Retirement superannuation pension was LESS than the Henderson Poverty Line:
Average ADF DFRB/DFRDB superannuation pension (weekly for a couple) was $448.25 ($23,309 pa)
Henderson Poverty Line June 2011 (weekly for a couple) was $512.80 ($26,665 pa)
Age Pension September 2011 (weekly for a couple) $519.40 ($27,008 pa - excludes pension supplement if eligible of + $1,555 pa)

Whether they get paid rubbish or not. The defined benefit can't really reduce as claimed.

Worth noting that is an average, that will be highly dependant of the amount the members have put into their superfunds for those not in the defined benefit scheme. would be good to see the average pension for defined benefit members.

Also interesting that he claims they have taken more money away from him than the average paid.

 

[eastwest101]

Very complicated set of Pension schemes - for those whom are interested - this APH Parlimentary Research Paper is pretty comprehensive:

Military superannuation myths and reality – Parliament of Australia

 

[medhead]

I see that Abbott has made his PPL scheme a core policy of his platform. That he views his win as clear support for the PPL scheme by the voters. Seems that a vote for Abbott is a vote for financially irresponsible middle class welfare. Take note all those who will vote for Abbott but claim not to support his policy. Maybe you might follow the courage of your convictions and vote 1 for the ALP so that PPL can be blocked in the senate.

But then I doubt rusted on Abbott supporters have convictions.

 

[Pushka]

When Ms Gillard went to Afghanistan, she was saluted. She thought that this was nice. However, when in a war zone, you never salute the Chief of Staff. To do so tells all and sundry that there is a giant target!

<snip>

But then I doubt rusted on Abbott supporters have convictions.

You see, it's these nasty little add ons that just aren't necessary.

 

[drsmithy]

The following email is doing the rounds so I'll post for the benefit of those who may not have seen it.

I look forward to a similarly scathing criticism from the same person whenever Abbot visits the troops.

Anyone else find it surprising a senior retired military officer didn't put his name on his opinion ?

 

[eastwest101]

I see that Abbott has made his PPL scheme a core policy of his platform. That he views his win as clear support for the PPL scheme by the voters. Seems that a vote for Abbott is a vote for financially irresponsible middle class welfare. Take note all those who will vote for Abbott but claim not to support his policy. Maybe you might follow the courage of your convictions and vote 1 for the ALP so that PPL can be blocked in the senate.

The problem with that theory is that those whom don't like the Coalitions current PPL would then vote 1 for the ALP in the senate, but then may find that all the other coalition policies are blocked in the Senate by the ALP and Greens..... Tony Abbott has already made it clear that the Carbon Tax/ETS is being scrapped, so it depends on the make up of the senate and what the ALP chooses to do about the Carbon Tax/ETS if they are in opposition after the election.

So by voting Lib in the lower house and ALP in the Senate it would seem that you're either voting for no change or some watered down version/change of existing laws, or you are voting for another election.....

 

[medhead]

Very complicated set of Pension schemes - for those whom are interested - this APH Parlimentary Research Paper is pretty comprehensive:

Military superannuation myths and reality – Parliament of Australia

Interesting reading. Basically he is whinging about something that was done by the Fraser government, which did not decrease the pension paid anyway.

 

[amaroo]

I see that Abbott has made his PPL scheme a core policy of his platform. That he views his win as clear support for the PPL scheme by the voters. Seems that a vote for Abbott is a vote for financially irresponsible middle class welfare. Take note all those who will vote for Abbott but claim not to support his policy. Maybe you might follow the courage of your convictions and vote 1 for the ALP so that PPL can be blocked in the senate.

But then I doubt rusted on Abbott supporters have convictions.

Wiping a party because you don't agree with every policy - don't think so. You'd end up voting for nobody.....or fringe lunatics....

Taking a wider view on things seems the logical way to go........balance, collective good etc.

 

[footy99]

Wiping a party because you don't agree with every policy - don't think so. You'd end up voting for nobody.....or fringe lunatics....

Taking a wider view on things seems the logical way to go........balance, collective good etc.

Voting for nobody has worked great for me since conveniently 'forgetting' to enrol in my youth. Certainly one of my better decisions at the time.

 

[medhead]

The problem with that theory is that those whom don't like the Coalitions current PPL would then vote 1 for the ALP in the senate, but then may find that all the other coalition policies are blocked in the Senate by the ALP and Greens..... Tony Abbott has already made it clear that the Carbon Tax/ETS is being scrapped, so it depends on the make up of the senate and what the ALP chooses to do about the Carbon Tax/ETS if they are in opposition after the election.

So by voting Lib in the lower house and ALP in the Senate it would seem that you're either voting for no change or some watered down version/change of existing laws, or you are voting for another election.....

Well an interesting outline. Shame you've ignored the key point. Abbott has clearly stated that PPL is a core policy. A major element of his platform. A policy that is a major threat to government dent levels and continuing deficit. This raises my existing question. How can anyone who who claims to oppose deficits and debt and also claims to oppose the PPL policy support Abbott? How can they ignore the threat to government debt? Debt levels that are calculated to be greater than those of the ALP.

It seems they can only do that via the hypocrisy that not all debt is bad. Yet these people have been banging on, ranting and foaming at the mouth and government debt and deficit. Yet that all goes away when Abbott proposes the even bigger debt. When Abbott wouldn't even real ease his coatings. It seems some people have built their houses on sand.

 

[medhead]

Wiping a party because you don't agree with every policy - don't think so. You'd end up voting for nobody.....or fringe lunatics....

Taking a wider view on things seems the logical way to go........balance, collective good etc.

Right so you're backing away from your previous rants about debt and deficit. Good to see you final acknowledge the error in your previous position. Can you finally acknowledge that you vote for the coalition blindly without even considering party policy.

In any case, this is a core Abbott policy not a random minor policy. Abbott is nailing his flag to the PPL mast head.

 

[eastwest101]

Interesting reading. Basically he is wringing about something that was done by the Fraser government, which did not decrease the pension paid anyway.

Bit of selective reading there? Even with my cursory reading of that report I note that the Hawke Government did this:

The Superannuation and Other Benefits Legislation Amendment Act 1986 amended the legislation governing the operation of both the DFRDB and DFRB from the payday of 23 October, 1986 to discount the 1986 pension increase by 2 per cent from 9.2 per cent to 7.2 per cent.[38] This policy continued till 20 October, 1989 (that is, the full CPI increases were not passed on to DFRDB pensioners). There was no later increase in the DFRDB pension to make up for this period of discounting.


So yes - governments of both political flavours have fiddled with these schemes over the years......

 

[amaroo]

Voting for nobody has worked great for me since conveniently 'forgetting' to enrol in my youth. Certainly one of my better decisions at the time.

I'm a keen voter - like to get involved.