Potential QF9 fuel stop in Singapore?

[SeatBackForward]

To the tune of hundreds of seats per day?

Not one Indian airline is doing well, and you think they'd have the best chance in their own market.

They haven't figured out how to make horns on planes audible, watch out once they figure that out..

 

[Quickstatus]

The banking/IT market is changing though.

You would think that on the same / similar assumptions that SYD-PEK would also do well.

 

[Mattg]

Qantas has updated their media release to remove references to QF9 stopping in Singapore. It appears they are going for the option of offloading passengers in Perth and continuing to fly PER-LHR non-stop, albeit with an extra 40-50 minutes of flight time.

From a purely operational perspective, I imagine it would be cheaper in terms of fuel costs etc. to operate PER-SIN-LHR than PER-LHR - and you don't have to offload passengers, then either. But stopping in Singapore also creates its own challenges and extra costs, such as the need for two sets of crew and the potential issue of slots at LHR if flights are re-timed on a more permanent basis. It would also be more difficult for QF to command a price premium from J pax if the PER-LHR flight is no longer non-stop.

 

[Quickstatus]

how would offloading passengers in PER solve the problem?. Each day more passengers would be offloaded. Where would they go? PER-SIN in a 737?
Wouldn’t it be better to send some MEL pax via SIN?

 

[Daver6]

Qantas has updated their media release to remove references to QF9 stopping in Singapore. It appears they are going for the option of offloading passengers in Perth and continuing to fly PER-LHR non-stop, albeit with an extra 40-50 minutes of flight time.

Flight status on the QF website still shows the same departure time from PER and arrival into LHR for today's flight. That doesn't match the flight taking a longer path.

Any word on how far in advance they're notifying customers who are being bumped?

how would offloading passengers in PER solve the problem?. Each day more passengers would be offloaded. Where would they go? PER-SIN in a 737?
Wouldn’t it be better to send some MEL pax via SIN?

You'd expect they'll put some of the Y folks starting in MEL on the MEL-SIN-LHR flight. People starting in PER you'd expect to be put on QF72 (A330) to SIN to meet up with the SIN-LHR flights. They might also decide to bump some PER folks onto EK perhaps?

 

[DC3]

To the tune of hundreds of seats per day?

Not one Indian airline is doing well, and you think they'd have the best chance in their own market.

Air India, anyone?

 

[Quickstatus]

Flight status on the QF website still shows the same departure time from PER and arrival into LHR for today's flight. That doesn't match the flight taking a longer path.

Any word on how far in advance they're notifying customers who are being bumped?

the schedules times don’t change. Recent northern routings avoiding Iranian airspace have added 30min to the elapsed time.



You'd expect they'll put some of the Y folks starting in MEL on the MEL-SIN-LHR flight. People starting in PER you'd expect to be put on QF72 (A330) to SIN to meet up with the SIN-LHR flights. They might also decide to bump some PER folks onto EK perhaps?

what happens to the “premium” that the “9” passengers would have paid?

 

[defurax]

Yes but what happens to the “premium” that the “9” passengers would have paid?

I guess the usual: aircraft, seat, schedule not guaranteed

 

[Mattg]

what happens to the “premium” that the “9” passengers would have paid?

I agree that I would be annoyed if I'd paid a premium to fly on QF9 and ended up on something else. However, I cannot fault the "safety first" approach.

 

[Daver6]

You'd think you'd be entitled to a refund if you were bumped to a one stopper and wanted to cancel.

 

[Quickstatus]

You'd think you'd be entitled to a refund if you were bumped to a one stopper and wanted to cancel.

Or from a 1 stopper to a 2 stopper (MEL) .
The CEO has consistently said passengers will pay a premium to reduce the number of stops. So prima facie, if the number of stops increase then a refund of sports is fair. However based on previous incidents where a J-Y downgraded passenger did not get a fair refund, I doubt if a refund will work unless the passenger is happy to contend with the airline in court.

 

[sudoer]

I would really think Qantas could do quite well by re-introducing SYD-BOM if they can hammer out an agreement with a local carrier for codeshare connections. The best-run domestic carrier by far at the moment is Indigo, but I as an LCC they may be quite resistant to codeshares.

OT but I would have thought SYD-CMB to be a viable option - UL can handle the connections into DEL, BOM, HYD, MAA, BLR and a handful more

UL's MEL-CMB route supposedly does quite well with >90% load factors so there is existing demand, and CMB could work as a good connecting point for ports which are currently awkward/impossible to book through QF, like MLE, SEZ, DOH, LHE, KHI or even AUH.

 

[jpp42]

OT but I would have thought SYD-CMB to be a viable option - UL can handle the connections into DEL, BOM, HYD, MAA, BLR and a handful more

UL's MEL-CMB route supposedly does quite well with >90% load factors so there is existing demand, and CMB could work as a good connecting point for ports which are currently awkward/impossible to book through QF, like MLE, SEZ, DOH, LHE, KHI or even AUH.

Not sure the rules about going off-topic here, but yes I agree that would be reasonable. I have taken the MEL-CMB route and UL is decent for on-board service especially in J, considerably better than international Indian carriers say, AI or 9W (when it existed!). They seem to have decently appointed newer A330's. The CMB-MEL departure is timed well for connections from India, but since I'm SYD based, I've generally avoided it just to avoid the extra MEL-SYD hop.

Biggest problem is the facilities at CMB - the terminal probably needs a wholesale replacement, like the major Indian cities have done. The paid food options are abominable. And someone needs to tell UL that their Oneworld lounge is a disgrace. The fact that they don't even allow OWE's into a business lounge (not even talking first class), when one does exist, is unacceptable and they need some kind of sanctions from OW on this.

 

[BD1959]

And someone needs to tell UL that their Oneworld lounge is a disgrace. The fact that they don't even allow OWE's into a business lounge (not even talking first class), when one does exist, is unacceptable and they need some kind of sanctions from OW on this.

OW would be better suited getting QR sorted on this front first, then using the business case to pull UL up to standard. (Almost back on topic for UK travel ... !! ) I've previously looked at using UL for UK trips but balked at the transit times in CMB.

Regards,

BD

 

[Kangol]

I wonder how they choose which pax to offload - cheapest tickets?!

SYD/BNE pax going to LHR being switched to services via QF1/SIN?
I don't know how many in that category exist to begin with...

 

[Melburnian1]

So according to EF QF9 left PER today with 99 empty seats. Don't know if this was the current loading or if PAX had to be offloaded. Once flew QF9 on the A380 with 30 PAX in Y.

I checked EF for Saturday 11 January ex PER for QF9 to LHR.

The J seat map was not displaying, but in W there were five out of 28 seats blocked, and in whY there were about 35 seats blocked.

For the Sunday night flight, more seats were blocked - from memory, about 50 in total.

However neither shows anything near the '90 seats unavailable' claimed by QFi spokesmen, so I am mystified.

Whatever, QF9 must now be unprofitable.

Publicity about seat numbers being reduced may decrease bookings (although granted there's a lead time of at least three months for many international air bookings).

I have discussed the QF9/unaffected re seat reduction but still diverted via Afghanistan QF10 further at:

Qantas Delays/Cancellations

On Qantas' flight status page on its website, Monday 1 July 2013's QF9 from Melbourne to Dubai and London Heathrow is shown as delayed from its usual departure of 1525 hours to 0730 on Tuesday 2 July, meaning an arrival at LHR at about 2145 on Tuesday night local time if it manages to get away...

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

My experience with EF is that it routinely underestimates the number of booked passengers regardless of carrier.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The bumping probably won't make much difference to QF's PR... those bumped are prolly going to be economy class pax. And the ones left in economy will probably have some sort of high status and be happy to have a whole row to stretch out in. Those bumped without status get to fly via Singapore and get more status credits and points. Winners all round?

 

[bryanjones]

The bumping probably won't make much difference to QF's PR... those bumped are prolly going to be economy class pax. And the ones left in economy will probably have some sort of high status and be happy to have a whole row to stretch out in. Those bumped without status get to fly via Singapore and get more status credits and points. Winners all round?

I am on tonight’s QF9 out of PER after coming across from Sydney. No QF person has mentioned anything yet, will report back after I land in LHR to see if there are any noticeable dips in pax numbers or any type of announcement on the flight

 

[downgraded]

I checked EF for Saturday 11 January ex PER for QF9 to LHR.

The J seat map was not displaying, but in W there were five out of 28 seats blocked, and in whY there were about 35 seats blocked.

For the Sunday night flight, more seats were blocked - from memory, about 50 in total.

However neither shows anything near the '90 seats unavailable' claimed by QFi spokesmen, so I am mystified.

Whatever, QF9 must now be unprofitable.

Publicity about seat numbers being reduced may decrease bookings (although granted there's a lead time of at least three months for many international air bookings).

I have discussed the QF9/unaffected re seat reduction but still diverted via Afghanistan QF10 further at:

Qantas Delays/Cancellations

On Qantas' flight status page on its website, Monday 1 July 2013's QF9 from Melbourne to Dubai and London Heathrow is shown as delayed from its usual departure of 1525 hours to 0730 on Tuesday 2 July, meaning an arrival at LHR at about 2145 on Tuesday night local time if it manages to get away...

www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au

My experience with EF is that it routinely underestimates the number of booked passengers regardless of carrier.

Blocked seats aren't an indication of what's available to sell/sold, they just indicate where the airline is controlling seat selection.

 

[p--and--t]

Air India, anyone?

Off topic: But Indian nationals that used to work for me as contractors refused to travel on any India based airline and when periodically returning home or bringing relatives out to join them usually travelled via SQ and were prepared to wait long SIN transit times to get home rather than use the alternatives.