Premium Economy. Why?

[serfty]

Welcome to AFF both of you.

PE in BA has traditionally been standard Economy service with a slightly bigger seat. (Y+)

QF PE has been a reduced Business class service with a bigger (than Economy) seat. (J-)

 

[justin23]

Like many others I fail to see the value in Y+, I'd use it if it was cheaper and I think most people would be happy to pay 25%-50% more for the legroom, but same economy service.

Having flown Y, Y+ and J now on long haul, I fail to see real value in any of the premium classes, probably because Y is often discounted so much. I'd much rather fly J, just can't justify the cost to myself, especially when my long haul travel is all leisure.

That said I think more people would fly wants, if the economy stood out from the rest. As it is they own ~20% of the international market in and out of Australia, and this is where they are losing money.

Id love to see maybe some kind of double bunk bed like they have in trains in Y+.

 

[Sonny1933]

Apart from the legroom with Qantas PE there definately is much better food then Economy - unlike BA - and the service with champagne etc we always have found to be tops

 

[nonscenic]

I flew Y+ last year for work, QF MEL-LAX and return. Work policy is to fly Y+ and J only if Y+ is not available, for journeys over 8 hours. Y+ seemed to meet most of the needs apart from a flat bed, compared to cattle class. My long distance leisure trips have all been Y class. Having long (limb) legs on long (flight sector) :!:legs makes Y agony for me so the legroom was the main feature I needed.

 

[Jurahn]

We've just returned from our first PE "experience" PER-LAX return - we also debated whether it was worth the cost but decided to give it a try.

To give some background, neither OH or I enjoy flying AT ALL, it's simply a necessary evil to get from A to B and unless we win Lotto (we pay for all our own travel), there's no way we can afford to pay to fly J or F in this lifetime!! So that means always being stuck back in cattle class, and after some horrendous flights with Emirates a couple of years ago between Perth and Dubai as part of a Europe trip), when we were were looking at our first trip to the US we decided to try ANYTHING that would make the flights more tolerable, especially as we both suffer from motion sickness (thank goodness for Stemetil - I still can't read on flights though, even if I take meds). Previously have never had any status with any airline (not enough flights), but have just hit Velocity Silver with this trip.

We booked PE with V and had 737-800 flights between PER-BNE and SYD-PER. We were seated in the new business class seats (Row 1 outbound, Row 2 inbound). Service on both flights was fantastic, the crew simply couldn't do enough for us. Also had Lounge access in Perth and Sydney (an absolutely lifesaver on the return trip as I wasn't well, and we had a 6-hour wait in Sydney). When we booked, VA's website stated that if you booked PE on an international flight, you would be seated in PE (where possible) on domestic DJ flights. I'm assuming this will change for future domestic flights now that PE is being replaced by business class on all flights between Perth and the East Coast. Will be interested to see what happens there.

BNE-LAX and LAX-SYD were both of course on the VA 777 - PE cabin was only about half full on both legs (19 pax on the way out, 16 on the way back), so plenty of opportunity to move around and spread out around the cabin a bit - seats were wider, legroom was much better, so was the recline (although neither of us can ever sleep on a plane anyway) and we found the cabin much quieter than economy (noise cancelling headsets also a bonus), so overall a much better comfort level. Also two toilets just for our cabin, so never had to queue!! Service was much better than economy, called by name by cabin staff and they took our preferences prior to the meal service to make sure we could get our first choice. No international lounge access at BNE or LAX (no status), although it looks like this may change, according to the Virgin website - it appears PE pax will get a one-off invitation for lounge access on the day of departure. It would have been great to have this when we travelled, as we had considerable wait times in both airports. We ended up buying day passes to the Alaska Airlines Boardroom in LAX T3 - $45 each, so on the $$$ side, especially as I don't drink alcohol and OH hardly ever does, but at least it was somewhere quiet out of the T3 "zoo", and we were able to get cups of tea/coffee and a few snacks, although the food selection was very limited, and had somewhere to stretch out and relax a bit.

So overall, was PE worth it? In our opinion, YES, absolutely, although I do have to state we got these flights as a sale fare (there's no way we would/could pay full PE fares for long-haul flights as we're simply not in a financial position to do so) and if we could get similar sale fares, we would have no hesitation whatsoever in flying PE with Virgin again - whilst I still couldn't call the flights enjoyable LOL, it certainly made them much more tolerable, service and lounge access for the domestic flights (for those of us not used to these sorts of "perks") made a huge difference, as did the better level of room, comfort and service on the international legs. There was also the added bonus of being able to get off the plane much more quickly and get ahead of the crowd for customs, immigration etc. For us, all of this made the extra cost more than worth it and it has also given us the opportunity to start racking up some extra points & SCs that might actually count for something if we can squeeze in some more travel in the not too distant future!

 

[Per_Travels]

Apart from the legroom with Qantas PE there definately is much better food then Economy - unlike BA - and the service with champagne etc we always have found to be tops

I think this is the bit that I don't get about PE - I see the cost of the seat to be almost solely related to the amount of space that you get and I couldn't really care less about the food and wine. In Y I get very little space in Y+ I get fractionally more space at more than twice the price and in J I get umpteen times the space for about 4 times the Y price. Hence as someone who generally travels long haul for business my choices are:

fly Y and feel like rubbish at the far end
fly Y+ and feel like rubbish at the far end
fly J and head into work at the far end feeling ok

Having said this I can see that those members who are either taller or wider than me may see more benefit.

When flying long haul with the family (i.e. I'm paying) it's always Y (call me a cheapskate if you will)

 

[drsmithy]

Welcome to AFF both of you.

PE in BA has traditionally been standard Economy service with a slightly bigger seat. (Y+)

QF PE has been a reduced Business class service with a bigger (than Economy) seat. (J-)

I've flown both. QF's is unquestionably better, but I'm prepared to pay (though less than QF) for BA's as well - again, because my primary interest is in the hard product.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

the main issue is... and this IS supposed to be a frequent flyer forum... is that why would anyone fly premium economy when you can fly business class using US airways miles or British midland miles or AA miles (all of which can be purchased) for less than the price of premium economy? in fact you could fly first class for less than premium economy (however, not really applicable to flights ex Australia to the USA as availability is extremely tight... but to Europe or Asia it's usually wide open and on any date you want even peak periods such as Chinese new year and Christmas).

again, why would anyone fly premium economy when you can sometimes get a combined economy fare to Asia followed by full business class (with complete lie flat seats) for much the same price as premium economy anyway?

for USA flights, premium economy doesn't make much sense to me when for an additional three hour stopover in Fiji you can fly bushiness class on air pacific for around AUD3000 return.

I think there are so many better value options than premium economy out there.

 

[monoccular]

At 195cm for a long haul I find the extra leg room, and the fact that you don't have to share an armrest with the often oversized blob next to you makes it worthwhile. The food service choice is, to me, a bit if an added bonus but not the key attraction. I don't sleep well in flight so the extra for a modern flat seat business to me is not worth the extra.

 

[drsmithy]

the main issue is... and this IS supposed to be a frequent flyer forum... is that why would anyone fly premium economy when you can fly business class using US airways miles or British midland miles or AA miles (all of which can be purchased) for less than the price of premium economy? in fact you could fly first class for less than premium economy (however, not really applicable to flights ex Australia to the USA as availability is extremely tight... but to Europe or Asia it's usually wide open and on any date you want even peak periods such as Chinese new year and Christmas).

again, why would anyone fly premium economy when you can sometimes get a combined economy fare to Asia followed by full business class (with complete lie flat seats) for much the same price as premium economy anyway?

for USA flights, premium economy doesn't make much sense to me when for an additional three hour stopover in Fiji you can fly bushiness class on air pacific for around AUD3000 return.

I think there are so many better value options than premium economy out there.

I hear this sort of thing all the time, but then when I actually go looking, I can never find these deals (at least not when I want to fly).

 

[Sonny1933]

I cannot quite follow why BA PE when it is accepted QF is better - what is the "hard" product ?
I must confess that whilst one hears of ultra cheap fares and the ability to buy points - just how and where do you find this ?

 

[Air Chef]

Not a bad concept really...... now if only QF had the balls like it did in 1979, to introduce something as radical as this, they just might pull themselves out of the very deep hole they find themselves in.

I doubt you will find "Any Balls" in QF Management these days.!!!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

the ability to buy US airways points has been around since 2009, with promotions for 100% bonus miles running pretty much every single month (the only exception was October, November this year, but the deal is back in again now).

buying miles through that promotion gave fares of around AUD2000 to Europe, with availability pretty much wide open on every day of the year on Thai right the way throng to Europe.

the deal has been discussed extensively here in AFF.

 

[darrend]

What I currently do is buy 2 Y seats, which only costs you roughly 1.5 times as much, because you dont pay the taxes on the second seat, and select the A and C seats. Sometimes QF is nice enough to block the B seat meaning on flights to LHR, $3k gets me a decent rest, that you could only dream of getting in PE at $4K. And you earn double points and SC's to boot.

I like this idea - I am wondering how do you go about purchasing two seats. Can it be done on line or is it a matter of calling the relevant airline office?

 

[wilco]

I like this idea - I am wondering how do you go about purchasing two seats. Can it be done on line or is it a matter of calling the relevant airline office?

With QF, you need to do it over the phone and tell them you'd like to book an extra seat for your own comfort.

 

[JWelsh]

I haven't travelled Y for 20 years, but thought I would give Y+ a try on a QF flight from Lax to Syd,,,,, it was the worst flight experience I have ever had!
The seat pitch was insufficient for me to get out of my window seat when the seat in front was reclined, I could not even stand up.
The seats reclined but had no foot flap to get a push up from if I had slid down the seat while reclining. This was cruel, because after having a nice sleep after dinner - food Business Class style, I had slipped down under the seats in front and my legs were completely numb.
I swapped to an aisle seatbut the was little advantage.
The night was a constant battle between cabin staff and those people from Economy creeping into the many empty Premium Economy seats, wanting to strech out over several seats to sleep.
No No NO never again the $$$ spent & $$$ saved were not worth it!

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I like this idea - I am wondering how do you go about purchasing two seats. Can it be done on line or is it a matter of calling the relevant airline office?

nice idea to book two seats... but I can imagine the problem of trying to explain all the way to London, to the person sitting on the other side of the three seats, that they can't use the empty seat for anything and that it's all mine mine mine!!

 

[darrend]

nice idea to book two seats... but I can imagine the problem of trying to explain all the way to London, to the person sitting on the other side of the three seats, that they can't use the empty seat for anything and that it's all mine mine mine!!

Agreed - I was thinking more about the situation when one is awfully close to status and a couple of domestic "deal" flights would see you over the line. Doing it in one hop with two seats seems more appealing time wise.

Not sure I would want to be in Y all the way to London unless it was from somewhere in Europe.

 

[Bindibuys]

However, those same flights if booked now for next year would cost me $5754 return for Premium Economy. That is not worth the money. I agree this product is not worth the retail price.

.

Interesting to read all the different view points, (physical size/work pays for flight etc) of the members.

I have just booked QF PE syd/lax/syd using classic award points, so looking forward to my own experience in PE. As a "I pay for all my flights" Y has always been my choice and the cheaper the better, more money to spend at the destination, and as I can usually sleep 6-8 hours in Y the $ for upgrade have never crossed my mind.

 

[Robmn]

Interesting Thread.

On long haul having used VA to LAX JA Starclass to HNL both these are similar - in seating and food, found that JA service has declined or the last couple of years. VA - don't believe the hype on the web page its a reality check once on board never again with them sorry.

I like the legroom and just the checkin, boarding and customs express lanes all go to make a better travel experience.

I have booked my first PE on QANTAS in the A380 for next year but have bought the trip on a deal so reduced it by 20%. With all the fuss I hope I have made the right choice. Did travel at one stage in J with QANTAS when they had the old seating (2003?) and the service ran hot and cold and very dependant on the crew.

When travelling in PE I have looked down the back and noted all the people cramed into such a small space.

My best trip in Y has been down the back 747 JFK - SYD - we were checked into seats A and C, leaving the centre empty heaps of room which made it very comfortable trip. No one bothered to utilise B even when we stopped at LAX. So does this mean its not the dependant on legroom but personal space?