Qantas Delays/Cancellations

[Melburnian1]

EK operates several 777 flights and its ugly duckling sibling FDB operates 737-800 between DXB and MCT. This may alleviate the situation somewhat at MCT if QF takes the "evacuation" option and gets the passengers and crew out of MCT.

While it may raise immigration issues for some passengers, wouldn't putting them on a fleet of buses for the 400 kilometres between Muscat and Dubai be quicker? I am assuming that the road is in good condition and not heavily congested. The other airlines may not have 400 plus seats spare.

 

[Quickstatus]

I think sending its passengers by bus through the desert would be the last option. The road trip is nearly 6 hours and requires the bus to enter UAE twice and passengers required to exit the bus to do immigration checks as it leaves Oman, enters UAE, then re-enters Oman, then re-enters UAE. Practically leaving one and entering the other is not at the same checkpoint if I recall because the Omani-UAE border zigzags through the desert while the road is relatively straight in that region. QF then loses oversight of the passengers who are still under their care. Such a trip I would suggest would be really only for the intrepid.
The issue with available seats on existing commercial air services would translate to buses too.

this info from a travel blog which I can't seem to find

Edit: here it is-
http://www.travelwithpedro.com/by-bus-from-muscat-to-dubai/

 

[Himeno]

Parents got moved to QF98.

Other people at the counters were also moving to other flights (person at the next counter changing to 30 then on to HBA). It sounds like they are doing manual rebooking at the airport as people arrive instead of trying to have the computer sort it out.

 

[Flyerqf]

EK operates several 777 flights and it's ugly duckling sibling FDB operates 737-800 between DXB and MCT. This may alleviate the situation somewhat at MCT if QF takes the "evacuation" option and gets the passengers and crew out of MCT.

Or a fresh crew may be flown in from DXB. As the flight time DXB-MCT is a little over 1 hour a fresh crew could be flown in to immediately get an operable A380 out of MCT (unlike the impossible alternative of a replacement crew flown from AUS).

Is The aircraft operable and just awaiting a fresh crew?

It diverted there due to fog at DXB and then crew ran out of hours.

 

[Melburnian1]

Thanks Quickstatus. In any case the issue may have been settled as FR24 suggests A388 VH-OQB took off from MCT on 30 December 2016 at 1130, landing in DXB at 1211. The QF website, in contrast, suggests that this QF1 is still 'delayed' in MCT but shows a nominal 1035 departure time (long since passed) and then changes tack for the DXB arrival entry to suggest it 'landed' at 1211 hours. The QF website then suggests the onward, delayed QF1 will depart DXB at 1405 (instead of the normal 0240 hours) with a LHR arrival estimated at 1730 hours in the late afternoon instead of its timetabled 0640 hours morning arrival.

1730 into LHR would make an elapsed journey time of 32 hours, 48 minutes if my maths is correct. Tiring, especially in Y.

 

[Flyerqf]

While it may raise immigration issues for some passengers, wouldn't putting them on a fleet of buses for the 400 kilometres between Muscat and Dubai be quicker? I am assuming that the road is in good condition and not heavily congested. The other airlines may not have 400 plus seats spare.

They still need to get the aircraft back to Dubai so they would need a separate crew regardless.

 

[Quickstatus]

Perhaps a fresh crew (flight and cabin - I think about 20 or so in total?) flew in on EK862 arriving at MCT at 0945. That crew would then operate the DXB-LHR leg as well.

That at would be tiring in itself

The tired crew (flight and cabin) may have paxed on QF1 or on a returning EK flight ,or stayed in MCT?

I wonder if MCT is the final destination for maybe the odd passenger or two?. If so then for them at least the trip was easy. Travel tend to raise interesting and unanticipated scenarios!

 

[Melburnian1]

The Thursday 29 December QF2 ex LHR has had its expected stay in DXB on Friday 30 extended to 1330 hours. Saturday 31 December SYD arrival is predicted as 0955 instead of 0630 - 205 minutes late.

UPDATE: A388 VH-OQE as QF2 departed DXB at 1323 hours (Friday) in lieu of the timetabled 0935 hours (Thursday) with SYD arrival expected on Saturday 31 at 1000, three and a half hours (210 minutes) late.

The 'other' QF2 (the flight that departed LHR 21 minutes late at 2106 hours on Thursday 29, arriving DXB at 0816, 31 minutes late on Friday 30 has been further put back to depart DXB at an estimated 1730 hours (instead of 0935) meaning a Saturday 31 December SYD arrival at 1430 in the afternoon instead of 0600.

 

[Melburnian1]

At 2217 AEDT (1517 Middle Eastern time), it does not appear that the delayed Thursday 29 December ex SYD QF1 (A388 VH-OQB) that diverted via MCT has departed from its DXB gate.

This increases the chances of the Friday evening QF2 being delayed ex LHR. QF is still showing a departure time of 1430 hours from DXB for this late QF1.

 

[Flyerqf]

The 'other' QF2 (the flight that departed LHR 21 minutes late at 2106 hours on Thursday 29, arriving DXB at 0816, 31 minutes late on Friday 30 has been further put back to depart DXB at an estimated 1730 hours (instead of 0935) meaning a Saturday 31 December SYD arrival at 1430 in the afternoon instead of 0600.

OQF still has a fuel sensor issue that they are working to fix.

Unfortunately some passengers that were on yesterday's QF2 that was delayed until today (and has since departed) were transferred to today's QF2 as that flight was originally scheduled to leave earlier and using the same aircraft that has just arrived from London. A late change was made to send out yesterday's flight first and move today's flight to the aircraft still under maintenance, leaving the passengers that were moved stranded for a second day and presumably the flight that left wasn't full.

Put Qantas into twitter search and it will give you a flavour for the customer service on the ground at DXB. Qantas staff are apparently "non existent" and a pregnant lady has been waiting for 28 hours and because she was in economy no hotel was offered.

I wonder if the hub was still SIN whether the customer service would be so bad.

 

[Melburnian1]

Put Qantas into twitter search and it will give you a flavour for the customer service on the ground at DXB. Qantas staff are apparently "non existent" and a pregnant lady has been waiting for 28 hours and because she was in economy no hotel was offered.

I wonder if the hub was still SIN whether the customer service would be so bad.

Flyerqf, this is one example:

Stuck at DXB, 4 hour delay and counting on a @Qantas flight to Sydney and no announcements been made. Very poor customer service

A Holly Keeling sums it up:

When @emirates and @Qantas are in partnership but don't know how to communicate

 

[Melburnian1]

A388 VH-OQB on QF1, the scheduled 0240 hours DXB to LHR that was earlier diverted via MCT has just departed DXB at 1525 on Friday 30 December.

Estimated LHR arrival has become 1910 hours rather than the timetabled 0650, so the earliest QF2 tonight (Friday 30) could get away would be about 2055.

Another Twitter feed from DXB suggesting that there has been 'enhancement' of the refreshments provided during long delays (not that QF can control the weather):

Totally disgusted with Qantas at treatment of QF2 passengers in dubai, a mars bar and cup in 12 hours#SHOCKING

 

[Flyerqf]

QF2 has just been cancelled due to on going issues with A380 VH-OQF.

Edit - apparently Alan Joyce was caught up in the delays. He departed on the earlier qf2 that did leave Dubai for Sydney.

 

[jb747]

Is DXB capable of autoland in fog?

Dubai is capable of low vis operations, and so is Dubai World. The problem with any airport during these ops is that the rate of movements literally collapses. So, holding blows out well beyond anything you might normally expect. Runway spacing is part of the issue here. The further apart adjacent runways are, the better. In some ways it becomes a game of who can hold the longest.

But, just to make it more interesting, available diversion airfields may well fill up, and be unable to take traffic, so you need to be wary of trying to 'hold' it out, if that could push you to an undesirable divert field. You could conceivably end up in the situation where you burn up your available flight time hours in the holding pattern...the clock operates differently when on the ground. Tactically, it could be better to jump to the diversion immediately, and avoid holding. Effectively you get to wait it out on the ground. The drawback to that is that you now have zero priority. It's an interesting game, for which the rules vary for each and every aircraft.

 

[Quickstatus]

Interesting read of the QF Twitter feed.
At best an example of non communication. At worst a disdain for the passengers and treating them like fools
The news that AJ managed to get on the earlier flight just shows that the airline just don't care unless you are a premium passenger

 

[Quickstatus]

Dubai is capable of low vis operations, and so is Dubai World. The problem with any airport during these ops is that the rate of movements literally collapses. So, holding blows out well beyond anything you might normally expect. Runway spacing is part of the issue here. The further apart adjacent runways are, the better. In some ways it becomes a game of who can hold the longest.

But, just to make it more interesting, available diversion airfields may well fill up, and be unable to take traffic, so you need to be wary of trying to 'hold' it out, if that could push you to an undesirable divert field. You could conceivably end up in the situation where you burn up your available flight time hours in the holding pattern...the clock operates differently when on the ground. Tactically, it could be better to jump to the diversion immediately, and avoid holding. Effectively you get to wait it out on the ground. The drawback to that is that you now have zero priority. It's an interesting game, for which the rules vary for each and every aircraft.

Thanks for a "tactical" insight

You mention the movement rate collapses. Is this because the ILS signal or localiser is affected (?degraded) by the auto landing aircraft and following aircraft cannot rely on the ILS localiser for autoland purposes until the auto landed aircraft has cleared the runway? Causing the usual approach separations to increase?. Of course after landing in an "London Fog" the pilots can't see where they are going on the taxiways further compounding the backup into the air behind them?

 

[Melburnian1]

QF is suggesting that the cancelled QF2 leg between DXB and SYD that wss meant to depart at 0935 hours on Friday 30 December will instead depart at 1630 on Saturday 31 for a Sunday 1 January 2017 arrival at 1300 hours (30.5 hours late) instead of a Saturday 31 arrival at 0630 hours.

The Thursday 29 December QF1 (A388 VH-OQB) that had been diverted to MCT prior to arriving in DXB ended up arriving in LHR on Friday 30 at 1911, twelve hours and 21 minutes (741 minutes) tardy.

Thursday's QF9 ex MEL arrived LHR 61 minutes late at 1341, turning around as quickly as possible to operate QF10, the 1155 hours from LHR that pushed back at 1620 hours on Friday 30. The DXB stop is estimated to be from 0340 to 0445 - a very optimistic 65 minutes and not normally achieved at this location from observation - with MEL arrival on Saturday 31 December projected at 0040 hours on Sunday 1 January 2017. Those F passengers will indeed be in the F lounge at the stroke of midnight.

Qantas has yet to alter the publicly displayed timings for the 2325 hours, 31 December QF9 ex MEL.

On Friday 30, the delayed QF64 departed JNB at 2112 instead of its scheduled 1850. SYD Saturday 31 December arrival should be at 1728, 113 minutes tardy.

 

[Quickstatus]

Edit - apparently Alan Joyce was caught up in the delays. He departed on the earlier qf2 that did leave Dubai for Sydney.

Can you share a link?

 

[Melburnian1]

On Saturday 31 December, the overnight (downgauged) QF128 from HKG to SYD should arrive at approximately 0854, 39 minutes late with A333 Vh-QPH.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

For those who might be on these flights originating in London, what are the actual delays (flight numbers, dates, and times) in departing the EU? Might be handy so people know if they can put in for their EU261 compensation.