Qantas Dumps Economy Luggage in Darwin for London Flights

[MEL_Traveller]

Because it doesn't work like that. With the short turn around times that flights have. You are generally boarding when catering are doing their thing on the aircraft.
They don't know what is meant to be catered as they are all meant to be catered.

For the flights with return catering loaded on the outbound, which i understand MEL-OOL is an example… as soon as the plane left the gate at MEL the crew could have informed QF operations which could have made arrangements at OOL.

It’s the same with bags ex DRW. QF knows about the work in advance. Some pax were bumped, involuntarily. Other were not bumped by their bags were not loaded. Again, involuntary and no choice given to the passenger at any time.

Not having a bag arrive at an away-port is hugely inconvenient for the majority of passengers. Temporary shopping is a pain and it’s not like reimbursement is instant… it can take weeks. Same with claiming on insurance (and why should my premiums pay for a commercial decision by an airline?)

In addition to the inconvenience there’s the worry that bags can be tampered with, not stored properly, or worst case, lost.

 

[jase05]

Sorry to ruin your narrative with facts. Plane was too heavy for the runway. No point getting emotional about it.

Obviously a issue but the question must be asked why are they still selling seats on upcoming flights and why were these flights oversold in the first place?
Obviously moving forwards other options will need to be implemented

 

[encryptededdy]

are they still selling seats on upcoming flights

I think the runway is fixed now

were these flights oversold in the first place?

I think it was emergency work with no notice

 

[jase05]

I think the runway is fixed now

I think it was emergency work with no notice

Fair enough then, thanks for the info.

 

[justinbrett]

So QF was unaware before take off of that fact. They are worse than i thought.

None of us were there, but up until the door is closed, the captain has the final call on the weight and balance of the aircraft. Factors like winds and weather of the route, subsequent holding fuel etc - especially for a ULR - these can vary right up until the time the doors are closed. (and thereafter but not much you can do about it then)

If the captain needed an extra 2T of fuel - which is a drop in the ocean (capacity is around 126T) - that comes at the expense of over 85 bags (23Kg each).

 

[MEL_Traveller]

None of us were there, but up until the door is closed, the captain has the final call on the weight and balance of the aircraft. Factors like winds and weather of the route, subsequent holding fuel etc - especially for a ULR - these can vary right up until the time the doors are closed. (and thereafter but not much you can do about it then)

If the captain needed an extra 2T of fuel - which is a drop in the ocean (capacity is around 126T) - that comes at the expense of over 85 bags (23Kg each).

You don’t need to be there for strategic risk management.

The pilot is undertaking tactical risk management... the situation immediately before them.

The strategic risk is how you want to handle the potential outcomes of a tactical decision. That’s for the folk in head office. Seems they decided leaving behind a whole bunch of economy bags was a risk worth taking?

 

[justinbrett]

You don’t need to be there for strategic risk management.

The pilot is undertaking tactical risk management... the situation immediately before them.

The strategic risk is how you want to handle the potential outcomes of a tactical decision. That’s for the folk in head office. Seems they decided leaving behind a whole bunch of economy bags was a risk worth taking?

Do you honestly think they would have loaded the bags in SYD if they knew they'd be offloaded in DRW and stranded? If they knew that, it would have been much easier to leave them in SYD and send them as freight or on one of the many airlines flying to LHR. As it is I'm sure a large part of the delay was having to get the bags back to SYD to rebook on other aircraft.

I think you'll find the situation was more dynamic - and the position was far less clear than some of the Monday Quarterbacks here are suggesting.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Do you honestly think they would have loaded the bags in SYD if they knew they'd be offloaded in DRW and stranded? If they knew that, it would have been much easier to leave them in SYD and send them as freight or on one of the many airlines flying to LHR. As it is I'm sure a large part of the delay was having to get the bags back to SYD to rebook on other aircraft.

I think you'll find the situation was more dynamic - and the position was far less clear than some of the Monday Quarterbacks here are suggesting.

They either loaded the bags in Sydney not appreciating the risk. Or they loaded them knowing the risk, but decided to accept it.

Either way, it doesn’t look good.

 

[justinbrett]

They either loaded the bags in Sydney not appreciating the risk. Or they loaded them knowing the risk, but decided to accept it.

Either way, it doesn’t look good.

Maybe put your application in with Qantas if you think you can do better?

Would you have preferred they bumped half the flight send sent it half empty to LHR?

Again - Monday Quarterback.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Maybe put your application in with Qantas if you think you can do better?

Would you have preferred they bumped half the flight send sent it half empty to LHR?

Again - Monday Quarterback.

The point of risk management is that you shouldn’t have to find yourself where the only option is to leave bags behind or bump half the flight… you don’t get yourself into that situation in the first place.

 

[justinbrett]

The point of risk management is that you shouldn’t have to find yourself where the only option is to leave bags behind or bump half the flight… you don’t get yourself into that situation in the first place.

That's risk avoidance, not risk management.

 

[Melburnian1]

Maybe put your application in with Qantas if you think you can do better?

Would you have preferred they bumped half the flight send sent it half empty to LHR?

Again - Monday Quarterback.

It's legitimate to criticise organisations such as QF when there's a failure on what ought be core competencies such as ensuring luggage goes with passengers, or if it does not, it's received within (bearing in mind the length of this route to LHR) 48 hours.

It's not as if many other airlines don't offer one-stops from SYD, MEL or BNE, as well as PER. Some like SQ have frequencies that makes QFi's frequencies look spartan, as the AFF key writer highlighted a few weeks ago.

QF has no qualms about instructing the community what the latter ought do on social issues. For QF, an airline, latter could be termed 'non-core'.

Please don't use USA expressions. Gridiron or whatever it's called these days is foreign to many Australians.

 

[HSB44]

The thing is, once it was clear that it would take more than a day or two for the same flight to take off from Darwin - why didn't they freight the bags?
6 days is pretty bad.

 

[justinbrett]

It's legitimate to criticise organisations such as QF when there's a failure on what ought be core competencies such as ensuring luggage goes with passengers, or if it does not, it's received within (bearing in mind the length of this route to LHR) 48 hours.

It's not as if many other airlines don't offer one-stops from SYD, MEL or BNE, as well as PER. Some like SQ have frequencies that makes QFi's frequencies look spartan, as the AFF key writer highlighted a few weeks ago.

QF has no qualms about instructing the community what the latter ought do on social issues. For QF, an airline, latter could be termed 'non-core'.

Please don't use USA expressions. Gridiron or whatever it's called these days is foreign to many Australians.

You find a way to criticise QF in every thread, whether you're on topic or not (and paras 2-4 of your post are not). You obviously make a sport of this so if this is what really makes you happy, then I guess you be you.

This was an operational incident, these happen on every airline, and will continue to do so.

I'll use whatever expressions I like - if you don't get the reference google it or move along.

 

[Must...Fly!]

Well if you're a fanboy or a serial critic neither are a good look and I think we've got both on display here.

My thoughts

1) Not good to leave the bags behind

2) Sometimes the factors around leaving them aren't known beforehand

3) Telling passengers while still on the ground is entirely impractical for many reasons (unfortunate truth). Whether you tell them after take off or before landing makes no difference. At least people didn't wait forever at the baggage belt.

4) The real problem here is not bags being left behind or when passengers were informed. It is the (once again) unbelievable poor show of service recovery from Qantas. In terms of answering queries and, more importantly, glacial speed of reuniting people with bags.

5) This episode is ultimately another installment in the long running series of "why not to fly Qantas"

 

[JohnK]

Disappointing to have bags offloaded and at least 4 days and bags still not arrived.

Clothes, golf clubs, certain medications etc. Very inconvenient and can make or break a trip.

P.S. With low carry on limits I could not have more than 1 change of clothes in carry-on.

 

[RooFlyer]

If trying to minimise customer disruption

Qantas? Ha, ha, ha! Why the hell should they?

I've had tight connections where my bag didn't make the flight - more than once. I survived.

Good for you. This wasn't a case of tight connection though, was it?

Finally recieved delayed QF baggage... after 24 days of worldwide ping pong

So what? The pax 'survived' didn't they? Although if their medications beyond, say 5 days (carry-on) were in the luggage, then maybe they didn't.

It’s the same with bags ex DRW. QF knows about the work in advance. Some pax were bumped, involuntarily. Other were not bumped by their bags were not loaded. Again, involuntary and no choice given to the passenger at any time.

So, what's the problem? You choose to fly Qantas, you get this sort of thing, along with all the other stuff that's happening currently.

Again - Monday Quarterback.

Again - Qantas apologist.

 

[kpc]

Again - Qantas apologist.

my thoughts too.

 

[jb747]

They either loaded the bags in Sydney not appreciating the risk. Or they loaded them knowing the risk, but decided to accept it.

I wish I'd had your incredible foresight when I was ordering fuel. Of course, the scenario where the available weight ex Darwin was going to be acceptable when they left Sydney, but was reduced in the subsequent hours before departure from Darwin, is actually the most likely, though you don't seem to consider that. Looking at the flight plans, the limit weight varies appreciably from day to day, and not just by a couple of tonnes.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I wish I'd had your incredible foresight when I was ordering fuel. Of course, the scenario where the available weight ex Darwin was going to be acceptable when they left Sydney, but was reduced in the subsequent hours before departure from Darwin, is actually the most likely, though you don't seem to consider that. Looking at the flight plans, the limit weight varies appreciably from day to day, and not just by a couple of tonnes.

That was exactly factored in and you have nailed the issue.

There’s a tactical situation prior to departure by the pilot working out fuel and weight, etc. As you said that varies day by day.

But at a strategic level you combine that with runway works and you have a new risk assessment. Or at least should have… being that the works combined with a potential heavier weight could mean off loading bags, or passengers, or whatever. That’s not an issue for the captain who is looking at safety, that’s an issue for management looking at brand and the overall customer experience.

Either management decided that was a risk worth taking, or they don’t do a new risk assessment. Either way the outcome was poor.