Qantas First Class "Nothing more than a premium business class"

[Ewing]

All my latest QF J class flights have had the Marc Newson cutlery still. But David Caon glassware. And the MN cutlery was still in the J and F lounges.

I've still been getting the old cutlery in J, but F flights have had the new stuff.

I like the new tableware.

 

[Matt_01]

I'll agree with that having crews on LAX-SYD and LAX-MEL best be described as 'underwhelming'. Contrast that to the lead FA on my last SIN-LHR, a Scottish lady and I assume UK based, who seemed dtermined to feed me the entire Champagne and Scotch Whiskey provision.

I assume you were the model PAX and helped the FA in for filling her duties.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I flew PE multiple times on CX, BA, AA, QF and JL and I have to say seat comfort, food and wine were significantly better on QF. Haven't tried SQ though. Anyway my point was more that where I work due to travel policy it is very common for people to spend up to 7K on QF PE product. I would imagine that's why QF is increasing PE cabin size on the refurbished 380. Happy to try a better PE product if there is one out there...

Given full business class to europe is around $4000, spending anything more than $2500 on PEY would not really make sense, certainly not the prices QF is charging. CI has a good product, and a good price. LH I think is one of the worst, not even a separate cabin!

 

[Austman]

I used to catch those every couple of weeks and I was always puzzled why people would want to stay up 1.5 hrs after takeoff to eat dinner at like 11:30pm local time on departure, and then wake up 2 hrs before arrival to eat breakfast at like 4am new local time, on a 7.5 hour overnight flight. I get it, free J food and all, but why not eat before takeoff and get a nice toastie at a cafe on arrival and actually sleep on the flight.

Because...

1. I was not beginning my flights in SIN. I was on a quite quick transit connection with no real time to go to the SQ SIN lounge,

and

2. My body clock was different to SIN time. It wasn't 11:00pm to me. It was earlier. A couple of hours earlier I think,

and

3. SQ had hyped their in-fight J-class meal service in their advertising so that I had expected something delicious and substantial,

and

4. Because of 3, I had purposely refrained from eating on my connecting flight. Which was SilkAir I think. Anyway, I was really hungry after take-off in SIN!

and

5. It was my first long-haul flight on SQ in J-class. It was at my own expense and I wanted to enjoy the experience as much as possible. I had no idea it was a "supper" service.

I was pretty upset with the SQ "supper" service offering. The crew were apologetic and promised a full breakfast service. But that was the meal I wanted to skip entirely - to sleep longer...

So, I suppose, as others have noted, it should be about passenger choice in the premium cabins.

 

[Pushka]

On the overnight SQ SIN-SYD flights?

I used to catch those every couple of weeks and I was always puzzled why people would want to stay up 1.5 hrs after takeoff to eat dinner at like 11:30pm local time on departure, and then wake up 2 hrs before arrival to eat breakfast at like 4am new local time, on a 7.5 hour overnight flight. I get it, free J food and all, but why not eat before takeoff and get a nice toastie at a cafe on arrival and actually sleep on the flight.

Maybe I was just cranky because the SQ flight attendants would keep the lights on and make a fair bit of noise while serving said meals, limiting the snoozing time for those who wanted to fall asleep shortly after takeoff and wake up shortly before landing

This is why I avoid Singapore. I hate the flight into Australia. I eat prior and try to get some sleep ASAP. Can’t believe people want to eat when their journey starts in Singapore.

 

[Kangol]

For those comparing public and private transport, it shows that there are signs of serious cognitive error and failure.
The price difference for a long haul route chartered private jet is 15-20x the price of a commercial F ticket.
There is no similarity.
Even if there was a subscription type of service offering nonstop longhaul private jet flights from Australia (ie. USA or one stop to Europe), there would be no comparison. You may as well compare flying vs swimming.

Every airline has their downsides and upsides. I've had average experiences on EK F and SQ F as well as QF F.
One point you cannot argue with is the space and width of QF F suites - they are definitely bigger than EK A380/777 and SQ old R / 777 F. New R only serve select segments and is an invalid comparison. The only products offering (much) more space are EY A380 and SQ new R - but they are exceptions to worldwide F products.

I've only tried F in 9 or 10 airlines so I'm not a "seasoned traveller" in any sense of the term - I don't travel often so take it as you may, but the clear feature unique to all airlines is the cultural attitude towards communication and service. Some you may like, others you may not. Expectations are probably the key to a good experience.

 

[GoldCanyon340]

I assume you were the model PAX and helped the FA in for filling her duties.

Can't let it go to waste.

 

[stm1sydney]

I think QF thinking on Asia-Oz redeyes to max more sleep time.

So why does the QF dinner service take so long?

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Because...

1. I was not beginning my flights in SIN. I was on a quite quick transit connection with no real time to go to the SQ SIN lounge,

and

2. My body clock was different to SIN time. It wasn't 11:00pm to me. It was earlier. A couple of hours earlier I think,

and

3. SQ had hyped their in-fight J-class meal service in their advertising so that I had expected something delicious and substantial,

and

4. Because of 3, I had purposely refrained from eating on my connecting flight. Which was SilkAir I think. Anyway, I was really hungry after take-off in SIN!

and

5. It was my first long-haul flight on SQ in J-class. It was at my own expense and I wanted to enjoy the experience as much as possible. I had no idea it was a "supper" service.

I was pretty upset with the SQ "supper" service offering. The crew were apologetic and promised a full breakfast service. But that was the meal I wanted to skip entirely - to sleep longer...

So, I suppose, as others have noted, it should be about passenger choice in the premium cabins.

Ah, yes. I guess this is one of the few flights you need to ‘know’ the product. SQ’s supper service is one of those things you either know about, or don’t. But you only get caught out once! There are a few others like BA’s transatlantic sleeper services (if you get to the airport late and don’t have time to eat you can be left stranded once on board).

I avoid connections via SIN these days as they’re just too short to provide meaningful sleep. TATL is hard to avoid the short flight times, travelling around asia also the same (nothing you can do about SIN-TYO for example). But coming from Europe or long-haul asia you can cut out the stop and get both service and sleep time.

 

[stm1sydney]

Have a look at the Flyertalk trip report "BATTLE OF THE KYO KAISEKI FIRST CLASS MEALS: Singapore Airlines vs. Japan Airlines" for what F should be.

 

[drron]

I also preferred the JAL offering over SQ but both better than any other airline meal I have had.

 

[Flying mermaid]

For those comparing public and private transport, it shows that there are signs of serious cognitive error and failure.
The price difference for a long haul route chartered private jet is 15-20x the price of a commercial F ticket.
There is no similarity.
Even if there was a subscription type of service offering nonstop longhaul private jet flights from Australia (ie. USA or one stop to Europe), there would be no comparison. You may as well compare flying vs swimming.

Every airline has their downsides and upsides. I've had average experiences on EK F and SQ F as well as QF F.
One point you cannot argue with is the space and width of QF F suites - they are definitely bigger than EK A380/777 and SQ old R / 777 F. New R only serve select segments and is an invalid comparison. The only products offering (much) more space are EY A380 and SQ new R - but they are exceptions to worldwide F products.

I've only tried F in 9 or 10 airlines so I'm not a "seasoned traveller" in any sense of the term - I don't travel often so take it as you may, but the clear feature unique to all airlines is the cultural attitude towards communication and service. Some you may like, others you may not. Expectations are probably the key to a good experience.

another point you can argue with is how poor the wine offering is on Qantas F. Champagne OK, but as soon as you step outside very bad for F class. The meals while pleasant are not much of a step up from Business.....

 

[MEL_Traveller]

The First and business class meals share many dishes in common. Good for getting first choice of your entree and main course, but it means it is all prepared to business class standard, not first.

 

[RichardMEL]

So why does the QF dinner service take so long?

well yea.. I have no answer there sadly. Frustrating.. but it MAY explain the brief breakfast offerings, specially when some of the flights arrive so early. With flights these short you can't seem to win and I haven't found an airline between QF/SQ/MH and TG even in my experience that manages it to max sleep time (though to be fair TG has a few extra hours and it works a bit better in my few experiences with them).

I guess in terms of service of larger cabins of J and Y (let alone F, but that's another story) the issues can involve limited oven space and trying to prep as much as possible to do a service but it is true QF do seem, on the whole, to be slower than the others in this dept. I onder if there's a staffing issue involved?

 

[RichardMEL]

I'm currently booked J from London to Dubai late January and have the ability to upgrade to First for 44,000 points. Having only ever flown J a few times and never F, i'm sceptical about doing it now! I don't fly often, and even J is a luxury for me. What's the chances this route will have had the refurb done? Either way, i'll probably still do it, I have the points and well, life's short?

Sorry just to be clear you're talking about LONDON (LHR) to DUBAI (DXB)? QF does not fly its own metal on this route anymore. If you are talking about using QF points, it will not be possible to upgrade on Emirates flights that have QF codeshare flight numbers on them.

 

[RichardMEL]

I do definitely agree that QF F is much like a premium J these days. 10 years ago it was a decent F product for the day.. now it's just been well overtaken. I think MH had the right idea when they realised calling their product F and marketing as such was a lose/lose but branding it as a premium J actually works well to make use of the installed hardware on the 350's. Like QF it's a far more comfortable and private suite arrangement and the food is slightly upgraded, but shares much with J (they have a bette champagne for example). At the price points that product makes sense because they're not bothering to claim it is F in the style of SQ or CX as their main competition.

QF won't do that because they lose a lot of prestiege not having a "F" cabin to LAX and LHR for your celebs, pollies and wannabees.

imho

 

[Kangol]

another point you can argue with is how poor the wine offering is on Qantas F. Champagne OK, but as soon as you step outside very bad for F class. The meals while pleasant are not much of a step up from Business.....

True, often the measure of the wine offering quality is how much is spent per bottle (yes I know it's not the only measure). I've only had a decent red in two of 20+ QF F segments. Australian red, that is. Don't recall QF having something like a Bordeaux on their menu.
I've had SQ serve better Australian reds than QF in their F cabins.
SQ, EK and QR spend a decent amount on their wine outside of champagne. Airlines like CX, JL, NH, BA, TG do not. Bad F wine is not limited to QF unfortunately.

 

[GoldCanyon340]

True, often the measure of the wine offering quality is how much is spent per bottle (yes I know it's not the only measure). I've only had a decent red in two of 20+ QF F segments. Australian red, that is. Don't recall QF having something like a Bordeaux on their menu.

Just do not get me started on the Australian wine obsession abound at QF. Ok, you have Yes I know price isn't the only measure but I just booked a DUB-DXB leg on EK and took a look at the offerings on this flight: a Bordeaux valued at $475.

 

[serfty]

I flew PE multiple times on CX, BA, AA, QF and JL and I have to say seat comfort, food and wine were significantly better on QF. Haven't tried SQ though ...

FWIW, I rate VA PE well above that of QF 380 having tried them both transpacific several times.

 

[RooFlyer]

Sorry just to be clear you're talking about LONDON (LHR) to DUBAI (DXB)?

This was clarified up thread. It's SIN not DXB.