Qantas fleet rebuild piece

[RooFlyer]

That last slide is good. Tell me that's not infinitely more useful than a single company wide figure.

Depends on the point being made, as we've agreed beforehand but yes, there is some good data there. Yet in prior presentations over a number of years at least, Qantas apparently did feel that a single fleet-wide figure was a useful thing to present. As they say - go figure.

So I did. I figure that when the fleet is overall relatively 'young' (say 7-8 years) the company was happy to present that figure and show the virtues of it "maintaining a young, fuel efficient fleet". But when that figure rises to the present level - several points above 10 - the metric becomes publicly unimportant. With Qantas' present emphasis on being 'green' and all that, some would find the absence of a "young, fuel efficient fleet" a bit surprising.

 

[justinbrett]

Depends on the point being made, as we've agreed beforehand but yes, there is some good data there. Yet in prior presentations over a number of years at least, Qantas apparently did feel that a single fleet-wide figure was a useful thing to present. As they say - go figure.

So I did. I figure that when the fleet is overall relatively 'young' (say 7-8 years) the company was happy to present that figure and show the virtues of it "maintaining a young, fuel efficient fleet". But when that figure rises to the present level - several points above 10 - the metric becomes publicly unimportant. With Qantas' present emphasis on being 'green' and all that, some would find the absence of a "young, fuel efficient fleet" a bit surprising.

And the cheapest way to get that figure down is never replace expensive long haul aircraft - keep them until they’re 40 years old.

But replace the cheap regional aircraft every 5 years or so, and get more of them.

But that doesn’t achieve much, does it?

I agree with you - this is a “feel good” metric they used when it suited them, but not all that meaningful for operational decisions.

 

[BD1959]

Personally, I don't give a flying fig how old the fleet is: as long as its comfortable, reliable and efficient enough to keep my airfare reasonably priced.

Which brings me to QF675 on Apr 15 ... first off, the APU was obviously US. A delayed departure due to having to "jump start" the aircraft had us delayed 20 mins departing the gate and then falling further behind in the queue for the single-use runway due to extended run-up checks. Actual runway departure 45mins after scheduled gate departure. An IFE which wouldn't run despite multiple attempts at rebooting by the crew and wifi which wouldn't connect to the internet had a (fortunately short) flight bereft of any entertainment. A far from "premium experience@ for Mrs BD on one of her rare excursions in J, at a Y price which should have included a free-upgrade !!

If this is the shape of things to come waiting for the replacement A32x to come onstream then QF is screwed.

Regards,

BD

 

[MELso]

Personally, I don't give a flying fig how old the fleet is: as long as its comfortable, reliable and efficient enough to keep my airfare reasonably priced.

Paradoxically, newer aircraft are better to deliver lower costs.

There's a reason why the Ryanairs, Wizzes and Easyjets of the world maintain young, highly standardised fleets. Newer fleets, while involving more capex upfront, have lower maintenance, inspection and fuel costs, which means more usable time spent flying and lower costs while they do so...

 

[BD1959]

Paradoxically, newer aircraft are better to deliver lower costs.

I don't think it a paradox at all - makes perfect sense to me.

Regards,

BD

 

[moa999]

There's a reason why the Ryanairs, Wizzes and Easyjets of the world maintain young, highly standardised fleets.

Adding the biggest LCC.
Southwest - still flying 1999 delivered 737s
RyanAir - 2004 737s
Easyjet - 2005 319s.
Wizzair was only launched in 2003 so still in honeymoon stage.

It's a mix of considerations as to what fleet policy airlines use.
Upfront purchase (and interest and depreciation) or equivalent lease costs (both will depend on interest rates and credit quality)
Taxation (life is 20yrs in Aus, lower in other places)
Maintenance costs (particularly the larger checks)
Dispatch reliability
Fuel consumption and fuel costs
Availability and improvement in new aircraft

Anyhow, back to Qantas narrowbodies, the first 717 retirement has reportedly just occured (a 2006 delivery, the 2nd youngest) - heading to Europe under the control of Southern Cross International, an aircraft ferry company

VH-YQV Flight Tracking and History - FlightAware

Track VH-YQV flight from Los Angeles Intl to So California Logistics

flightaware.com

Assume it will be eventually scrapped given none of Volotea's retired 717s have found a new home, though most are still listed as stored

 

[Quickstatus]

There's a reason why the Ryanairs, Wizzes and Easyjets of the world maintain young, highly standardised fleets.

As per comment above re age.

But Ryanair operates 737-800 and A320
Easy jet operate variants of the A320
Southwest operates 3 variants of the 737
QF for its mainline high frequency domestic operations operate 737-800

QF used to be just a 747 airline before it amalgamated to also operate the domestic market.

I can't see how QF can operate a standardised fleet. A 737-800 can hardly operate SYD-LAX.

It's as standardised as it can get - for the particular route.
I don't see Ryanair/east jet/southwest operating long haul transcontinental/flights > 6hrs.

Low volume domestic flights 717/Dash
Mainline domestic 737-800
Mainline high volume domestic A330
Regional international A330
High capacity international A380
Low capacity international A330/B789
Ultra long range thin B789

 

[Quickstatus]

Personally, I don't give a flying fig how old the fleet is: as long as its comfortable, reliable and efficient enough to keep my airfare reasonably priced.

Agree.
I'm perfectly happy to fly in an old aircraft with those caveats.
QF financial performance metrics has nothing to do with the flying public - they don't give a ****. I'll just book with whatever airline gives me the best value = best fare of day.

 

[lovestotravel]

Won't be AJ's problem when he jets off into the sunset having milked a fat cat salary over the years and cashed in all of his Qantas shares.

When the next CEO reports lower profits ( higher depreciation and lower revenue from people leaving in droves) and higher debts (to fund fleet capex), it'll make AJ look like a genius.

That was always the aim, AJ will walk away with a massive bonus payment shortly

Meanwhile new aircraft will come, profits will dip and staff all on new EBA's which are a joke.

 

[AIRwin]

Legacy Impulse B717:

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media-releases/qantas-prepares-to-farewell-boeing-717-welcomes-more-new-aircraft/

 

[jpp42]

Who is buying 717's in North America, I wonder?

 

[#flying]

Who is buying 717's in North America, I wonder?

Presumably Delta. Could be for parts?

 

[oz_mark]

Presumably Delta. Could be for parts?

It is Delta, but not all for parts, some are apparently going in to operation.

 

[Assassin]

It is Delta, but not all for parts, some are apparently going in to operation.

Just out of interest, how do you know?

 

[servicerequired]

Excuse my ignorance, but how come these are been sent packing overseas, and not to the foreign nation of WA? I would have thought a future under Network Aviation? Maybe only the single class birds to Network?

 

[jrfsp]

Excuse my ignorance, but how come these are been sent packing overseas, and not to the foreign nation of WA? I would have thought a future under Network Aviation? Maybe only the single class birds to Network?

Replacing the F100s with 717s wouldnt really achieve much, just add lots of training costs for little benefit.

NA will be getting some more second hand A319s /A320s

 

[moa999]

An interesting chart in today's presentation.
Qantas have introduced a new concept (and I say that as the 717s are operated by NJS and branded QantasLink) of the domestic narrowbody fleet (today 75 738s and 20 717s)

Which will change through FY27 with 29 A223s and 20 A321XLRs arriving.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Would have been nice if QF had done like what NH and JL do, ie, put the wide body planes on some of the Japanese domestic routes.
So, from say, 2030, it will be all narrow body planes on Aust domestic routes.
Yes, its still a plane, and it still gets pax from ADL - PER/MEL/SYD/BNE, or vv, but sometimes, its nice to have a wide body plane on a domestic flight.

 

[CaptJCool]

yeah, there seemed to be quite a few slides in the pack discussing Fleet Replacement and Renewal

 

[moa999]

Not necessarily.
The pack was fairly quiet on the previously announced 330 renewal, which I assume will probably start in FY28 (the pack really only went to FY27).

Possibly QF might take a wait and see approach and order more flexible 321XLRs, because in the 20yr life of those planes I suspect there is going to be disruption of the short-haul market with hydrogen or hydrogen/battery electric aircraft - which by necessity of fuel volume or weight are likely to be shorter haul like some of the jet aircraft of history.