Qantas orders new 787s and A350s

[RichardMEL]

I guess a lot depends on how premium travel demand is over the next few years. If they see significant good F load factors, they might consider it. I highly doubt it, but it is possible.

Well sure, anything's *possible* but seems pretty unlikely - not only due to the expected missions for the 78X, but also the way QF has viewed First Class for a very, very long time. In my view, QF has treated First as a very legacy "requirement" for these focus routes - LHR, LAX (and I suppose SIN, but that seems pretty secondary). Mostly that kind of "old world" thinking that you need a "First" product on your Premium routes for a certain clientele, to have some pride as the Flag Carrier and of course to be able to (try to) compete with the other carriers in this market segment to a place like LHR (ie: QR/SQ/EK/CX).

IMO if QF could have, they would have gotten rid of F a long time ago. I'm sure Joyce was not a fan of it. The way it's been treated on the A380's for the past 10+ years as basically a J+ product with only slightly better catering and soft product (yes the bedding is a huge part of that)... they certainly don't give it the attention or care that an SQ does. Not even close. It's almost like it's there because they feel they have to, not because they really WANT to.

And of course F load factor is not the same thing as paid F demand That's also important to note.

Back to the 787 - the mission profile is not really going to overlap here. Sure, possibly BNE-LAX is just within the range of the 78X (as aluded to below) but more generally as a A330-300 type replacement it's not really going to go into the markets, in general, that QF would see any kind of heavy paid F demand for.

Yes, the "Sunrise" A350-1000's will have that F product, at a ridiculous price no doubt, but the reasoning there is clear and makes sense - for those willing to and able to pay for F (celebs, corporate bigwigs, merchant bankers etc) that saving of a few hours in nonstop to NYC or LHR - that would be worth it (time is money, etc) and QF knows they will likely have a product and platform for these key routes that could potentially sustain the paid preium cabin (F and J) - and mostly because there won't be any clear competition either (can't see any carriers based in either LHR or NYC looking to match this) - a unique platform and product for very niche markets

(it is interesting to note when SQ first deployed the A340's on SIN-NYC they had no F, but J and W - and still do not fly an F product to NYC nonstop* from SIN - I wonder if QF took note of this).

A 1 row F (3 seat) config could be possible to open BNE up to NA more in time for the Olympics?

That's a rather specific point in time to use as example I suspect for a special event like the olypics in 2032, QF might pop A350's for some sectors - if they figured there might be some demand there. I'd suspect by that point they'd be interested in capacity as much as premium capacity and the 78X would be ideal also - specially if it had a newer generation J and W product.

While something like olympics, Taylor Swift tours and the like can bring surges in demand for relatively short periods, the bigger picture of fleet planning is almost certainly not about what they'll do for these things, but where to deploy assets over short, medium and longer term life of those assets.

I'd be VERY surprised if any QF 787 ever has a First (or even mini first ) product.

 

[HS-TQE]

I guess a lot depends on how premium travel demand is over the next few years. If they see significant good F load factors, they might consider it. I highly doubt it, but it is possible.

A 1 row F (3 seat) config could be possible to open BNE up to NA more in time for the Olympics?

Can't see F being offered on QF out of BNE, nor swapping out the A330 for the foreseeable future.

Only chance of BNE getting a 787 in the short term of course if Premier Steven (Annastacia's successor) goes up to QF with taxpayer funded AAIF money to subsidise a 787 service "in the name of Premium Tourism for Queensland".

 

[elanshin]

Can't see F being offered on QF out of BNE, nor swapping out the A330 for the foreseeable future.

Only chance of BNE getting a 787 in the short term of course if Premier Steven (Annastacia's successor) goes up to QF with taxpayer funded AAIF money to subsidise a 787 service "in the name of Premium Tourism for Queensland".

F i agree is a long stretch but 789 / 78X out of BNE? that's almost a guarantee once this order starts being delivered in reasonable numbers - I wouldn't be surprised if BNE <> LAX is swapped over sooner than later.

Better economics for long haul flying b789 than a333 if nothing else. BNE <> ORD might get relaunched if they have the planes. This thread is at the end of the day, the news b787 /a350 thread (which is being ordered to replace a330s)

 

[AIRwin]

I wouldn't be surprised if BNE <> LAX is swapped over sooner than later.

Better economics for long haul flying b789 than a333 if nothing else.

A332 not A333

 

[HS-TQE]

F i agree is a long stretch but 789 / 78X out of BNE? that's almost a guarantee once this order starts being delivered in reasonable numbers - I wouldn't be surprised if BNE <> LAX is swapped over sooner than later.

Better economics for long haul flying b789 than a333 if nothing else. BNE <> ORD might get relaunched if they have the planes. This thread is at the end of the day, the news b787 /a350 thread (which is being ordered to replace a330s)

78X possibly may be a BNE-SIN/NRT machine than LAX at this stage, imo. Basically almost a guarantee it'll be Y heavy which is suited for the Asian routes. The newer 789s, possibly more long-haul secondary European services out of PER.

 

[elanshin]

78X possibly may be a BNE-SIN/NRT machine than LAX at this stage, imo. Basically almost a guarantee it'll be Y heavy which is suited for the Asian routes. The newer 789s, possibly more long-haul secondary European services out of PER.

Would it actually be Y heavy though. I can see a world where QF adds to the J cabin and W cabin with the extra space instead of Y.

They have JQ to pack people in and even JQ is doubling their "J" offer.