Qantas Platinum One experiences?

[GoldCanyon340]

I haven't seen any double TP offers from BA, but they may be targeted if the do make them. I remember in my four years as a P1 I never received a double status credit offer.

BAEC is good when it comes to defined benefits and this is a very good offset to the less well defined benefits which appear to be bestowed upon those they wish to lure into the madness of the frequent flyer form of Stockholm Syndrome. I'm looking to break free next year...but I have said that before and am now hooked into obtaining BA LTG!!! (There are some subtle changes happening in the background that will be the perfect treatment for my particular form of BA Stockholm Syndrome...well that and finally reaching LTG! A little viewed newish thread, posted by a travel agent, over on FT highlights a now closed loophole. ) Oh well maybe SQ PPS is the way to go?

Veering off QF P1 territory now but the new BA J seats certainly make a better proposal to fly BA for Lifetime OWE, something I've considered and posted about before. The current J is just... well, what's a word that encapsulates an nth degree worse than 'awful'? The ex-EU J deals are sometimes spectacular.

Coming back to QF we should conduct a study as to whether BA Stockholm Syndrome is worse than QF Stockholm Syndrome

 

[TonyHancock]

The current J is just... well, what's a word that encapsulates an nth degree worse than 'awful'?

I was having that very same conversation with the crew serving the J cabin on BA15 into Sydney at the weekend. It is an awful cabin layout and the service is not great, but the one thing I will say is that the seat as a bed is very good. In fact I rate it as one of the best J products to sleep in. (Not that I was in J at the weekend fortunately )

Something about P1, blah, blah, blah, so I don't go off topic.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

....
I guess what I meant by "bit of a joke" was that it essentially devalues the level. I don't know if BA do such things and if they effect or contribute to GGL(TonyHancock??) but as I see it, QF set a high bar for the program and yet with multiplt DSC offerrs a year it makes it much easier.
....

This is why I think, if they continue these promos, they will either:

a) make DSC (or bonus SCs earned from promos) not count towards P1
or
b) 2700 QF/JQ SC earn to not include bonus SC's

Now they already made Loyalty Bonus SC's not count towards P1, but also bonus SC's not count towards "bonus reward" levels like 2400 PBR, or 5000+ P1BR levels so I could see either o the above occuring.

I enjoy P1 no question, but it's not as exclusive as it was. I wonder if the ranks of P1s have surged in the past year or two from the alleged 3k-5k members there were in the first few years of the program. I'd love to know.

QF probably has a budget to fund/run P1 which is tied back to a $ per member. The $ per member could be linked to a % of total average air profit per member. To maintain these ratios, the value of P1 members to Qantas (ticket revenue) would need to remain above $x per year.

So if DSC are pushing the average (ticket revenue) of P1 members down, it may affect budgeting to fund the P1 program.

Also may have an effect on retaining P1s who use the drop down to Plat as a way to justify 'spending up' into P1 for a year.

Of course - all guesses

 

[nutwood]

QF probably has a budget to fund/run P1 which is tied back to a $ per member. The $ per member could be linked to a % of total average air profit per member. To maintain these ratios, the value of P1 members to Qantas (ticket revenue) would need to remain above $x per year.

So if DSC are pushing the average (ticket revenue) of P1 members down, it may affect budgeting to fund the P1 program.

Also may have an effect on retaining P1s who use the drop down to Plat as a way to justify 'spending up' into P1 for a year.

Of course - all guesses

The $/member is an interesting point. I wonder how it works out with the various different paths to P1? My guess was that domestic J would be the way Qantas would like all P1's to qualify. 90 SYD to MEL @ $900/leg. However, once I thought about it, 180 flights in Flex @ $495/leg is an even better earner. Hmmm. How does the international score add up?

 

[trippin_the_rift]

The $/member is an interesting point. I wonder how it works out with the various different paths to P1? My guess was that domestic J would be the way Qantas would like all P1's to qualify. 90 SYD to MEL @ $900/leg. However, once I thought about it, 180 flights in Flex @ $495/leg is an even better earner. Hmmm. How does the international score add up?

ticket rev - variable cost in that fare class - admin = rough profit per ticket per pax. Pax value ratings have been around forever. Loyalty member propensity to spend up/%share of wallet$ is arguably a much more powerful and accurate measurement.

The airline could take xx% of that profit per pax and re-invest it into funding P1. So long as pax profitability remains above $x - everything is hunky dory. QF may also take a bell curve approach where they only want top 0.x% of active pax to have P1.

Depends on how the QF (airline) + (loyalty) strategy is for now and the future

 

[JessicaTam]

Loyalty member propensity to spend up/%share of wallet$ is arguably a much more powerful and accurate measurement.

I am sure I read something about that only recently!

 

[cove]

Mrscove has two paid for first class trips to the US on QF purely because the business class seat is so uncomfortable. She has a chance to make P1 again in this next year using DSCs rather than toughing it out on multiple flights.

 

[RichardMEL]

I have a trip to LHR next week. Seriously considering crediting to BAEC (well and opening an account with my London hotel address ) because QF give MH J sectors Y points/SC and BA do not. I mean it would be a tiny start. Problem is I just don't go where BA does enough to make it worthwhile for me to chase, but I agree with TH re BA's far more defined benefits (and they just upped the guests one can take into the lounge!) vs QF's wishy washy benefits that are far less defined, except upgrade priority and so on.

QF you know, it owuldn't hurt to give like a 125% status bonus or something. I mean come on dudes. throw us a bone!

 

[TonyHancock]

Problem is I just don't go where BA does enough to make it worthwhile for me to chase, but I agree with TH re BA's far more defined benefits (and they just upped the guests one can take into the lounge!) vs QF's wishy washy benefits that are far less defined, except upgrade priority and so on.

I think this is what it comes down to. I remember when the mASA was in full swing there were many here promoting the AA FF program, which was significantly better, in terms of benefits, than QF, but simply I could not make it work for me from whatever angle I looked at it. My travel patterns would not give me the benefits.

Whilst I bang on about BA there is no doubt that the QF program will remain the best for many simply because of their travel patterns, and QF know that which is why I suspect they pitch the benefits at the level that are. QFP1 has just enough to keep people interested when the alternatives don't really work. (I stuck at it for 4 years until it became clear BAEC would work much better for me on because of my travel patterns.)

With the closure of the GUF loophole at BA I am seriously considering SQ J, because if I continue with BA I will spend way too much time in Club World , but I am anticipating less than two more years of the regular AU-UK commutes so I am not sure whether I want to make the move at this late stage. BAEC has definitely got me in handcuffs because with my Avios stash and jokers I want to maximise redemptions when my paid work travel comes to an end.

Decision, decisions...and yes I am a victim of BA FF Stockholm Syndrome.

...and it is important to emphasise my discussion here is about BAEC and QFF not the airlines hard and soft products, just their FF programs.

 

[RichardMEL]

Could it be called BA "Slough Syndrome"?

Back to P1 and value of customers and their spend.. I'm sure it's far more refined than simplylooking at either direct ticket revenue($$) or more simply booking classes but also the far more important yield of tickets bought. - which sure, has a correlation back to fare clases, but obviously can provide more of a value to the business of how much money we make them as opposed to a total revenue figure which doesn't always provide the full picture when one wants to look at "value" of a customer to the business.

For example, if one looks at a long hauil destination and the spread of fares out there, you're likely to find fares in the same booking class, for example I for Discount/Sale business that cover a wide range of price points, and thus revenue. say a $5k base fare SYD-LAX up to an $7-8k fare.. still books into I, but hey presto, the one on the higher revenue fare gives QF fare more yield bot overall and for that particular sector.

So I am sure they look at all of our bookings and fare basis, and yield per trip and overall to work out our PCV (obviously it's far more complex)

And of course, this information ties into other things.. such as where to target us with promotions or offers - eg if I have a history of buying discounted J or PE fares but not full fares, then that says something about my habits as a customer and what things I may bite at or not. eg: there's probably no reason to send me cheap Y ticket offers to DPS, but there's possibly more reason to spam me with the current Premium Cabin sale fares, and possibly even attach a small promo, or in fact target a promo at a higher price point to see if I'd o for it. QF doesn't go that far (yet) that I have experienced, but this is the sort of thing all this information and technology is geared towards.

 

[trippin_the_rift]

Could it be called BA "Slough Syndrome"?

Back to P1 and value of customers and their spend.. I'm sure it's far more refined than simplylooking at either direct ticket revenue($$) or more simply booking classes but also the far more important yield of tickets bought. - which sure, has a correlation back to fare clases, but obviously can provide more of a value to the business of how much money we make them as opposed to a total revenue figure which doesn't always provide the full picture when one wants to look at "value" of a customer to the business.

For example, if one looks at a long hauil destination and the spread of fares out there, you're likely to find fares in the same booking class, for example I for Discount/Sale business that cover a wide range of price points, and thus revenue. say a $5k base fare SYD-LAX up to an $7-8k fare.. still books into I, but hey presto, the one on the higher revenue fare gives QF fare more yield bot overall and for that particular sector.

So I am sure they look at all of our bookings and fare basis, and yield per trip and overall to work out our PCV (obviously it's far more complex)

To passengers, loyalty is a membership card and a host of benefits that come along with your continued business.
To an airline - loyalty is a highly refined war machine. Loyalty revenues for some airlines (China Airlines recently released data) are over 40% of total group revenue. Don't let the "Qantas Loyalty" revenue or "Points Billings" deceive you - that number isn't a reflection of the total revenue attribution power of loyalty.

So I am sure they look at all of our bookings and fare basis, and yield per trip and overall to work out our PCV (obviously it's far more complex)

PCV is primitive - just like most of Amadeus's cough. QF Loyalty runs on IBS which is industry leading but still depends what else QF and other airlines tack on that integrates with the loyalty system. Cathay Pacific CEO recently spoke about how they're tracking when passengers recline their seats in business class. Cameras looking at passengers on IFE screens, tracking alcohol consumption by seat... as I said - it's a data war.

You might like this article I found - How airlines & hotels profit from your data

 

[nutwood]

Could it be called BA "Slough Syndrome"?

Back to P1 and value of customers and their spend.. I'm sure it's far more refined than simplylooking at either direct ticket revenue($$) or more simply booking classes but also the far more important yield of tickets bought. - which sure, has a correlation back to fare clases, but obviously can provide more of a value to the business of how much money we make them as opposed to a total revenue figure which doesn't always provide the full picture when one wants to look at "value" of a customer to the business.

I was considering this in terms of domestic flights and I'd have to say, flex flights must be an excellent earner for Qantas. The cost of providing is virtually identical to economy but the price can be several times that of economy.
I virtually always book flex because I often need to change flights at short notice. This is convenient to me, but doesn't really cost Qantas much. Probably, if I did the sums, I'd be better off booking cheapest every time and just sacrificing the occasional flight.

 

[Matt_01]

From the outset this maybe longer than my normal posts and will most likely turn into ramblings and a rant however after being a P1 for the past 4-5 years I have become seriously disillusioned with the program and borrowing some words of @TonyHancock I must have succumb to QF Stockholm Syndrome.

….. We, the road warriors (of one sort of another) know that P1 only seriously comeds into its own during irrops, which is something none of us want on a regular basis.

I enjoy P1 no question, but it's not as exclusive as it was. I wonder if the ranks of P1s have surged in the past year or two from the alleged 3k-5k members there were in the first few years of the program. I'd love to know.

Totally agree on the irrops, I also agree that P1 is not what it once was, 2-3 years back:

• I could go into the lounge and just asked to be upgraded and it was normally done on the spot without the need to use points.
• Sunday evening flights when you normally have to pay for a wine in Y it was handed out, not any more.
• Invites to events, from memory I have been invited to 4 or 5 none of which I could attend, however MrsM and MissM did go to the ballet 10 months ago as I did not have to be in attendance.
• The only event I was able to take part in was the simulator, but you don’t hear about this these days.
• About the only thing that I get value out of P1 is the commentary WP gifting deal.

As for the increase in P1 numbers I would suggest there has been. Based on the regular flights I have taken over the past 5 years there was usually only 1 seat occupied in R4 prior to T-80 and that was myself. In the past year R4 seats occupied prior to T-80 are averaging 3-4, these are just my observations. Also there seems to be an increasing number of the white coasters attached to luggage and laptop bags in the lounges these days.

The $/member is an interesting point. I wonder how it works out with the various different paths to P1? My guess was that domestic J would be the way Qantas would like all P1's to qualify. 90 SYD to MEL @ $900/leg. However, once I thought about it, 180 flights in Flex @ $495/leg is an even better earner. Hmmm. How does the international score add up?

If you are chasing status international is most likely cheaper, I received an email yesterday - J flights to NZ for $495, similar in price to a Y MEL-SYD but x4 times the amount of SCs. There are those on this site that do the status run thing and book all types of weird flights e.g. CNS-BNE-MEL-DPS in J return for around $2450 rtn which would net with DSCs 960 SCs. So in theory one could get P1 for around 10k but why bother. To me it is false economics, spend 10k to get better access to reward bookings in J and F on an airline that has higher fees and taxes and a product that at its best (787 and a330) is only just competitive with other tier one airlines.

I have a trip to LHR next week. Seriously considering crediting to BAEC (well and opening an account with my London hotel address

) because QF give MH J sectors Y points/SC and BA do not. I mean it would be a tiny start. Problem is I just don't go where BA does enough to make it worthwhile for me to chase, but I agree with TH re BA's far more defined benefits (and they just upped the guests one can take into the lounge!) vs QF's wishy washy benefits that are far less defined, except upgrade priority and so on.

QF you know, it owuldn't hurt to give like a 125% status bonus or something. I mean come on dudes. throw us a bone!

I almost went down this path in Jan and reached out to a couple of AFFers who are BAEC converts for some advice. I do not travel do not travel the BA routes outside of SYD-SIN and do not like the BA J product, however the new BA J does look good but who knows when this will be available on SYD-SIN.

If I knew them what I know now I would have jumped on board the BAEC quest 4-5 years back, put up with the minimum BA sectors and would most likely be within reach of BA LTG, hindsight is always 20/20.

…..Whilst I bang on about BA there is no doubt that the QF program will remain the best for many simply because of their travel patterns, and QF know that which is why I suspect they pitch the benefits at the level that are. QFP1 has just enough to keep people interested when the alternatives don't really work.… I am seriously considering SQ J, because if I continue with BA I will spend way too much time in Club World….

As much as I dislike QF at the moment they are the best option for my travel patterns mainly NZ, Asia and the US. I have been looking at other FF programs and their associated wider network. If AU only had a domestic carrier that was part of *A I would ditch QF in a heat beat and credit everything to SQ. All the places I travel are well serviced (direct) by *A carriers with the exception of HKG and as much as I dislike connecting I would entertain connecting through SIN to other Asian ports as PPS would be easily obtained and PPS Solitaire would not be out of reach. From what I understand being in the PPS club your SQ miles do not expire after three years. This is important as I earn more than I can use.

Now back to QF P1 things and a few other ramblings. Is QF on another or some new cost cutting regime? I thought I posted something a while back (12 months) but may have not. What is going on with the soup served and general meal quality on international J, the soup bowl and serving is small these days and if you want some more it needs to be selected as the main. Is it just smaller bowls, has portion size ben cut back or is it just me. Also is the food service and quality in J dom going south, Y seems to be about the same. As I recall QF seemed to go through a dark patch maybe 6-8 years ago but since picked up their game, now it seems that they are back on the slippery slope of despair.

I am a bit over QF at the moment and apologies for my rambling and rant.

 

[calmelb]

The only event I was able to take part in was the simulator, but you don’t hear about this these days.

I did get an invite for the simulator just after I had qualified (last year) so it does still happen however in my year of P1 I received 0 event invitations in total.

Also apart from in the lounge with hard benefits (better champagne for P1 for example) I have not received any special treatment because I am P1, just exactly the same as WP. Now some of this could be down to age as being young I do get overlooked as a status member. I remember a flight in QF F 2 years ago. I was WP my dad was NB and he was welcomed as the WP and got the special treatment (after my dad mentioned it was actually my status) whereas I got little to no recognition. This is less of an issue with P1 and more so an issue with the general discrimination about age and higher status.

 

[nutwood]

I did get an invite for the simulator just after I had qualified (last year) so it does still happen however in my year of P1 I received 0 event invitations in total.

Also apart from in the lounge with hard benefits (better champagne for P1 for example)

You get better champagne? How does that work? I appreciate the benefits of P1 but would struggle to list one hard benefit. Row 4 perhaps, shoulder to shoulder with other P1's? Nah, prefer Row 5, with my WP shadow next to me!

 

[Matt_01]

I did get an invite for the simulator just after I had qualified (last year) so it does still happen however in my year of P1 I received 0 event invitations in total.

Also apart from in the lounge with hard benefits (better champagne for P1 for example) I have not received any special treatment because I am P1, just exactly the same as WP. Now some of this could be down to age as being young I do get overlooked as a status member. I remember a flight in QF F 2 years ago. I was WP my dad was NB and he was welcomed as the WP and got the special treatment (after my dad mentioned it was actually my status) whereas I got little to no recognition. This is less of an issue with P1 and more so an issue with the general discrimination about age and higher status.

I am glad to hear that the simulator thing is still happening and I would suspect it is mainly offered to SYD based members. I had requested to be included on the invite list and it was SST who contacted me as I was travelling in and out of SYD at the time and they most likely joined the dots that I would be in SYD when there was an open spot.

As for your second paragraph it should not matter if you are young or older, if you are a P1 all should be treated the same however I get your point. I personally do not give any thought to age, race or gender, if you have the white card you should all be treated the same. To be honest, I do not expect to be treated differently to others when I am traveling - if you are in Y, J or F either paid, redemptions or upgrades you all got there in some way shape or form. What I take exception to is the QF marketing of the status benefits that are seldom realised.

Anyhow I am still ranting and between my last post and this one MrsM and MissM have informed me they want to go to Japan at Christmas so over the next couple of days I will ring QF, abuse my status, get x2 SYD-HND or KIX J rewards released and burn 288K QF points. My points burn is underway.

 

[Matt_01]

You get better champagne? How does that work? I appreciate the benefits of P1 but would struggle to list one hard benefit. Row 4 perhaps, shoulder to shoulder with other P1's? Nah, prefer Row 5, with my WP shadow next to me!

Better champagne, not quite, but not sparkling wine at HKG and SIN champagne is available to P1s. Also with R4 I prefer C or D and if at the time of booking A or F is taken I pick the seat in the same block. In recent experience but not always QF seem to be blocking the B and E seats.

 

[calmelb]

You get better champagne? How does that work? I appreciate the benefits of P1 but would struggle to list one hard benefit. Row 4 perhaps, shoulder to shoulder with other P1's? Nah, prefer Row 5, with my WP shadow next to me!

Better champagne, not quite, but not sparkling wine at HKG and SIN champagne is available to P1s. Also with R4 I prefer C or D and if at the time of booking A or F is taken I pick the seat in the same block. In recent experience but not always QF seem to be blocking the B and E seats.

Yeah I used the word champagne loosely, when I travel between Melbourne and London (via sin or per) it does make it nice during a layover that I can get French champagne instead of Australian sparkling (small benefit but I do appreciate it)

 

[calmelb]

I am glad to hear that the simulator thing is still happening and I would suspect it is mainly offered to SYD based members. I had requested to be included on the invite list and it was SST who contacted me as I was travelling in and out of SYD at the time and they most likely joined the dots that I would be in SYD when there was an open spot.

As for your second paragraph it should not matter if you are young or older, if you are a P1 all should be treated the same however I get your point. I personally do not give any thought to age, race or gender, if you have the white card you should all be treated the same. To be honest, I do not expect to be treated differently to others when I am traveling - if you are in Y, J or F either paid, redemptions or upgrades you all got there in some way shape or form. What I take exception to is the QF marketing of the status benefits that are seldom realised.

Interestingly enough after confirming the simulator I booked the flight to Sydney and then got a phone call suggesting the sim! Was a nice touch and we had a laugh on the phone when she realised.

Unfortunately I wish that were the case but I have noticed the CSM occasionally passing me by and having less of a chat for whatever reason. I do believe you should be recognised on board (eg the offer a drink from the J bar when travelling in Y, a proper welcome on board, etc), just a small gesture to recognise you during the flight

 

[Kangol]

Are the P1 events (not flight sim) usually on weekdays or weekends?