QFF Platinum requesting release of extra Classic Reward seats?

[ryanlphoto]

Good news re QF 26 - Can you remember if there were Biz Sale seats available for purchase for that flight?

I'm not sure to be honest! I didn't check that, I just saw in EF that there was an I class fare available so I called straight away to see if I could get it converted to a CR fare. I had low expectations so it was a pleasant surprise (it's the return leg of a trip I'm organising for my Dad for his 70th so he'll be happy to be in J!)

 

[RichardMEL]

I'm not sure to be honest! I didn't check that, I just saw in EF that there was an I class fare available so I called straight away to see if I could get it converted to a CR fare. I had low expectations so it was a pleasant surprise (it's the return leg of a trip I'm organising for my Dad for his 70th so he'll be happy to be in J!)

Sorry going to be a bit pedantic here but to clarify.

You saw I1 availability on the flight. That refers to inventory in the I "bucket" available for sale, not a fare per se.

Ie Various fare buckets can be available on a flight, but that doesn't mean that there are fares filed that book into those buckets.

This is why I contend that the lack of seeing, for example, Business Sale Fares, which usually do book into I inventory on QF is not a reliable guide to this sort of tging. There can be ample inventory with no fares available in amarket (and let's not get into connecting markets!), just as there can be fares filed in a market, but if there is zero inventory (eg I0) then there will be no sale fares available on that particular flight. Yes, existance of a fare showong that books into certain inventory bucket imples availability exists on an individual flight, but the inverse is not necessarily true.

I just feel we need to be careful when using the terms "fares" and "inventory" imo

/pedantic hat off .

 

[sudoer]

I'm not sure where the requirement for 'Business Sale' on the website has come from?

It's the inventory that matters, not whether fares are loaded/valid....

 

[ryanlphoto]

Sorry going to be a bit pedantic here but to clarify.

You saw I1 availability on the flight. That refers to inventory in the I "bucket" available for sale, not a fare per se.

Ie Various fare buckets can be available on a flight, but that doesn't mean that there are fares filed that book into those buckets.

This is why I contend that the lack of seeing, for example, Business Sale Fares, which usually do book into I inventory on QF is not a reliable guide to this sort of tging. There can be ample inventory with no fares available in amarket (and let's not get into connecting markets!), just as there can be fares filed in a market, but if there is zero inventory (eg I0) then there will be no sale fares available on that particular flight. Yes, existance of a fare showong that books into certain inventory bucket imples availability exists on an individual flight, but the inverse is not necessarily true.

I just feel we need to be careful when using the terms "fares" and "inventory" imo

/pedantic hat off .

Thanks Richard - totally agree and I will be more aware of this in future! I think inventory is a better term as it doesn't associate with certain fares being available (e.g sale fares)

 

[levelnine]

I'm not sure where the requirement for 'Business Sale' on the website has come from?

It's the inventory that matters, not whether fares are loaded/valid....

I imagine from the phone agents. I've had a number of agents, including HBA, describe it in those terms.

 

[ozflier]

I'm not sure where the requirement for 'Business Sale' on the website has come from?

It's the inventory that matters, not whether fares are loaded/valid....

As always thanks for your input.
Agents from Hobart have told me that there needs to be business sale fares available to be able to access an award release .

 

[RichardMEL]

I'm not sure where the requirement for 'Business Sale' on the website has come from?

It's the inventory that matters, not whether fares are loaded/valid....

Pretty much my point, but written succinctly

 

[sudoer]

Agents from Hobart have told me that there needs to be business sale fares available to be able to access an award release .

They're probably saying this for two reasons:

- avoids needing to explain the concept of airline inventory vs fares (beyond the assumed knowledge of those not in the industry)
- gives the average punter a way to check their chances themselves before calling in - they don't expect you to have access to GDS loads...

 

[Princess Fiona]

As always thanks for your input.
Agents from Hobart have told me that there needs to be business sale fares available to be able to access an award release .

I think agents from HBA are far more likely to be speaking to people who have absolutely zero idea what a fare class is, let alone how to find out the inventory.
I’d say this is the standard reply for hopefuls trying to snag an award release on J1

 

[ozflier]

Pretty much my point, but written succinctly

thanks again - Richard , when you say inventory , can I assume that the number of "I" fares available is what you are talking about in relation to likelihood of a release of award seats to a Platinum member.

 

[ozflier]

I think agents from HBA are far more likely to be speaking to people who have absolutely zero idea what a fare class is, let alone how to find out the inventory.
I’d say this is the standard reply for hopefuls trying to snag an award release on J1

I am surprised to hear that callers to Hobart are less knowledgable that the rest - since elites (usually) are the only ones able to access Hobart. Such elites would likely to be the more experienced travellers and had more experience with using rewards .
Am I missing something - could be an aged related thing !!

 

[sudoer]

I am surprised to hear that callers to Hobart are less knowledgable that the rest - since elites (usually) are the only ones able to access Hobart. Such elites would likely to be the more experienced travellers and had more experience with using rewards .
Aim i missing something - could be an aged related thing !!

There are plenty of elites out there who never book their own travel, and just hop on whatever flight their work has booked for them.

 

[Princess Fiona]

I am surprised to hear that callers to Hobart are less knowledgable that the rest - since elites (usually) are the only ones able to access Hobart. Such elites would likely to be the more experienced travellers and had more experience with using rewards .
Aim i missing something - could be an aged related thing !!

I am on a fairly large P1 group elsewhere and the level of knowledge amongst them would surprise most regulars on here.
Just because people fly enough to have status doesn’t mean they have any clue about the workings of the program or of bookings in general.

 

[RichardMEL]

thanks again - Richard , when you say inventory , can I assume that the number of "I" fares available is what you are talking about in relation to likelihood of a release of award seats to a Platinum member.

Pretty much yes.

For example, a GDS class availability display for a flight - such as you might get out of EF - shows available inventory for sale at the moment of the query

Eg

F9 A6 J9 C9 D2 I0 Y9 B9 H9 M9 K9....

With several caveats

1. This is the maximum number for sale in one transaction. It does not alwats reflect overall availability
2 some airlines restrict the max amount of inventory they will show in this way. Eg QF is 9, but AA is 7 typically
3 The totals are inclusive of lower subclasses for a cabin. Eg F and A for First, JCDI for Biz, Y and on for eco in the above example.
4. Noting point 3, you cannot read this as indicating seat totals eg F9 A6 does not mean 15 available in F. Someone could buy four "A" fares and it could drop to 65 A2 or F9 A2 depending on the actual availability and the YM rules for that flight. Conversely one could buy 8 C fares in the example above, and availability may not change at all(but probably would)
5. Again this reflects a point in time indication of what an airline is willing to sell in a single transaction. Due to legacy GDS limitations, the max display is 9. So there could be 48 seats actually free, but still show only 9s

so these are simply guides only in many respects. - just like occupied seats in a seat map doesn't mean those are the only booked ones, or rather unallocated may not represent actual available but can give an idea.

this is also why, to an extent, what QF will decide to approve or decline is not always strictly a cut and dried defined level. - as many anecdotal examples in this thread have amply proved.

This is how I understand it at least.

 

[RichardMEL]

I am surprised to hear that callers to Hobart are less knowledgable that the rest - since elites (usually) are the only ones able to access Hobart. Such elites would likely to be the more experienced travellers and had more experience with using rewards .
Aim i missing something - could be an aged related thing !!

Not really.

You can do a lot of travel and have high status but not have much knowledge (or care) of how it all goes together. Eg road warriors on company travel wouldnt likely see or care if it's a K fare or Y fare, or what that might mean. Some do of course, and those with an interest wind up in places like here.

Believe me, I've met Platinums who had no clue they could use premium check in and some other benefits, let alone knowing about seat requests or even how SCs work.

That's not a dig at them in any way. There's no reason for many to care. For some, travel is a chore and they really could care les and ithers don't want to know how the sausage is made.

Conversely I have chatted to HBA agents who seem surprised if I quite inventory or even quoute a PNR in phonetucs (and some have thanked me too!).

 

[ozflier]

Pretty much yes.

For example, a GDS class availability display for a flight - such as you might get outbof EF - shows available inventory for sale at the moment of the query

Eg

F9 A6 J9 C9 D2 I0 Y9 B9 H9 M9 K9....

With several caveats

1. This is the maximum number for sale in one transaction. It does not alwats reflect overall availability
2 some airlines restrict the max amount of inventory they will show in this way. Eg QF is 9, but AA is 7 typically
3 The totals are inclusive of lower subclasses for a cabin. Eg F and A for First, JCDI for Biz, Y and on for eco in the above example.
4. Noting point 3, you cannot read this as ondicating seat totals eg F9 A6 does not mean 15 available in F. Someone could buy four "A" fares and it could drop to 65 A2 or F9 A2 depending on the actual availability and the YM rules for that flight. Conversely one could buy 8 C fares in the example above, and availability may not change at all(but probably would)
5. Again this reflects a point in time indication of what an airline is willing to sell in a single transaction. Due to legacy GDS limitations, the max display is 9. So there could be 48 seats actually free, but still show only 9s

so these are simply guides only in many respects. - just like occupied seats in a seat map doesn't mean those are the only booked ones, or rather unallocated may not represent actual available but can give an idea.

this is also why, to an extent, what QF will decide to approve or decline is not always strictly a cut and dried defined level. - as many anecdotal examples in this thread have amply proved.

This us how I understand it at least.

Thanks.

 

[Warragul]

If there is I class available (understand it is bit more nuanced than this), is it viable for a WP to request a seat upgrade for non WP family member who gets put on the waiting list when they try to use points for an upgrade on a domestic flight?

 

[sudoer]

If there is I class available (understand it is bit more nuanced than this), is it viable for a WP to request a seat upgrade for non WP family member who gets put on the waiting list when they try to use points for an upgrade on a domestic flight?

No. P1 can apply for upgrades on behalf of family (with P1 priority) but WP cannot.

The benefit being discussed in this thread only relates to booking seats outright, not upgrade requests.

 

[RichardMEL]

If there is I class available (understand it is bit more nuanced than this), is it viable for a WP to request a seat upgrade for non WP family member who gets put on the waiting list when they try to use points for an upgrade on a domestic flight?

No. This (I class availability) is not relevant to upgrades. That requires QFto release U availability - and for international there is a set system of windows for when requests may be processed that varies by status level).

Further, a platinum requesting an upgrade for a family member has no priority benefit - the pax will still be assessed at tgeir status level (but points deducted from the requester's account of course).

 

[jbmemories]

Planning to get from PER to BCN and there's been a flight option (only cash left) for all the classes on QF9 (then BA codeshare onwards). Currently looking between 10 Aug - 15Aug (date not fixed yet). Question purely for this QF9 segment:

Is it better to purchase a cash ticket and then call to ask if classic reward upgrade is available? Or just best asking directly and booking with points? (Unsure which is 'cheaper)

If purchasing the cash ticket, can a economy ticket request a business class release or do I need to purchase PE to request business class?