Scottish Independence Referendum 18th September.

[Cool Cat Phil]

I have done a quick search & could not find a relevant thread to the upcoming Scottish Independence Referendum due to be held on Thursday 18th September 2014.

I'm thinking that a few Scottish ex-pats must live here on AFF & have some thoughts on the matter.

Maybe some English ex-pats want to share in their thoughts also.

Scotland is a an Amazing Country, full on rich culture, food, Spectacular scenery, Amazing people & of course fantastic Whiskey.

Will be an interesting Result & the debate no doubt will be vigorous.

For Information on the "Yes" perspective, head to:

Yes Scotland | Say Yes to an independent Scotland


For Information on the "No" perspective, head to:

Better Together: The patriotic all-party and non-party campaign for Scotland in the UK | Better Together

Thoughts anyone:?:

 

[RooFlyer]

Scots is my most recent ancestry (1880), proceeded by English and Irish; I've just published a book about my Scots line ...

I really hope the No vote will get up. The grass is always greener with independence, but I can't see how leaving Great Britain will materially help solve their main issues. A warm and fuzzy nationalist feeling will be great until it wears off. If the Scots do separate, I think the English taxpayers will have a bit of a different opinion about the 'shared resources' proposed in the independence model!

BTW, the Hanoverian kings on the throne at the time of amalgamation were no more English than they were Scottish!

 

[Princess Fiona]

In brief, I cannot vote but if I could I would vote against it.
Yes, I'm Scottish but I am also British and a British Citizen (and an Australian Citizen as well). I wouldn't vote for anything that would break up the Union.
I will be in Glasgow in the lead up to the vote, it's going to be an interesting time I think. Talking with a few folk back home, the Yes campaign is very vocal and some people are afraid to say that they are against independence for fear of causing offence or creating arguments.
Hopefully regardless of the result both sides of the political spectrum can work together for the good of not only the Scots but all other British people.

 

[samh004]

We need a politics forum, as I'm sure this could get heated.

I honestly think there will be no winners from this vote. It's the sort of issue that splits a nation. I'm dual nationality, but only lived in the UK briefly between 0 - 1.5 and 12 - 13 years for prep school. Considering my current university studies, studying arts and lots of cultural subjects, I'd hope the world was heading towards a breaking down of borders (EU example) rather than re-establishing them.

I haven't really been following the issue, though I'll probably grab my popcorn on the 18th/19th!

 

[777]

I'd hope the world was heading towards a breaking down of borders (EU example) rather than re-establishing them.

FWIW the trend is actually in the opposite direction: the world has more countries than it has ever had and is adding more all the time.

The EU itself at least 6 countries that didn't exist at the time of the original "common market" (Czech republic, Croatia, Slovakia, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia) and maybe a couple more. If anything, i think the existence of multi-national institutions like the EU make independence easier -- they set up protocols for borders, currencies, defence, financial integration and even redistributive taxation that make it easier for smaller countries to survive.

As for Scotland, i love the place and the people. I have no problem at all with it becoming an independent country but the decision is entirely up to the Scots -- many of whom passionately disagree with each other about the issue just now.

 

[Pushka]

If the Yes vote is successful then the Aussie Flag will be changed with the demise of the Union Jack.

 

[dk4]

We need a politics forum, as I'm sure this could get heated.

I was in a castle in Eastern Europe recently, where i bumped into an older married couple from Scotland. Anyway, in such an ancient setting I took the opportunity to ask them about it all, to help increase my understanding of the issues etc. She was totally against it, and he was completely for it, surely made for some interesting bed talk i thought to myself.

 

[amaroo]

Good Q - I'll have to ask my old man what he thinks.....he's a tough nut from Greenock.

 

[drron]

We were there in June.The yes case was certainly much more noticeable with stalls in shopping centres,billboards urging a yes vote and yes in house windows,on cars and even rocks in the field.
Like others I would hope for a No vote but unfortunately that will not settle the matter as the debate has stirred up those that want independence.
I have significant Scotch heritage from both sides of my family.My paternal grandmother was a Scot.Fiercely so.The family were Coventers.So the forebears fought with Robert the Bruce against the English but with the English against Bonnie Prince Charlie.Always picked the winning side!
The more things change the more they stay the same.

 

[Pushka]

More like cycles in life. What comes around goes around.

 

[Warks]

The question is "who gets the North Sea oil?" (what's left of it)

I'm thinking of the WA arguments in favour of secession here. Taxes from the east propped up WA for years (so it is said) before the mining boom started paying it back. I'm guessing the taxes from England have gone a long way to support Scotland over the years given the population disparity.

My (1/4 Scots) prediction is that the No vote will get up even though the Yes appears more powerful. That's the beauty of secret ballots.

Reminds me a bit of the Australian republic referendum (opens old can of worms).

 

[Pushka]

The republic referendum question was posed to ensure it's failure. What is the wording of the Scottish one?

 

[Princess Fiona]

The republic referendum question was posed to ensure it's failure. What is the wording of the Scottish one?

The Scottish one has been set up to maximise the chances of the Yes vote IMHO
The question is "Should Scotland be an Independent country?"
The voting age has been lowered from 18 years to 16 years and citizens (such as myself) who would be eligible to vote in a UK General election are ineligible to vote in the referendum. This also includes all ex-pat Scots living outside of Scotland in the rest of the UK.

 

[Pushka]

Thanks Princess and yes, clearly there is a Yes agenda. Heaven help us if WA ever posed this question.

 

[UP4014]

I think the oil issue remains in Londons hands, think of stability in the business world.

One thing already rumoured is the increased taxing of people more wealthy, so those people will consider leaving as one has told me he will.

As someone with a Scots background, I think it's a foolish move and wasn't that long ago they joined the Union because they were effectively a failing nation, memories are short these days with history, can't people read anymore. :shock:

Matt

 

[seanpodge]

If the Yes vote is successful then the Aussie Flag will be changed with the demise of the Union Jack.

Don't know about that. I thought that the argument was that the Union Jack was to represent our "historical heritage"(Non Brits excepted). The UK could possibly not even change their flag if the Yes campaign wins. For example Malaysia still kept 14 points on its federation star after Singapore became independent. I'd like to see a change to the Australian flag, but I can't see it happening in the current climate, especially with four years of Gallipoli commemorations coming up.

 

[Pushka]

Wishful thinking about the flag I guess. Still, we could always hoik up a NZ flag and no one would notice.

 

[JohnK]

It started off as tribes eventually united to form countries.

The empires came and left.

Now the countries want to be tribes again.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Thanks Princess and yes, clearly there is a Yes agenda. Heaven help us if WA ever posed this question.

I should say that I think the question being asked is a good one. It's plain Jane no-nonsense. What I disagree with is who is and who is not entitled to vote and the lies and misinformation being spread by both sides of the campaign.
I was talking to my mum tonight and she re-iterated that both her and my dad are pretty scared to comment in public that they will be voting no.
I hope that come Sep 18th there are a lot more people like them who will stand up and be counted.

 

[kelvedon]

The question is "who gets the North Sea oil?" (what's left of it)

They held an independence referendum in the 70s and "it's Scotland's oil" was a catchphrase then, but the Shetland islanders replied " it's not Scotland's oil, it's Shetlands oil"

I have been keeping half an eye on the campaigns, and it would seem the yes campaign has a few unanswered questions.

On currency, the rest of the U.K. (RUK) has said that an independent Scotland would not be allowed to continue to use the Pound as currency. The Yes campaign is saying it still would do so even without RUK's agreement (in the manner that Nicuragua uses the USD), but with no control over local interest rates, the new Scotish government would have limited fiscal independence.

The Yes campaign also wants to stay in the EU, but there is no guarantee this would be automatically accepted as any new State has to take the Euro as currency (politically unpopular), and have the agreement of all the other member states, which is unlikely as Spain would almost certainly object as it would not want to encourage the Catalonia Independence movement.

Scotland's financial sector is proportionally very large, and the big Pension fund companies would have to relocate much of their money and operations south of the border to remain in the UK where the majority of their clients are.

All the opinion polls so far have shown the No campaign to be leading, although the gap is narrowing. I don't think the campaign for independence will win as a Scotsman recently said to me that " the heart may say yes, but the head will say no"